Marlins Open to Trading from Pitching Surplus

[Can_of_corn]

8 minutes ago, Mavericksouth said:

That's cool. I'm just saying as a fan of another team that has a plethora of arms, Hall wouldn't be in our top 10 of pitchers in our organization. I think he could turn into a nice lefty specialist/Bullpen guy. Needs to get proper development with the control issues he has. He kind of reminds me of what Braxton Garrett was before this year. Hall could turn into a good number four, but he is not going to be an Ace, imo. 

So the O's are generally rated to have the best farm system in baseball, Hall is in the top 10 top Oriole prospects on most of these lists but the Marlins have 10 pitchers who would rank higher than him?

Can you explain to me how this works?

 

I think you have a guy who hasn't pitched a ton, has ridiculous stuff, has great athleticism and control issues.

The payoff for Hall could still be a #1 or 2 guy.  Lefties in particular can take a while.  He still has two years of options.

I'm betting not a single team would take the Marlins #10 ranked pitcher over Hall.  My guess you would have to go much higher on that list to get much in the way of a nibble.

 

I will agree that Hall will not likely be an Ace.  Very few guys are likely to be an Ace.

 

 

Edited September 18, 2022 by Can_of_corn
Added a line.

[Can_of_corn]

13 minutes ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

I don't feel like endlessly arguing about nothing.  Hall is a top pitching prospect with a high risk of failure.  Elias should be open to trading him.  In the past, O's GMs have held onto pitching prospects until there is no doubt they can make it in the majors and they have lost any prospect status.

Maybe you should do something productive and get back to rowing.

I'm just wondering why you needed to say something about Hall that is true for everyone.  What the purspose was.

Nice to see that when you can't answer a question you resort to attacking me for my attempts at fitness?

Weird flex Bro, at least Moose attacks my taste in music.

[OriolesMagic83]

2 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I'm just wondering why you needed to say something about Hall that is true for everyone.  What the purspose was.

Nice to see that when you can't answer a question you resort to attacking me for my attempts at fitness?

Weird flex Bro, at least Moose attacks my taste in music.

I have my take, you have your take.  There doesn't seem to be any reason to keep going back and forth with the same points of view.  I don't want some weird Sports Guy-RZNJ showdown. 

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

I have my take, you have your take.  There doesn't seem to be any reason to keep going back and forth with the same points of view.  I don't want some weird Sports Guy-RZNJ showdown. 

I don't recall either Sports Guy or RZNJ taking shots at someone trying to be healthy.

That's new.

And very, very odd.

You want my diabetes to come back? 

[Moose Milligan]

8 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I'm just wondering why you needed to say something about Hall that is true for everyone.  What the purspose was.

Nice to see that when you can't answer a question you resort to attacking me for my attempts at fitness?

Weird flex Bro, at least Moose attacks my taste in music.

I don’t attack your taste in music. It just blows, but it’s not like I’m mad about it. 

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, Moose Milligan said:

I don’t attack your taste in music. It just blows, but it’s not like I’m mad about it. 

Evidently my rowing bothers folks.

Odd world eh?

Not like I post videos of it.

 

[Mavericksouth]

Just now, Can_of_corn said:

So the O's are generally rated to have the best farm system in baseball, Hall is in the top 10 top Oriole prospects on most of these lists but the Marlins have 10 pitchers who would rank higher than him?

Can you explain to me how this works?

 

I think you have a guy who hasn't pitched a ton, has ridiculous stuff, has great athleticism and control issues.

The payoff for Hall could still be a #1 or 2 guy.  Lefties in particular can take a while.  He still has two years of options.

I'm betting not a single team would take the Marlins #10 ranked pitcher over Hall.  My guess you would have to go much higher on that list to get much in the way of a nibble.

