Brian Roberts

[interloper]

12 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I don’t think too badly of either one of them.    Obviously BRob was here much longer, and he was a home grown player.    I identify him as an Oriole and think that’s why he comes up more often on this site.   

As to Miggy, didn’t he essentially cop to using steroids?    He plead guilty to lying to Congress.   Of course, that was a couple of years after the Mitchell Report came out.  

Me neither! Seem like ok dudes. They got caught up in some dumb stuff during some dark times and that's unfortunate. 

You may be right on Miggy, actually. It's all pretty fuzzy at this point. For some reason, though, the Roberts thing remains VERY clear in folks' minds. And as best as I can tell it's because he didn't stay healthy, and people feel like they're owed something. And this is something I've said on this board for years - if you feel like a baseball player owes you something and it makes you upset that he didn't stay healthy/say a thing/didn't say a thing/didn't come to fanfest/didn't shake your hand/didn't give you an autograph, you should reevaluate some things in your life. This is obviously not directed at you, Frob.

[24fps]

36 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Really?

You?

I don't average even one a year and I'm way more confrontational.

Not even one a year?  Well, you're not doing it right.  Here's a tip - the next time a poster starts to get on your nerves, check to see if he's a limited posting member with a ton of posts and years of tenure.  If the answer is yes, then suggest in passing that it wouldn't hurt if he'd shoot a couple of bucks Tony's way every now and then, then stand back.  Works every time.

[Il BuonO]

6 hours ago, interloper said:

Fair, though still not a reason to be *angry* at a player. He didn't know it would eventually cause a concussion, nor did he know he was susceptible. It was a silly bad habit, of which we all have many. Not gonna act like it's something to hold against the guy's character, because it's obviously not. 

I would ask folks to consider how Tejada is thought of versus how Roberts is thought of. One guy admitted to using steroids, one did not. One guy gets dragged under the bus repeatedly by O's fans, one is mostly forgotten at this point. I find it weird. To me that says it's not about the steroids - it's mostly about the amount of time spent on the DL and the throw-away Yankee line. That's sad to me, that O's fans would think so poorly of a person simply for not being injured.

I never said I was angry with him, nor was I holding onto it or claiming he was of low character. He made some poor choices, most people have at least made some mistakes they regret.

I’ll go you one further, I actually liked Roberts’ style of play. Made the most of the ability he had. 

I also enjoy him now as an analyst on the radio.

 

 

[weams]

9 hours ago, Il BuonO said:

I never said I was angry with him, nor was I holding onto it or claiming he was of low character. He made some poor choices, most people have at least made some mistakes they regret.

I’ll go you one further, I actually liked Roberts’ style of play. Made the most of the ability he had. 

I also enjoy him now as an analyst on the radio.

 

 

I am pretty much in step with this take. 

I like plenty of guys who have used PEDs. 

 

[Jammer7]

Brian was a favorite of mine, when he was healthy. What a shame he had concussion issues. He and Markakis were an absolute joy to watch when they were in their prime. Brian was one of the most dangerous leadoff men in the game for 4-5 years. And then, it’s like he just disappeared. 

As far as the PED’s, he was seemingly very honest. I have a lot of respect for someone in his position owning up to what he has done and apparently discontinued the use of them. The pressure was, and really still is, tremendous for these guys to get any edge they can. And the league was ambivalent about the usage of such things as the money kept rolling in. That said, he and guys like Giambi and such who came clean, I forgive. Guys like McGwire, Bonds, David Ortiz and Clemens, I have great disdain for. Not only have they been dishonest about it, they continued to do it after the “crackdown” by the league. Yeah, it’s natural for David Ortiz to have his bat speed regenerate in his late 30’s and early 40’s. Wink, wink...it’s a great story because he was the face of a Red Sox team that won three WS titles. And he’ll be in the HOF.

Just win, baby. Integrity matters not. And that blows.

[Frobby]

2 minutes ago, Jammer7 said:

That said, he and guys like Giambi and such who came clean, I forgive. Guys like McGwire, Bonds, David Ortiz and Clemens, I have great disdain for.

I wouldn’t say Giambi was very forthcoming, until he was put under penalty of perjury in a grand jury.   

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sfgate.com/sports/amp/Giambi-admitted-taking-steroids-2631890.php

And then he apologized to the fans without saying what for.  

https://www.nytimes.com/2005/02/11/sports/baseball/a-careful-apology-from-giambi.html

I don’t see McGwire as any worse than that.   He eventually came clean.   

http://www.espn.com/mlb/news/story?id=4816607

[Jammer7]

30 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I wouldn’t say Giambi was very forthcoming, until he was put under penalty of perjury in a grand jury.   

