What should the Orioles do at catcher?

[Ohfan67]

I think the Orioles will add a low cost veteran. Sisco’s defense was always suspect and his 2018 screams “bust”. Susac and Wynns are good backup options for the Orioles and Wynns may  provide a little more than that for a few years with luck, but I think the Orioles will add a catcher with a little higher probability of performing closer to league average or better in 2019. 

[wildcard]

3 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

You recent arguments don't reflect it.

Seems to me you found the quote from Bundy and shifted gears to experienced versus inexperienced because the Bundy quote better supported that argument.

 

Bundy response is: Very I think. Caleb knows pretty much every hitter in the league right now. 

So Bundy says how important it is for a catcher to know the hitters in the league which is what I  said from the beginning of this thread.  I told you Bundy would not agree with your point that  video is enough.

Bundy goes on from there.

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, Ohfan67 said:

I think the Orioles will add a low cost veteran. Sisco’s defense was always suspect and his 2018 screams “bust”. Susac and Wynns are good backup options for the Orioles and Wynns may  provide a little more than that for a few years with luck, but I think the Orioles will add a catcher with a little higher probability of performing closer to league average or better in 2019. 

I don't see the appeal of Susac.

 

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, wildcard said:

Bundy response is: Very I think. Caleb knows pretty much every hitter in the league right now. 

So Bundy says how important it is for a catcher to know the hitters in the league which is what I  said from the beginning of this thread.  I told you Bundy would not agree with your point that  video is enough.

Bundy goes on from there.

That video is one player talking up a team mate.

It is not nearly enough to base an argument on.  You can think whatever you want, no one is stopping you.  But if you want to convince anyone that doesn't already agree with you you need to do better.

[El_Duderino]

The entire pitching staff has been historically bad for the better part of two years. I give no blame to Joseph for this, just as I certainly give him no credit for keeping it from being worse. He is a replacement level guy - as close to a non factor as it gets. 

[TouchemAll]

Draft one with the 1st pick

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, wildcard said:

Well according to Can of Corn's approach what Bundy should have said is:

Well I have been in the league for 3 years.  I know the hitters.  And with all the video we have I don't think a veteran catcher is that important .  Wynns and Sisco would do just fine this year.

But he didn't say that.  Not at all.  He emphasized the importance on a having a veteran catcher.

I think it has some value, if the guy is actually good at his job.    But the O’s did pretty well with Caleb at catcher in 2014 when he had zero major league experience.   The 2010 Giants won the World Series when Buster Posey was a rookie.   So, I think it’s a bit overrated.    

[Jammer7]

Why spend much above minimum for a catcher this year? I mean, you could get Jason Varitek in his prime and we’ll still lose 100 games. For the record, count me completely against bringing back Caleb Joseph. Nice guy and all, and he did give a testicle for the O’s, but time to move on from the worst offensive player in MLB. I would rather have Audry Perez behind the plate for the O’s this year than Caleb Jospeh. 

The O’s need to spend quite a bit of money on infrastructure, international scouting, facilities and player development. That money needs to come from savings on the MLB salary side. 

I would say go with who we have and see if the new coaching staff can help them become the players they are capable of being. (Tipping my hat to Mr. Showalter) Meanwhile, look for opportunities that are inexpensive. Maybe look for someone who is blocked or in need of another opportunity to break out. The improved analytics will aid the catchers with what digits to put down and for what location. Wynns will do a fine job as the regular guy. 

We are going to be in last place and have the top pick or two in the 2020 draft. Save money where you can. 

[Jammer7]

50 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I don't see the appeal of Susac.

 

He has talent, but that fella is snake-bitten. On the other hand, if he can ever break away from that reputation, and stay healthy, I saw enough that makes me think he can do enough to be above replacement. And for a likely 100 loss team, I’m good with that.

He’s exactly the kind of guy we should be looking for. A guy who just needs a chance to blossom. The tools were certainly there just a short time ago.

[Aglets]

Seems simple to me.  Draft one #1 overall.   Just put some cheap vet there until he's ready.  Maybe see if there's some magic pixie dust we can sprinkle on Sisco.

[panick]

If a veteran catcher was such a big help to pitchers, I wonder how many home runs Bundy would have given up without Joseph behind the plate. 

I think the O's should play the catchers they have now, if for no other reason than to see if either can even be a back-up in the future. Some of you are acting like getting a veteran catcher is the key for the O's to make the playoffs. I thought this team was in a rebuild. It's likely that there will be an all-rookie OF, a Rule 5 guy at SS, a questionable 3B, maybe a rookie at 2B(if Villar is traded like some of you want), and Davis at 1B(for money reasons I don't know if management will have the guts to keep him on the bench). This season seems to be one for tryouts at certain positions, so why not include catcher?

If neither Sisco or Wynns  prove they are worth being starting catchers by draft time, then the decision of who to take with the first pick is very easy. 

[wildcard]

46 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I think it has some value, if the guy is actually good at his job.    But the O’s did pretty well with Caleb at catcher in 2014 when he had zero major league experience.   The 2010 Giants won the World Series when Buster Posey was a rookie.   So, I think it’s a bit overrated.    

My point is the Bundy from his comments says the having a veteran catcher that knows the AL hitters is valuable.

[Just Regular]

Chris Davis's .239 wOBA was 22 points worse than next to last among qualified hitters on Fangraphs leaderboards. 

But the Red Sox gave 550+ catcher PA's to Vazquez and Leon, who together were even worse.  Considering Benintendi's iconic catch memorializing us 61 games behind, it's a little mindboggling that Orioles 1B wasn't enough the worst hitting position on the two teams.

All of which is saying that to me, catcher valuation is maybe an area modern front offices are farther ahead of the general public.  This is one where I'm more on the side of the seesaw where I believe the new FO will have some kind of sound process, including assessing Sisco and Wynns and how much opportunity they really deserve.

On the other side of the coin, it is a little fun to go full psychobabble and imagine that if Rutschmann is trending towards new franchise player and middle of the lineup fixture after 2021's Super Two date, nobody has the experience of what that means in Baltimore at the bottom than Matt Wieters.

[wildcard]

1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

That video is one player talking up a team mate.

It is not nearly enough to base an argument on.  You can think whatever you want, no one is stopping you.  But if you want to convince anyone that doesn't already agree with you you need to do better.

Wrong video.  This is the video( film) I was talking about.

Can of Corn:

Quote

Between players regularly changing leagues and the amount of film available I don't think league familiarity should be a huge concern.

Bundy thinks think a veteran catcher who know the AL hitter is valuable.

[Frobby]

4 minutes ago, wildcard said:

My point is the Bundy from his comments says the having a veteran catcher that knows the AL hitters is valuable.

I would expect Bundy to say that, since (1) it’s obvious that having experience with the hitters has some value, and (2) it’s the rote answer to give when the question is framed that way.    I still think it’s a bit overrated, especially in today’s game where the front office can provide information that is often as good or better than what the veteran catcher has learned through experience.