For What it's worth.....

[Crazysilver03]

The Marquis talk is very scary, IMO, unless the Cubs pick up a substantial amount of that contract - or at least the difference between Marquis and Payton. I am not a Marquis fan at all.

Excluding Marquis, it would seem that the deal is getting signifcantly better than what has been discussed most of the winter if Payton does get sent away.

If the Orioles/Cubs really want to offset this unbalance, I would think a way to do that is trade them Payton AND Baez for Marquis. That offsets the salaries, while removing two contracts for the Orioles. It is still the same amount of money.

[Sports Guy]

The cubs don't really need marquis. Carlos Zambrano, Ted Lilly and Rich Hill are guaranteed spots in their rotation. Ryan Dempster, Jon Lieber, Jason Marquis and Sean Marshall and to a lessor extent Kevin Hart are battling for the other two spots. So in short, they have options and it seems like they are leaning towards Dempster and Lieber as they don't want three lefties in the rotation, as I think Marshall and Lieber would probably be the best option. Speaking of Marshall, I am surprised more O's fans don't want him. He is good. I think the reason the cubs don't want him in the rotation is that Ted Lilly, Rich Hill and Marshall are very similar pitchers. They are looking for some variety in the rotation from the right hand side.

If by good you mean really bad, i agree with you.

[Fairfax Bird]

If by good you mean really bad, i agree with you.

Come on man, Marshall isn't that bad. His peripherals might not look good, but he has gotten better results than many of our young guys, albeit against the inferior NL.

[Sports Guy]

I could see us wanting Marquis because of how they still apparently want another vet starter for some stupid reason.

[Sports Guy]

Come on man, Marshall isn't that bad. His peripherals might not look good, but he has gotten better results than many of our young guys, albeit against the inferior NL.

Marquis, not Marshall.

And Marquis's peripherals are awful and would likely get killed over here.

[Insomniac]

I have said we should include 2 million or so for Payton. Payton shouldn't cost us players but we should have to give some money.

Marquis is terrible and he has been in the NL...He would be lucky to have a 5 ERA in the AL.

I'm not sure that I agree with this. Marquis is only 29. He's made at least 32 starts, and has basically pitched 200 innings in each of the last 4 years. Yes, he'll have an ERA over 4.5 in the AL East, and yes he'll have a high WHIP and give up more than his share of HRs.

But ignoring for a moment the money, shouldn't we much rather have a Marquis in our rotation instead of a guy like Trachsel? IMO, there is little chance that Trachsel starts as many games and pitches as many innings as Marquis could for the Os this year.

As for Marquis' contract, I don't care how much of PA's money he collects in 2008 and 2009, as long as he starts 32 games, pitches 200 innings, and wins 10-12 games each year. Would I care if its my money? Sure -- but its not.

I also think that Marquis is a much better candidate to get traded in July for prospects (even with his bloated contract), than a guy like Trachsel.

I'm still very skeptical that there is really a good deal to be had with the Cubs for Roberts, but giving up Payton and taking back Marquis and his contract if the other parts of the deal are okay would be fine with me.

[davearm]

Marquis, not Marshall.

And Marquis's peripherals are awful and would likely get killed over here.

You may be talking about Marquis, but the post you replied to was not.

Junny called Marshall good.

[Junny]

Marshall had a sub 4 era in 19 starts last year and was doing the same in 2006 until he came back from an injury to early. I guess I would have to disagree that he is bad, especially considering that he is a young lefty. His biggest problem is that he seems to go 5 or 6 innings, but they were working on building his stamina.

[owl]

Speaking of Marshall, I am surprised more O's fans don't want him. He is good.

If by good you mean really bad, i agree with you.

2007: 3.92 ERA, 1.38 WHIP, 119 ERA+

Minor league career: 2.62 ERA, 1.14 WHIP, 298 K / 93 BB in 305 IP

Just downright terrible! I'd post more of the numbers involved but why bother? He's really bad.

[Junny]

Thanks for the support Owl. I am all for not overvaluing guys, but to call Marshall bad is odd to me.

[brvn52]

Ok. So say the final offers are in and these are the 2 offers, which do you take?

Roberts and Payton for Gallagher, Cedeno, Veal, EPat, Marquis and $10 million

Roberts and Olson for Barfield, Peralta, and Marte

[redwhitenblue]

Marquis, not Marshall.

And Marquis's peripherals are awful and would likely get killed over here.

While I do hate Marquis and can understand why you don't want him, you may be able to steal him and move him midseason for a MUCH better price

Marquis' first half '07 he posted a 3.67 ERA, his second half he sucked-it's actually a trend he has

The last 3 years Marquis has a pre-AS break ERA over a full run lower than his post AS Break, and 3 of his last 4 years he's been a league average or better pitcher overall(ERA+) and every year but '06 (of those 4) he's had a good ERA at the AS Break (sub 4)

If the O's were to get him, they could easily trade him at midseason for a better haul

[Crazysilver03]

Ok. So say the final offers are in and these are the 2 offers, which do you take?

Roberts and Payton for Gallagher, Cedeno, Veal, EPat, Marquis and $10 million

Roberts and Olson for Barfield, Peralta, and Marte

I would take the Cubs deal. Dumping Payton would be nice as well. The hull for Roberts would be nice, two pitchers, a SS, and a 2B.

In the Cleveland deal, we would have to keep all three on the 25 man roster and that would lead to a serious roster crunch as well.

[davearm]

Seriously. The Cubs are like his ex-girlfriend that he can't stop drunk dialing.

The problem is, nobody else is answering the phone (unless you believe these clandestine Indians talks are real).

[davearm]

While I do hate Marquis and can understand why you don't want him, you may be able to steal him and move him midseason for a MUCH better price

Marquis' first half '07 he posted a 3.67 ERA, his second half he sucked-it's actually a trend he has

The last 3 years Marquis has a pre-AS break ERA over a full run lower than his post AS Break, and 3 of his last 4 years he's been a league average or better pitcher overall(ERA+) and every year but '06 (of those 4) he's had a good ERA at the AS Break (sub 4)

If the O's were to get him, they could easily trade him at midseason for a better haul

I'm going to go out on a limb here and predict that the folks who are actually employed as GMs in MLB have access to this type of information too.