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sfgate.com/sports/amp/Giambi-admitted-taking-steroids-2631890.php

And then he apologized to the fans without saying what for.  

https://www.nytimes.com/2005/02/11/sports/baseball/a-careful-apology-from-giambi.html

I don’t see McGwire as any worse than that.   He eventually came clean.   

http://www.espn.com/mlb/news/story?id=4816607

Well, the Giambi article is excellent. Not what my memory was, thanks. I suppose it was that he came out when he did, and I didn’t remember all of the circumstances surrounding it.

And yes, McGwire came out, much much later. The damage was done by then, for me anyway. All of this is so personal and subjective. Just as our thoughts on BRob.

Generally, I am over the whole thing. I get why these guys have cheated, not to mention committed felonies, but it doesn’t completely excuse it. And the HOF no longer matters to me. I could not care less who does or does not get in. The older I get, the less I reflect on the numbers they put up. I am more so a fan of the people, and how they persevere and conduct themselves in and out of public view. That is why I am a baseball fan. The culture, not the show. 

[weams]

9 hours ago, Jammer7 said:

Well, the Giambi article is excellent. Not what my memory was, thanks. I suppose it was that he came out when he did, and I didn’t remember all of the circumstances surrounding it.

And yes, McGwire came out, much much later. The damage was done by then, for me anyway. All of this is so personal and subjective. Just as our thoughts on BRob.

Generally, I am over the whole thing. I get why these guys have cheated, not to mention committed felonies, but it doesn’t completely excuse it. And the HOF no longer matters to me. I could not care less who does or does not get in. The older I get, the less I reflect on the numbers they put up. I am more so a fan of the people, and how they persevere and conduct themselves in and out of public view. That is why I am a baseball fan. The culture, not the show. 

If Brian told the truth, I apologize. I never believe that someone used once and was caught. The one time and caught cheats bother me most. 

[Number5]

4 minutes ago, weams said:

If Brian told the truth, I apologize. I never believe that someone used once and was caught. The one time and caught cheats bother me most. 

He wasn't caught.

[Can_of_corn]

1 hour ago, Number5 said:

He wasn't caught.

He didn't fail a test. (That we know of)

He did get caught.

 

[Jammer7]

1 hour ago, weams said:

If Brian told the truth, I apologize. I never believe that someone used once and was caught. The one time and caught cheats bother me most. 

As far as I remember, Brian got outed by Bigbie. And he responded by admitting to what Bigbie said. I believe that was all part of the Jason Grimsley fiasco when Bigbie was caught.

I tend to believe him, but no one really knows except Brian. I tend to agree with you, in general. I am suspicious of everyone by occupational nature. But it isn’t like Brian hit 50 homeruns in some kind of weird breakout season or something wild like that...

[Number5]

56 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

He didn't fail a test.

He did get caught.

 

How so?  It was here-say from Bigbie.  Never caught.  He simply acknowledged that he did indeed tell Bigbie that he had tried PED once.  Bigbie never saw him do it and even said he never suspected that Roberts did so.  Bigbie went so far as to say that Roberts refused to partake.  Never caught.

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, Number5 said:

How so?  It was here-say from Bigbie.  Never caught.  He simply acknowledged that he did indeed tell Bigbie that he had tried PED once.  Bigbie never saw him do it and even said he never suspected that Roberts did so.  Bigbie went so far as to say that Roberts refused to partake.  Never caught.

I'm not going to get into one of our arguments when you refuse to accept basic facts.

He was outed, when confronted he confessed.  That to me is getting caught.

I steal something. 

I tell you I stole it. 

You tell the police. 

They confront me. 

I admit to stealing it. 

I get arrested. 

I get convicted on the strength of your testimony and my confession.

I have been caught stealing.

[Number5]

Roberts admitted it AFTER the report came out.  Seemed very odd to me that he was included in the report with zero evidence.  As I said, it was strictly hear-say at the time of the report.  That is why I said he was never caught.  Because he wasn't.  Everyone else in the report either failed a test, was witnessed doing it, or had other tangible evidence such as canceled checks for the purchase. 

[weams]

13 hours ago, Number5 said:

How so?  It was here-say from Bigbie.  Never caught.  He simply acknowledged that he did indeed tell Bigbie that he had tried PED once.  Bigbie never saw him do it and even said he never suspected that Roberts did so.  Bigbie went so far as to say that Roberts refused to partake.  Never caught.

He was and if you ask him he will tell you that he did. He just won't come clean and that's a shame. If you are sorry, you need to acknowledge your failing.