Adley Rutschman 2022

[webbrick2010]

19 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

That's not on Adley, that's on Elias.

There was no reason beyond service time manipulation for him not to have been in the majors in 2021 or perhaps even 2020.

Do you think Vaughn would have been in the majors last year with Elias in charge?

Not completely on Elias. Rutschman came in with mono and missed his first 3 months, than Covid, and now a bum triceps (shoulder?). And he hasn't really torn up the minors when he has played, certainly nothing like Matt Wieters ascent thru the minors.

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, webbrick2010 said:

Not completely on Elias. Rutschman came in with mono and missed his first 3 months, than Covid, and now a bum triceps (shoulder?). And he hasn't really torn up the minors when he has played, certainly nothing like Matt Wieters ascent thru the minors.

He could have most certainly been promoted to the majors last year.

That is 100% on Elias.

[Aristotelian]

7 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

He could have most certainly been promoted to the majors last year.

That is 100% on Elias.

I would say 90% on the service time rules of the CBA, 10% on Elias. 

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

I would say 90% on the service time rules of the CBA, 10% on Elias. 

It was Elias that decided to exploit the rules.

So it's on Elias.

No one is forcing him to do it.  (Unless ownership is forcing him to do it)

If you are a business owner and the rules allow you to exploit your workers and you choose to use the rules to do so it isn't the rules fault.  It's on you.

[RZNJ]

17 minutes ago, webbrick2010 said:

Not completely on Elias. Rutschman came in with mono and missed his first 3 months, than Covid, and now a bum triceps (shoulder?). And he hasn't really torn up the minors when he has played, certainly nothing like Matt Wieters ascent thru the minors.

The more you talk the less you know.  Keep going.

[MurphDogg]

20 minutes ago, webbrick2010 said:

And he hasn't really torn up the minors when he has played, certainly nothing like Matt Wieters ascent thru the minors.

Tough to compare them because of the missed season due to Covid.

The season that Wieters tore up, the first full season after being drafted, Adley didn't have because the 2020 minor league season was cancelled.

Their AAA numbers two years after being drafted were almost identical. Wieters slashed .305/.387/.504 in 39 games. Adley slashed .312/.405/.490 in 43 games.

[RZNJ]

Crying tears for exploited millionaires.   That's something I can get on board with.  

[Tony-OH]

Before we start talking about the end of Rutschman's catching days, maybe we just see how this plays out? 

[RZNJ]

1 minute ago, Tony-OH said:

Before we start talking about the end of Rutschman's catching days, maybe we just see how this plays out? 

Haha.  Absolutely!     Know any good investigative reporters?

[Brooks The Great]

43 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

Haha.  Kjerstad has been injured from the getgo.   Rustchman was the top 1 or 2 prospect in baseball heading into this season.  Cowser is in his first full season.   Give me a break!!!!!!

Cases can be made for Kjerstad and Cowser being poor picks, aside from the bad luck injuries to Kjerstad.

I think Elias is a great overall draft evaluator, but gets too cute with first round picks. We'd be in an even better position with Hassell, Veen, or Walker instead of Kjerstad, and with Lawlar, Watson, House, or McClain instead of Cowser.

I'm really worried about Elias getting cute again with this year's #1 pick and taking someone like Brooks Lee over Druw Jones.

[RZNJ]

3 minutes ago, Brooks The Great said:

Cases can be made for Kjerstad and Cowser being poor picks, aside from the bad luck injuries to Kjerstad.

I think Elias is a great overall draft evaluator, but gets too cute with first round picks. We'd be in an even better position with Hassell, Veen, or Walker instead of Kjerstad, and with Lawlar, Watson, House, or McClain instead of Cowser.

I'm really worried about Elias getting cute again with this year's #1 pick and taking someone like Brooks Lee over Druw Jones.

There is a long way to go for this to play out but:

1.  It's impossible to compare anyone to Kjerstad at this point.  That's just bad luck.   Zach Veen has an .814 OPS in High A+ with 21 strikeouts in 16 games.  He might turn out to be great.   Wouldn't you agree it's a bit early to be making conclusions?

