Can we see Stewart, Cisco, Mountcastle instead of Martin, Severino, and Rickard?

[orioles22]

2 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I also think your last line is ludicrous.   Either they have the talent or they don't.  Keeping guys in AAA until they are 27 isn't going to fix your ML roster issues.  If they haven't reached whatever arbitrary goals you set for them when they run out of options do you DFA them without ever letting them hit the majors?

Yes. Just bring up the guys who actually do something in AAA and let the others go.

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, orioles22 said:

Yes. Just bring up the guys who actually do something in AAA and let the others go.

And who plays on the ML club while this is going on?  Waiver claims?

[LookinUp]

16 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Except occasionally guys surprise you and perform better in the majors.

I think a much better rule of thumb is, does this player still have growing to do that can be accomplished at his current level?

I don't think Stewart does.  I don't think Sisco does.  I think the former is a fully formed player and that the latter can learn better in the majors.

 

I also think your last line is ludicrous.   Either they have the talent or they don't.  Keeping guys in AAA until they are 27 isn't going to fix your ML roster issues.  If they haven't reached whatever arbitrary goals you set for them when they run out of options do you DFA them without ever letting them hit the majors?

I've got a lot of issues with this post.

1. "occasionally" guys are better in the majors? Who are your examples? If they exist, I'd wager they're in two categories. One category is for the highly ranked, toolsy stud who performed poorly for any number of reasons over small samples in the minors. I can see promoting that guy based on projection. The other is the not so good guy who gets called up and performs over a small sample. That does nothing for me. If you can point out the solid-average or better established ML players who weren't very good in the minors over a medium-large sample, I'd like to hear it.

2. Can he grow at the current level? I'm not sure Stewart has a ton more to do, but this is still a small sample for him, he has had streaks like right now where he looks better, but he's not performed exceptionally over longer periods. The upside is still relatively low, so I'd like to see him prove it. Sisco is another thing altogether. He's been below average for much of his AAA time. I'm just not sure what you're seeing outside of a few week hot streak that says otherwise. 

3. Re: my ludicrous statement about not promoting guys who don't belong in the majors. I think not promoting them forces your organization to turn over every other rock you can find instead of using a spot on a bad player. That's how we got Smith Jr. In the face of subpar talent being your alternative, I'd rather take chances on lesser known guys with playable tools. This is particularly true with Sisco, IMO. Less so with Stewart who might be what scouts call a second division regular or 4th outfielder type (so somewhat useful).

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, LookinUp said:

I've got a lot of issues with this post.

1. "occasionally" guys are better in the majors? Who are your examples? If they exist, I'd wager they're in two categories. One category is for the highly ranked, toolsy stud who performed poorly for any number of reasons over small samples in the minors. I can see promoting that guy based on projection. The other is the not so good guy who gets called up and performs over a small sample. That does nothing for me. If you can point out the solid-average or better established ML players who weren't very good in the minors over a medium-large sample, I'd like to hear it.

2. Can he grow at the current level? I'm not sure Stewart has a ton more to do, but this is still a small sample for him, he has had streaks like right now where he looks better, but he's not performed exceptionally over longer periods. The upside is still relatively low, so I'd like to see him prove it. Sisco is another thing altogether. He's been below average for much of his AAA time. I'm just not sure what you're seeing outside of a few week hot streak that says otherwise. 

3. Re: my ludicrous statement about not promoting guys who don't belong in the majors. I think not promoting them forces your organization to turn over every other rock you can find instead of using a spot on a bad player. That's how we got Smith Jr. In the face of subpar talent being your alternative, I'd rather take chances on lesser known guys with playable tools. This is particularly true with Sisco, IMO. Less so with Stewart who might be what scouts call a second division regular or 4th outfielder type (so somewhat useful).

No, who don't reach your arbitrary standards to warrant promotion.

I think Smith jr is an interesting talking point considering the game he had last night.  He's a limited player who is fine filling in on a 100+ loss team.  Would you want him on a contender?  Do you think he's part of the future?

Looking at Smith's minor league numbers do you think he was someone who ever demanded promotion with his play?  With his poor defense and career 747 minor league OPS?  Seems to me he's exactly the type of guy you wouldn't deem worthy of promotion.

 

As for guys performing better in the majors?  How about Judge?  He doesn't fit either of your criteria. 

[orioles22]

You have September and spring training to prove yourself in you are in the marginal category. I don't think putting in time in AAA means you deserve a shot in the majors if you don't put up the numbers to warrant a promotion. Of course, we don't determine what warrants a promotion. I'd just like to get to the point where we have "real" prospects who push their way to the top.

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, orioles22 said:

You have September and spring training to prove yourself in you are in the marginal category. I don't think putting in time in AAA means you deserve a shot in the majors if you don't put up the numbers to warrant a promotion. Of course, we don't determine what warrants a promotion. I'd just like to get to the point where we have "real" prospects who push their way to the top.

