2023 Orioles #6 Prospects Joey Ortiz - SS/2B

[Tony-OH]

https://orioleshangout.com/2023/11/15/2023-6-prospect-joey-ortiz-ss/

Slick fielding infielder who can play a legitimate major league shortstop, followed up a half of a solid offensive 2022 campaign with an outstanding full offensive 2023 campaign and comes in as the #6 prospect.

Joey Ortiz
Pos: SS/2B/3B
Bats: R
Throws: R
Age (as of Jun 30th) : 24
2023 Level: AAA/MAJ

Tools (current/future value)
Hit: 45/50
Game Power: 40/45
Raw Power: 50/50
Run: 55/55
Defense: 60/65

Most Likely Future Role: Starting SS or 2B
Ceiling: 1st Division Starting SS

What we know: Probably the prospect who was most blocked from the major league level despite being ready. The 24-year old slick fielding infielder put together an outstanding season on offense and defense that was only slowed by a few nagging injuries, a oblique injury, and inconsistent playing time during his major league recall.

Put up a 121 wRC+ and a .388 wOBA in 389 AAA PAs while hitting the ball hard to all field. For a guy with average raw power, Ortiz hits the ball consistently hard putting up consistent 100 MPH plus EVs with a top EV at 115 MPH in AAA. He mostly has pull power, but will hit the ball gap to gap collecting an impressive 30 doubles and four triples to go along with his nine homeruns.

Received three separate promotions to Baltimore but surprisingly was treated as a utility guy versus a legitimate major league prospect but getting uneven playing time. When he did start to get some consistent playing time he started to hit but then was sent back down. Ortiz can hit good fastballs, but struggles at time with good offspeed pitches and hit too many balls on the ground, especially at the major league level.

Defensively, he's easily the best defensive shortstop in the system who is major league ready with the glove. He has plus range, very good hands, turns the double play well, has great baseball instincts, and his quick release overcomes his slightly below average major league shortstop arm. When he plays second base he's a plus-plus defender there, and even showed solid range in some 3B time.

What we don't know: There are some concerns that Ortiz hits too many good offspeed pitches on the ground and he'll chase occasionally as well. His pull power also may not play in cavernous Camden Yards, but he still should be able to hit for gap power. While he doesn't have the plus arm strength that a team would prefer at shortstop, he does get rid of the ball quick with accurate throws, but is he good enough to push Gunnar Henderson to 3B?

What we think: Joey Ortiz was a victim of the Adam Frazier signing and ended up buried in AAA when he was a better player overall than the veteran. Saying that, he did not sulk and played well all season despite being moved up and down three times and missed about three weeks in September with an oblique injury. Ortiz will play 2024 at 25-years old and is ready to be an everyday major league infielder. He could very well end up the Orioles starting SS if the team dec

[IPlayGM]

Thanks Tony, I got this one right!  One of the weirder things about this past season was how they treated Westburg like a huge addition when he came up but treated Ortiz like a scrub. Was happy he performed the way he did the rest of the year.

Edited November 15, 2023 by IPlayGM
Omission

[Tony-OH]

1 minute ago, IPlayGM said:

Thanks Tony, I got this one right!  One of the weirder things about this past season was how they treated Westburg like a huge addition when he came up but treated Ortiz like a scrub. Was happy he performed the way he did the rest of the year.

He was hurt by the unnecessary addition of Adam Frazier though I guess in theory it bought them (or another team if he's traded) another year of Ortiz. 

He was major league ready and while Camden Yards may not be a great fit for his power profile, he's about as major league ready as there is on both offense and defense.

[LookinUp]

The O's are sitting on a first division middle infield prospect because there's not room for him right now, and the top prospect in baseball is about to pass him. Good problem to have. 

I assume Elias has chosen Westburg over Ortiz just because of what happened last year. Would he keep a guy like Ortiz in the utility role, or will he try to maximize the value via trade? I think you can argue we could better use Mateo + whatever we get in a trade for Ortiz than keep Ortiz as utility, but I think I'd prefer to keep all 4 of those two, Gunnar and Holliday.

I think I'd stick with the younger cheap prospect that I'm sure can lock down the defense for years to come and start full time in the event of an injury to one of the others. That plan goes out the window when a big trade comes though.

But I honestly don't even know what I would prefer.

 

[wildcard]

I think Ortiz begins the season at 3B.  He is not moving Gunnar off short.  Not with Gunnar's arm strength.   Westburg appears to be better at 2B than 3B defensively.   Ortiz can play any of the infield positions.    

When Holliday arrives he pushes Westburg off 2B.   That sets up the competition between Westburg and Ortiz at 3B.     I like the depth that these four give the O's.  I would not trade any for them.