2. Khalil Watson, just to pick one name of the 3 you mentioned  has 4 walks and 29 strikeouts in 16 games.   Don't you think it's a bit early to be making conclusions?

I prefer the high upside HS picks myself but you know, sometimes these guys don't turn out to be the studs they look like in the draft or even after they tear up Low A ball.     I'm not saying Elias couldn't have done better with the 1st round picks in the last 2 drafts.   I'm saying that I give him the benefit of the doubt, until I see what a healthy Kjerstad looks like.   Until I see what Cowser becomes.   It's way too early for that.

In addition, his overslot picks like Mayo and Rhodes look spot on.    His non 1st round picks look super solid.     It's possible he got too cute but it's also possible that he made really good 1st round picks and some of these HS guys (it's nice that you can pick 3 or 4 and one might turn out better than Cowser) might not turn into anything.

[Tony-OH]

2 minutes ago, Brooks The Great said:

Cases can be made for Kjerstad and Cowser being poor picks, aside from the bad luck injuries to Kjerstad.

I think Elias is a great overall draft evaluator, but gets too cute with first round picks. We'd be in an even better position with Hassell, Veen, or Walker instead of Kjerstad, and with Lawlar, Watson, House, or McClain instead of Cowser.

I'm really worried about Elias getting cute again with this year's #1 pick and taking someone like Brooks Lee over Druw Jones.

Without a doubt, the jury is still out on Elias' drafting. Until his players show up in the major leaguers and start to do well, he's done nothing more than draft "prospects". 

He's had 4 drafts so far and two out of his top five prospects are Rajsich's draft picks. Not surprisingly those are both pitching prospects (Rodriguez and Hall).

Heck, the jury is still out on the effectiveness of the international signings. Their first class of signings have not exactly done much in the states with Luis Ortiz, Luis Gonzales, and Leonel Sánchez all struggling in the FCL last year and none of them being in Delmarva this year. Now grant it, the first group was signed just seven months after Koby Perez was hired to rebuild the international scouting department, so these guys were late bloomers or left overs, but still, they have not done well.

Outside of Pinto who looks interesting, the DSL guys received in the first trades by Elias have not exactly looked great with Deson and De Leon struggling in Delmarva this year. 

So yes, it's fair to say the jury is out on the scouting, drafting and development with the Elias regime until his players start to show up and contribute to a winning major league ballclub regardless of where the farm system ranks by national prospect publications/sites.

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

29 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Before we start talking about the end of Rutschman's catching days, maybe we just see how this plays out? 

 I think Rutschman will be ok, but this just yet again highlights how bad a job the organization does at communicating with the fans. Maybe Rutschman feels fine, but when you lift him from a game early and then rest him the next day fans are only going to wonder what is happening. 

 

[Tony-OH]

3 minutes ago, OsFanSinceThe80s said:

 I think Rutschman will be ok, but this just yet again highlights how bad a job the organization does at communicating with the fans. Maybe Rutschman feels fine, but when you lift him from a game early and then rest him the next day fans are only going to wonder what is happening. 

 

You will get no arguments from me on how poorly this organization informs their fans. While I respect Elias in what he's doing, his regime by far, is the worse regime I've covered when it came to giving out information to the fans. Particularly in a time when the fans should be excited and focused on the prospects coming up with the major league team continuing to be embarrassingly bad under Elias.

[waroriole]

7 minutes ago, OsFanSinceThe80s said:

 I think Rutschman will be ok, but this just yet again highlights how bad a job the organization does at communicating with the fans. Maybe Rutschman feels fine, but when you lift him from a game early and then rest him the next day fans are only going to wonder what is happening. 

 

They’re poor at communicating but this should go just as much on the beat reporters who seem to have to be prompted to do their jobs. Roch loves to tout his streak of consecutive days with an article written, but very rarely is there any substance to them.