Who from our farm would net Manny?

[TonySoprano]

3 hours ago, Frobby said:

I was really looking at the trade in terms of prospect value, not in terms of batter vs. pitcher or what position.   We simply don’t have a pitcher in our system as highly rated as those three, though if Harvey proves he’s healthy, he’d be almost as valuable as Hays and more valuable than the other two.   I do think whatever trade we actually do is likely to be headlined by a pitcher, precisely because we already have a Hays, a Sisco and a Mountcastle.    But if there were a Hays-level middle infielder coming back as the headliner, I might have to bite if there was still a decent pitching prospect in the mix.   

Also, that "Hays-level middle infielder" could be flipped for the pitching to a third team.

Two team trades are so dull...

[weams]

3 hours ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

For 1 year of Manny--not happening.

Happening. 

[foxfield]

4 hours ago, Frobby said:

I was really looking at the trade in terms of prospect value, not in terms of batter vs. pitcher or what position.   We simply don’t have a pitcher in our system as highly rated as those three, though if Harvey proves he’s healthy, he’d be almost as valuable as Hays and more valuable than the other two.   I do think whatever trade we actually do is likely to be headlined by a pitcher, precisely because we already have a Hays, a Sisco and a Mountcastle.    But if there were a Hays-level middle infielder coming back as the headliner, I might have to bite if there was still a decent pitching prospect in the mix.   

So...the Yankees....again...I say lets roll.

[BohKnowsBmore]

3 hours ago, RZNJ said:

All it would take to get Manny would be Hays + one other player.    You don't even have to include Harvey.

 

It could be Hays and Akin.   Hays and Scott.    Whatever.    Wouldn't you take a top 50 prospect with 6 years of control on the cheap for a player you are going to lose at the end of the year for a supplemental pick (which the odds are against being anything significant at the ML level)?

If you expect more, you will be disappointed.    I think you might be able to get Flaherty + Gyrko or Wong from the Cardinals.   You won't do much better than that.  You might get some lower level (15-30) on their top 30 list.

The original leaked offer included Wacha but that was not a formal offer.   The Cardinals wanted the negotiating window.   Now if the Cardinals want Manny bad enough (I hope so but I don't count on it) they might include Wacha in the deal but I think that is the very best we'll do.   

That would be the two pitchers Duquette insists he needs to get back.    I would not even be surprised if Duquette has to add something to get that deal.

You say this and its a valid opinion, but part of me feels like if the situation were reversed, you would say that Hays+ wouldn't be enough to get Machado for a year.  This isn't a critique of you, rather the general zeitgeist of the board.

[BohKnowsBmore]

6 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

Maybe you missed some of my posts.   I think a lot of folks are overly optimistic about what we are going to get back.    In fact, I just predicted, that is if it ever becomes public, that the White Sox offer is something like Carson Fulmer, Tim Anderson, and a middling pitching prospect.    Anderso was a top 50 prospect a couple of years ago and Hays is that right now but without the luster rubbed off just yet.     If someone offered me a prospect like Hays and a decent pitching prospect, I think that would be better than taking a draft pick at the end of the year.    Some people's impressive (maybe Fulmer/Anderson/prospect) might be someone else's "are you kidding?".

Again, as I said, this isn't really a critique of you.  I certainly missed your posts.

It just seems that overwhelmingly the attitude is that when we're looking to trade for someone nobody in our farm system is enough, but when we are discussing dealing one of our guys, no team would offer much.  Seems to be a bit of cognitive dissonance broadly.

And I do realize some folks think we can deal Flash, 2 B- prospects and tommy hunter for a stud player.  I'm ignoring those folks in this.

[Danger Zone]

On ‎12‎/‎16‎/‎2017 at 11:04 AM, phillyOs119 said:

I guarantee the O's won't get a prospect package comparable to Hays, Harvey, Scott, Reyes for Machado.

 A comparable offer from the Cards would look like this, Harrison Bader, Junior Fernandez, Austin Gomber, and Yairo Munoz.

Also in this exercise, just like the O's the Cardinals would not want another OF prospect that is MLB ready. So I wouldn't see them having much interest in Hays.

I think the O's end up getting a lot more than that for Machado.

[Luke-OH]

7 minutes ago, Danger Zone said:

 A comparable offer from the Cards would look like this, Harrison Bader, Junior Fernandez, Austin Gomber, and Yairo Munoz.

Also in this exercise, just like the O's the Cardinals would not want another OF prospect that is MLB ready. So I wouldn't see them having much interest in Hays.

I think the O's end up getting a lot more than that for Machado.

Hays is a better prospect than any of the Cardinals except Reyes, I wouldn't be surprised if the Cardinals would be willing to trade Harrison Bader, Junior Fernandez, and Austin Gomber for Hays.  You'll see Hays ranked as high as the top 30 when top 100 lists come out.  This isn't me being a homer, I follow prospects pretty seriously.

[Luke-OH]

3 hours ago, Danger Zone said:

 A comparable offer from the Cards would look like this, Harrison Bader, Junior Fernandez, Austin Gomber, and Yairo Munoz.

Also in this exercise, just like the O's the Cardinals would not want another OF prospect that is MLB ready. So I wouldn't see them having much interest in Hays.

I think the O's end up getting a lot more than that for Machado.

http://clubhousecorner.com/2017/12/15/top-32-mlb-prospects-2018/

Hays is #24 on this recently released list, no Cardinals were on the top 32 or the 32 others considered.  Not that I think this is a perfect list, but just wanted to show that it's not just my opinion.

[weams]

12 hours ago, phillyOs119 said:

http://clubhousecorner.com/2017/12/15/top-32-mlb-prospects-2018/

Hays is #24 on this recently released list, no Cardinals were on the top 32 or the 32 others considered.  Not that I think this is a perfect list, but just wanted to show that it's not just my opinion.

Thank you. We knew you would be correct.