Jump to content

AM on Int'l spending

Sports Guy

By Sports Guy
in Orioles Talk

Recommended Posts

JTrea81 Hangout Grand Counsel

JTrea81

Posted
Posted
Maybe this sinks in now that people see it coming out of your mouth...

Agreed, as I've been saying this for quite some time now...

We don't spend on premium FAs nor do we spend on draft and international signings, yet we are perfectly content to blow $20-30 million on mediocre players who don't make a difference and just fill a roster spot.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
  • Replies 155
  • Created
  • Last Reply
DrungoHazewood Hangout Grand Counsel

DrungoHazewood

Posted
Posted
Agreed, as I've been saying this for quite some time now...

We don't spend on premium FAs nor do we spend on draft and international signings, yet we are perfectly content to blow $20-30 million on mediocre players who don't make a difference and just fill a roster spot.

It appears that the only Orioles fan who doesn't agree on this point is Peter Angelos.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Frobby Hangout Grand Counsel

Frobby

Posted
Posted

I'm going to give the counterpoint here regarding the "mediocre free agents." First, I don't think baseball executives (at least ours, and many others) buy into the whole "wins above replacement" analysis and how many "wins" you can ascribe to a player. Anybody who watched the SS fiasco of 2008 would say that Cesar Izturis was a much better option. Anybody who watched our late August/September meltdowns of 2007-08 would tell you that there can be a pretty big difference between a below-average major league veteran pitcher (like Hendrickson) and guys like Rocky Cherry, Fernando Cabrera, Jim Hoey, etc. etc. So, cherry-picking a list of mediocre free agents who didn't earn what WAR says they were worth isn't necessarily a fair way to look at things. In any given year, I also could give you a list of mid-tier free agents who vastly exceeded their contracts. The Orioles just seem to be particularly poor (and in some cases, unlucky) at picking the right guys.

Now that I have said all that -- I basically agree that if I were Orioles' GM, I woul allocate more of the total budget to amateur talent acquisition, scouting and development. (of course, it would be nice to have some actual numbers to work with in terms of what the Orioles spend in those areas compared to other teams).

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Stotle Hangout Grand Counsel

Stotle

Posted
Posted
I'm going to give the counterpoint here regarding the "mediocre free agents." First, I don't think baseball executives (at least ours, and many others) buy into the whole "wins above replacement" analysis and how many "wins" you can ascribe to a player. Anybody who watched the SS fiasco of 2008 would say that Cesar Izturis was a much better option. Anybody who watched our late August/September meltdowns of 2007-08 would tell you that there can be a pretty big difference between a below-average major league veteran pitcher (like Hendrickson) and guys like Rocky Cherry, Fernando Cabrera, Jim Hoey, etc. etc. So, cherry-picking a list of mediocre free agents who didn't earn what WAR says they were worth isn't necessarily a fair way to look at things. In any given year, I also could give you a list of mid-tier free agents who vastly exceeded their contracts. The Orioles just seem to be particularly poor (and in some cases, unlucky) at picking the right guys.

Now that I have said all that -- I basically agree that if I were Orioles' GM, I woul allocate more of the total budget to amateur talent acquisition, scouting and development. (of course, it would be nice to have some actual numbers to work with in terms of what the Orioles spend in those areas compared to other teams).

I don't care if Baltimore spends 10% of what the rest of the AL East spends as long as they are at minimum keeping up with the pack, and preferably outdoing them on the amateur talent acquisition front.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
DrungoHazewood Hangout Grand Counsel

DrungoHazewood

Posted
Posted
So, cherry-picking a list of mediocre free agents who didn't earn what WAR says they were worth isn't necessarily a fair way to look at things. In any given year, I also could give you a list of mid-tier free agents who vastly exceeded their contracts. The Orioles just seem to be particularly poor (and in some cases, unlucky) at picking the right guys.

With the Orioles it's not really cherry picking. Without doing a big data dig, I'm assuming that 80%+ of $4M-$8M type free agents they sign don't even come close to returning good value. Although that may be the case for the entire league. The middle of the free agent class is fraught with danger.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Frobby Hangout Grand Counsel

Frobby

Posted
Posted
With the Orioles it's not really cherry picking. Without doing a big data dig, I'm assuming that 80%+ of $4M-$8M type free agents they sign don't even come close to returning good value. Although that may be the case for the entire league. The middle of the free agent class is fraught with danger.

I seem to remember you doing a pretty big data dig on this subject (or linking to some article that did) several years ago -- maybe at around the time we signed Huff, Baez, Walker and Bradford.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Go to topic listing


  • Posts

    • foxfield
      JD Martinez

      By foxfield · Posted

      What you want is perfectly reasonable.  But you seem entirely to focused on money.  The team needs to work to improve.  I don't care what it costs, you shouldn't either.  They are going to spend money and payroll will be higher next year and the year after that.  We need them to make improvements and some of that is rightfully going to come from within and not cost much. The improvements that are needed are going to cost too, I'm not saying they wont.  But ownership and the GM should simply work in tandem to make sure the team has what it needs.  I am not really concerned about how much that costs because it should be able to be done without jumping this particular team into say top ten in payroll.
    • casadeozo
      JD Martinez

      By casadeozo · Posted

      This is the right approach. the orioles should be spending more money and I believe they will, but I expect it to be measured with less risk (ie we won’t be handing out a Hader type deal or a  long term contract to Santander IMO) improving on some of the obvious weaknesses certainly makes sense.    1x SP: Burnes, Fried, Buehler 1x RH OF/DH: Martinez, O’Neill, Profar 1x 1B: (wishlist) Alonso, Walker
    • Aristotelian
      Hyde: No Idea if Suarez Will Be Back

      By Aristotelian · Posted

      Interesting. I had forgotten that they signed him and then got him in the pitching lab in the offseason. Since September is prior to the end of the season, I would take "two year contract" to mean September '23 is Year 1, and then '24 is Year 2.  That is a cool article. Very encouraging how closely they are following the KBO. 
    • Aglets
      2024 Week 5: Ravens @ Bengals

      By Aglets · Posted

      I think most teams would want to have an MVP candidate at quarterback.   Most of the time this will mean that he is better than the guy they currently have.  That's why. My quote was not taking salary into account.  If you take his current salary into account I think you are still talking about a majority of the NFL teams that would take him right now.  If the salary is an issue you find a way to make it work.  I'm starting to come around to the idea that the salary cap is kinda fake in a way after I keep seeing teams do stuff like adding void years other trickery to get the guys they want.
    • Sports Guy
      2024 Ravens regular season discussion

      By Sports Guy · Posted

      Well I sort of disagree here. You said guys have been bad to questionable. I think that’s wrong. I just think a few guys have been awful and that has really hurt us. I would absolutely give Washington more time. Brade and Kane are well liked but doubtful they want to play them much right now. A trade should be considered if things don’t improve.
    • OriolesMagic83
      Hyde: No Idea if Suarez Will Be Back

      By OriolesMagic83 · Posted

      Yeah, I'd rather keep him over Soto.  I mean Soto can't start.  Yes Soto was dominant at times out of the bullpen but he was also gasoline on a fire out of the bullpen.  I would rather pay Suarez $4 or 5 million, knowing he can start or pitch in the bullpen than Soto, knowing he can only start and is liable to melt down when needed most.  
    • Spy Fox
      JD Martinez

      By Spy Fox · Posted

      It is funny how much Hays (the pre-2024 version anyway) matches the type of player they'll likely look for. I doubt that reunion happens though. 

  • Popular Contributors

×
×
  • Create New...