 

 

I think you misunderstood.  I meant 10 pitchers from the big leagues to rookie ball. I like Alcantara, Lopez ,Luzardo, Rogers, Eury Perez, Max Meyer, Dax Fulton, Braxton Garrett, Edward Cabrera, and probably Sixto Sanchez (if he stops being lazy) more than Hall. I like Jake Eder too but he is mostly unproven and is coming back from tommy john surgery, so I would not put him over Hall. Of those names, only Perez, Meyer, and Fulton are not proven to some degree at the big league level as starters. Perez and Meyer are higher rated prospects than Hall. I love Fulton more than Hall (personal preference). Pitching development is what we do best. It's the ONLY thing we do somewhat well. You guys are all about offense. Your farm system is built on bats, and I agree wholeheartedly that is second to none. Based on the young bats, you have the top farm system in baseball. Hence, as a Marlins fans, it makes the most sense to trade with you guys.  We have the arms and you guys have the bats.

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, Mavericksouth said:

I think you misunderstood.  I meant 10 pitchers from the big leagues to rookie ball. I like Alcantara, Lopez ,Luzardo, Rogers, Eury Perez, Max Meyer, Dax Fulton, Braxton Garrett, Edward Cabrera, and probably Sixto Sanchez (if he stops being lazy) more than Hall. I like Jake Eder too but he is mostly unproven and is coming back from tommy john surgery, so I would not put him over Hall. Of those names, only Perez, Meyer, and Fulton are not proven to some degree at the big league level as starters. Perez and Meyer are higher rated prospects than Hall. I love Fulton more than Hall (personal preference). Pitching development is what we do best. It's the ONLY thing we do somewhat well. You guys are all about offense. Your farm system is built on bats, and I agree wholeheartedly that is second to none. Based on the young bats, you have the top farm system in baseball. Hence, as a Marlins fans, it makes the most sense to trade with you guys.  We have the arms and you guys have the bats.

Gotcha.

I still think you underrate Hall a bit but that does make more sense.

[Frobby]

My feeling about Hall is that patience is going to be required before he hits his stride.  Patience that a lot of people don’t seem to have.   He’ll be a dominant pitcher, but it might not be until 2025 or 2026.  Just a gut feeling on my part.  

[ScGO's]

Good thread.

I feel like Marlins could use Mullins, and could there be some interest in Mountcastle? Aguilar was their primary 1B, perhaps Mountcastle could be shopped as bound to be better away from the Wall

I don't think we need Chizolm just yet. Westburg, Urias, Vavra, Mateo, or Norby could fill that hole after Odor is gone permanently 

Lopez for me is essentially an equal to Mullins. I'd do it one for one, but if I guess there are some metrics to show Mullins has a bit more value. So if he could grab a prospect with him, great. Probably going to be more of a Top 30.

If we want to trade prospect needs as well, we could do Mullins, Westburg, Haskin, and Ortiz for Lopez, Eder, McCambley, and Fulton

[Ridgway22]

55 minutes ago, Frobby said:

My feeling about Hall is that patience is going to be required before he hits his stride.  Patience that a lot of people don’t seem to have.   He’ll be a dominant pitcher, but it might not be until 2025 or 2026.  Just a gut feeling on my part.  

Sandy Koufax's first 6 seasons in the ML (age 19-24) produced a losing record, 4.11 ERA, 5.3 BB/9.

Randy Johnson didn't figure it out until age 26.

When you see DL Hall's stuff, you get tempted to dream big.

When you see Tanner Scott's results, you get reminded of the range of possible outcomes.

Lefties, besides being just plain weird, often have uneven journeys to power pitching success.

I choose to dream big on DL Hall, and if he figgers it out, boom!

 

NOTE: For the contextually challenged, I am NOT comparing DL Hall to Koufax or the Big Unit. Also the comment about lefties is a JOKE, frequently heard in baseball clubhouses. See Lee, Bill.

 

 

 

 

[Mavericksouth]

11 minutes ago, ScGO's said:

Good thread.