Stewart was great last September.  Sisco had a big spring.

Didn't do them much good.

[HowAboutThat]

I think the point that most people are trying to make here is being missed. The guys in the minors aren’t necessarily better than the guys in the majors, at least in the long term. The point is that the guys in the majors are playing complacently. They are playing sloppy, bad, embarrassing baseball and they don’t care.

The problem is attitude. Everybody knows that when People pay attention, play with pride, and care and try their best, they lift each other up. They help each other play to their best potential. I don’t know if this phenomenon is called anything, but it is very common and undeniable. The flipside is also true, and we got to witness it for most of last season. People were playing sloppy and bad and nobody cared.

Sending someone down would not necessarily be because the replacement is better, but because the guy sent down is being punished for being a slacker. Bringing the guy up would not necessarily be because he’s an outstanding player,  but a reward for hustle.

I don’t want to bring up Stewart or Santander, or Sisco, or anybody, because they’re marvelous players, But because we need to light a fire under 25 guys buts. Make it very clear that good team or bad team, if they played sloppy they are going to go to Bowie for a couple of weeks and ride the buses and sleep at Motel six and eat at McDonald’s.

 Do you think Dwight Smith is the least bit worried about being designated? Or Castro? Or Nunez? They sure as hell should be, but they’re not, And the reason they’re not is because they haven’t seen any repercussions for terrible play. How long did it take for them to dump Mike Wright?

[orioles22]

They had the chance. Not good enough for the manager and GM, I suppose. I've read Hays played well also, but they thought he needed more time, which made sense to me.

[orioles22]

1 minute ago, Philip said:

I think the point that most people are trying to make here is being missed. The guys in the minors aren’t necessarily better than the guys in the majors, at least in the long term. The point is that the guys in the majors are playing complacently. They are playing sloppy, bad, embarrassing baseball and they don’t care.

The problem is attitude. Everybody knows that when People pay attention, play with pride, and care and try their best, they lift each other up. They help each other play to their best potential. I don’t know if this phenomenon is called anything, but it is very common and undeniable. The flipside is also true, and we got to witness it for most of last season. People were playing sloppy and bad and nobody cared.

Sending someone down would not necessarily be because the replacement is better, but because the guy sent down is being punished for being a slacker. Bringing the guy up would not necessarily be because he’s an outstanding player,  but a reward for hustle.

I don’t want to bring up Stewart or Santander, or Sisco, or anybody, because they’re marvelous players, But because we need to light a fire under 25 guys buts. Make it very clear that good team or bad team, if they played sloppy they are going to go to Bowie for a couple of weeks and ride the buses and sleep at Motel six and eat at McDonald’s.

 Do you think Dwight Smith is the least bit worried about being designated? Or Castro? Or Nunez? They sure as hell should be, but they’re not, And the reason they’re not is because they haven’t seen any repercussions for terrible play. How long did it take for them to dump Mike Wright?

I'd imagine they are all trying. Most of them just aren't very good, which is why they are playing for us right now.

Smith seems like he has been pretty good overall - not counting the throw last night. If he's not good enough, we may just have a team with Mancini and Villar.

[Tx Oriole]

27 minutes ago, orioles22 said:

You have September and spring training to prove yourself in you are in the marginal category. I don't think putting in time in AAA means you deserve a shot in the majors if you don't put up the numbers to warrant a promotion. Of course, we don't determine what warrants a promotion. I'd just like to get to the point where we have "real" prospects who push their way to the top.

So would I.

[wildbillhiccup]

25 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Stewart was great last September.  Sisco had a big spring.

Didn't do them much good.

You could argue that Hays proved himself in spring training as well. The injury came after they sent him down. 

[mdbdotcom]

I'd like to see DJ Stewart in RF every game. That would give us one legitimate outfielder in the outfield. I don't think it will take long for people to see that he is basically Dwight Smith Jr. but more athletic and a better defender with a stronger arm. 

To make that possible I would get drop one of our non-contributing pitchers so we have a four-man bench and play Mancini at 1B vs. lefties and DH vs righties, with Davis at 1B vs righties and Nunez at DH vs lefites.

[Can_of_corn]

15 minutes ago, wildbillhiccup said:

You could argue that Hays proved himself in spring training as well. The injury came after they sent him down. 

Diaz played well and got sent to AA.

[Can_of_corn]

24 minutes ago, orioles22 said:

I'd imagine they are all trying. Most of them just aren't very good, which is why they are playing for us right now.

Smith seems like he has been pretty good overall - not counting the throw last night. If he's not good enough, we may just have a team with Mancini and Villar.

Smith has hit well.  Otherwise not so much.

[orioles22]

Hays and Diaz have done nothing so far due to injuries. Stewart and Sisco got off to average to bad starts. Stewart and Sisco have been better lately, but none of the four really proved the front office wrong by continuing to hit when the seasons started in the minors.