How do you feel our Rebuild is going? Grade the rebuild effort:

[sportsfan8703]

Westburg and Haskin both look like great picks, and are producing. The draft is going to flood the top 100 prospect ranking lists, but Westburg might be real close to being top 100. We’ll get to see Mayo at the end of June. Big time power. He could put up some Mountcastle milb numbers. 
 

What’s been disappointing to me is that none of the group of SPs has really emerged. I know they weren’t the TOR types, but none have really seized the opportunity so far. 

[Frobby]

1 minute ago, sportsfan8703 said:

Westburg and Haskin both look like great picks, and are producing. The draft is going to flood the top 100 prospect ranking lists, but Westburg might be real close to being top 100. We’ll get to see Mayo at the end of June. Big time power. He could put up some Mountcastle milb numbers. 
 

What’s been disappointing to me is that none of the group of SPs has really emerged. I know they weren’t the TOR types, but none have really seized the opportunity so far. 

Westburg has struggled since moving to high A (.652 OPS in 12 games).    At 22, I don’t see him getting any consideration for a top 100 list unless he raises that by 200 points or so.  And before you say 12 games is a small sample, 20 games in low A wasn’t exactly a gargantuan sample, either.

[Turtle]

I am pretty happy with the way things are going up to this point. I'm surprised by the low grades and comments here honestly. I think some of the pessimism is unavoidable based on how horrible the major league team is right now. And because of how disappointing some of the more advanced prospects are performing and how many can't seem stay healthy (Lowther/Baumann/Akin/Kremer/Bannon/etc...)

That said, my understanding has always been that it will be at least 2023 before we start to be competitive again. If your expectation was that we would start to play competitive baseball in '21 or even '22, you probably need to temper expectations. We all knew this team would suck...and if you didn't, the fangraphs pre-season prediction should've given you an idea. 

We have to think longer term. The majority of the talent is at AA or below. Plus we still have to pay CD $21M this year and next year. And I believe we're still paying Cobb $10M. So we will have some $$ free up in 2023, plus a lot of the lower-level talent should be ready by then. 

The O's are doing all the right things in terms of getting the organization to the 21st century. I'm confident in the hiring, the development structure, the new emphasis on analytics, getting into the international market, etc... And i'm happy with the drafts the last few years (although time will tell).

The O's aren't (and may never be) up to the standards of the Yankees in terms of their innovation/analytics department. But you have to crawl before you can walk. And I think we are taking the necessary first steps to at least be competitive. So we shouldn't judge whether or not our rebuild is successful so far based on whether or not we are up to the Yankees or Rays in terms of their development/analytics structure. We should judge on whether or not the front office is moving us in the right direction; which they undoubtedly are. 

There's reason for optimism. The minor leagues are killing it right now. Bowie is the best team in all minor leage baseball, Delmarva isn't far behind. Aberdeen is extremely competitive. There is help on the way. And for every Diaz or Lowther or Kremer that seems to be falling through, there is other talent that is over-achieving; like Kevin Smith, Joey Ortiz, Terrin Vavra, Kyle Bradish, etc...

So I give the rebuild an A or A- so far. I think the organization is doing all the right things to get us in the right direction. And if you start to doubt the future of the organiztion, instead of watching the O's games, buy an MiLB subscription and watch the Baysox, Ironbirds, and Shorebirds beat up on everybody. It will get you more excited about the future. 

[Aristotelian]

38 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

 

What’s been disappointing to me is that none of the group of SPs has really emerged. I know they weren’t the TOR types, but none have really seized the opportunity so far. 

That is fair and I agree they have been disappointing, but I don't really consider them part of the rebuild since they are most DD acquisitions. I think some of the discrepancy in the grades is over how to evaluate players that DD brought in but are being developed under Elias. I wasn't really counting them in my A- grade. If you count DD's trades and draft picks as part of the rebuild, yeah, I could see going down to B or C (though he did pick in Grayson). 

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

That is fair and I agree they have been disappointing, but I don't really consider them part of the rebuild since they are most DD acquisitions. I think some of the discrepancy in the grades is over how to evaluate players that DD brought in but are being developed under Elias. I wasn't really counting them in my A- grade. If you count DD's trades and draft picks as part of the rebuild, yeah, I could see going down to B or C (though he did pick in Grayson). 

And Hall, and Mountcastle and Means and Hays and Mullins.

[Aristotelian]

29 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

And Hall, and Mountcastle and Means and Hays and Mullins.

Correct, and they were all acquired before the rebuild was even a thing. 

[Can_of_corn]

6 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

Correct, and they were all acquired before the rebuild was even a thing. 

The draft is always a form of rebuilding.

 

[Sports Guy]

9 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

Correct, and they were all acquired before the rebuild was even a thing. 

You mean you can acquire good talent in the draft without tanking and rebuilding?  No way!!!

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

You mean you can acquire good talent in the draft without tanking and rebuilding?  No way!!!

I hear the opposite is also true, you can tank and fail to acquire good talent in the draft.

[HowAboutThat]

13 hours ago, Aristotelian said:

Several of our top prospects are infielders, they just aren't ready yet. You don't judge a rebuild by the stopgap players that happen to be on the Major League team.

That’s why I said incomplete or C : We can’t judge the guys who haven’t debuted yet, but we also can’t ignore the guys who should be producing by now but aren’t. 
 

edit: let me walk some of that back. The guys who should be producing but aren’t are not the guys that Mike drafted, so what are they succeed or fail is no reflection on him. I think however it remains valid to say that he could look at the needs we’ve had over the last several years and acquire Solutions that are ready now.

Edited June 18, 2021 by Philip

[HowAboutThat]

31 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

You mean you can acquire good talent in the draft without tanking and rebuilding?  No way!!!

I will always be curious why Dan was willing to trade away two draft picks just to save an insignificant amount of salary. As he pointed out in his own defense, neither was a very high draft pick, but you can’t use them if you don’t have them.

[Sports Guy]

6 minutes ago, Philip said:

I will always be curious why Dan was willing to trade away two draft picks just to save an insignificant amount of salary. As he pointed out in his own defense, neither was a very high draft pick, but you can’t use them if you don’t have them.

What are you talking about with this post?  What 2 high picks?

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, Sports Guy said:

What are you talking about with this post?  What 2 high picks?

The competitive balance picks picks that were traded away to dump the Matusz and ...I can't think of the other relievers name right now...trade was to the Dodgers.

[Sports Guy]

Just now, Can_of_corn said:

The competitive balance picks picks that were traded away to dump the Matusz and ...I can't think of the other relievers name right now...trade was to the Dodgers.

Oh ok…well I’m sure those were moves they told Him to make, not moves he wanted to make.

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, Sports Guy said:

Oh ok…well I’m sure those were moves they told Him to make, not moves he wanted to make.

Or, they were moves he was forced into because  he maxed out his spending.