I feel like Marlins could use Mullins, and could there be some interest in Mountcastle? Aguilar was their primary 1B, perhaps Mountcastle could be shopped as bound to be better away from the Wall

I don't think we need Chizolm just yet. Westburg, Urias, Vavra, Mateo, or Norby could fill that hole after Odor is gone permanently 

Lopez for me is essentially an equal to Mullins. I'd do it one for one, but if I guess there are some metrics to show Mullins has a bit more value. So if he could grab a prospect with him, great. Probably going to be more of a Top 30.

If we want to trade prospect needs as well, we could do Mullins, Westburg, Haskin, and Ortiz for Lopez, Eder, McCambley, and Fulton

This trade would intrigue me. Just out of curiosity to all O fans, why are you so willing to move Mullins? I think he is a top 10 center fielder in the MLB. While I love Cowser and his potential, I'm not necessarily sure he projects as a long term center field prospect. His struggles at AAA also concern me a tad. One of the reasons, I asked for Cowser as opposed to Mullins in my hypothetical trade is that I figured you all would be more willing to part with what may be (Cowser) as opposed to a sure and proven thing (Mullins). 

Either way, if you all did Mullins, Westburg, and Ortiz for Lopez, Eder, and McCambley, we could do business together I think. 

 

[Sports Guy]

48 minutes ago, Mavericksouth said:

This trade would intrigue me. Just out of curiosity to all O fans, why are you so willing to move Mullins? I think he is a top 10 center fielder in the MLB. While I love Cowser and his potential, I'm not necessarily sure he projects as a long term center field prospect. His struggles at AAA also concern me a tad. One of the reasons, I asked for Cowser as opposed to Mullins in my hypothetical trade is that I figured you all would be more willing to part with what may be (Cowser) as opposed to a sure and proven thing (Mullins). 

Either way, if you all did Mullins, Westburg, and Ortiz for Lopez, Eder, and McCambley, we could do business together I think. 

 

There are a few reasons:

1) Rather move vets than cheaper, young talent that is cost controlled for longer.

2) have some doubts about where Mullins will be in 2-3 years.

Mullins is a very good player and it’s certainly fine if we keep him.  But I’m not sure his timeline of years of success matches up as well and he also represents a very good player who can fetch us the pitching we need.

Miami is the perfect trade partner.

[ScGO's]

50 minutes ago, Mavericksouth said:

This trade would intrigue me. Just out of curiosity to all O fans, why are you so willing to move Mullins? I think he is a top 10 center fielder in the MLB. While I love Cowser and his potential, I'm not necessarily sure he projects as a long term center field prospect. His struggles at AAA also concern me a tad. One of the reasons, I asked for Cowser as opposed to Mullins in my hypothetical trade is that I figured you all would be more willing to part with what may be (Cowser) as opposed to a sure and proven thing (Mullins). 

Either way, if you all did Mullins, Westburg, and Ortiz for Lopez, Eder, and McCambley, we could do business together I think. 

 

I do agree that we would have a bit of a decline in our CF defense losing Mullins but he's going into arbitration and I think we have enough depth in the OF to replace him in the future. Maybe Elias addresses it through free agency, but we really need to add to our pitching depth and OF and MIF Prospects is where we have the most depth.

That being said, I could see Elias keep Mullins and look to trade Santander, Mountcastle, or Hays. Mountcastle may have some value moving away from Camden Yards, but Hays probably stays with the team next year and, if he's not traded at some point, could be jumped by some of the upcoming OF prospects.

[vab]

2 hours ago, Frobby said:

My feeling about Hall is that patience is going to be required before he hits his stride.  Patience that a lot of people don’t seem to have.   He’ll be a dominant pitcher, but it might not be until 2025 or 2026.  Just a gut feeling on my part.  

I feel the same way which is why you trade him this offseason while he still has value. This team is certainly planning to be established, perennial contenders by '25 or '26 so they will not have the luxury of waiting that long for Hall to figure things out.