[Aristotelian]

3 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I think Ortiz begins the season at 3B.  He is not moving Gunnar off short.  Not with Gunnar's arm strength.   Westburg appears to be better at 2B than 3B defensively.   Ortiz can play any of the infield positions.    

When Holliday arrives he pushes Westburg off 2B.   That sets up the competition between Westburg and Ortiz at 3B.     I like the depth that these four give the O's.  I would not trade any for them.

Hopefully Mateo and Urias are gone. Long term Ortiz should be competing with Westburg to fill in the infield around Gunnar/Holliday, but there are a lot of ways it can go with all four being versatile infielders. Ortiz seems to have the most value as a defensive SS, so if he hits he could force his way into SS. Gunnar's arm would still be an asset at 3B. 

If Westburg's offense carries him into the lineup, he appears to be really good at 2B. But then would we want Holliday playing 3B? 

All of which is to say I do not think Gunnar has an exclusive claim on SS yet. 

[Tony-OH]

11 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I think Ortiz begins the season at 3B.  He is not moving Gunnar off short.  Not with Gunnar's arm strength.   Westburg appears to be better at 2B than 3B defensively.   Ortiz can play any of the infield positions.    

When Holliday arrives he pushes Westburg off 2B.   That sets up the competition between Westburg and Ortiz at 3B.     I like the depth that these four give the O's.  I would not trade any for them.

You keep saying this but you keep forgetting that Mayo is ready as well. He's going to play 3B over Ortiz due to the bat being much better. Ortiz doesn't have the bat for 3B, but does for SS or 2B. I think he will battle Westburg for 2B next spring if they are both here. the "loser" will be in the Urias role. 

I'm thinking one gets moved though this offseason in a deal for a starter.

[Tony-OH]

3 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

Hopefully Mateo and Urias are gone. Long term Ortiz should be competing with Westburg to fill in the infield around Gunnar/Holliday, but there are a lot of ways it can go with all four being versatile infielders. Ortiz seems to have the most value as a defensive SS, so if he hits he could force his way into SS. Gunnar's arm would still be an asset at 3B. 

If Westburg's offense carries him into the lineup, he appears to be really good at 2B. But then would we want Holliday playing 3B? 

All of which is to say I do not think Gunnar has an exclusive claim on SS yet. 

When Holliday is deemed ready, and I doubt that is going to be at the start of next season no matter what GM speak Elias says about giving him a chance, he will play 2B or SS. 

[RZNJ]

6 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

You keep saying this but you keep forgetting that Mayo is ready as well. He's going to play 3B over Ortiz due to the bat being much better. Ortiz doesn't have the bat for 3B, but does for SS or 2B. I think he will battle Westburg for 2B next spring if they are both here. the "loser" will be in the Urias role. 

I'm thinking one gets moved though this offseason in a deal for a starter.

Do you see Mayo/Henderson/Holliday as the infield by next year?

[sportsfan8703]

6 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

When Holliday is deemed ready, and I doubt that is going to be at the start of next season no matter what GM speak Elias says about giving him a chance, he will play 2B or SS. 

And this is what helps Ortiz.  Holliday and Mayo both need just a few more months of AAA seasoning, or to get them past the super 2 date.  We're in a precarious spot with Holliday where he might not put up the numbers to win ROY if he's on the OD roster from Day 1 to win the draft pick.  It would be a lot to ask of Holliday to put up the type of power numbers needed to beat out the ROY comp in OPACY at such a young age.  I think we'll see Ortiz make the OD roster with one of Mateo/Urias traded.  It might not be a full time gig for Ortiz, but he'll be in our IF rotation.  

[Frobby]

If I were another team looking for a shortstop, Ortiz would be very high on my target list.  There’s no question he can handle the position defensively, and he’s going to end up outhitting many shortstops.   I think if I were the O’s, he’d have more value as a trade piece than as a keeper, just because we’ve got so much infield depth.   

Saying that, I’d love to watch an infield with Ortiz at SS and Gunnar at 3B.
 

[Sports Guy]

One of Ortiz or Westburg basically has to go. You can wait if you want but there’s more downside than upside in doing that imo.

Whichever one they decide to keep I will be more than happy to have them as the everyday second baseman.

[Tony-OH]

1 hour ago, RZNJ said:

Do you see Mayo/Henderson/Holliday as the infield by next year?

At the start of the year of end? 

I think they will start the year with Gunnar at 3B, Ortiz at SS, and Westburg at 2B. that would give them plus defenders at every infield position. I'd be happy to see a Mayo/Henderson/Ortiz with Westburg traded or as a super sub to start the year.

Depending on how Holliday does at AAA and the need, I could see them ending the year with Henderson/Ortiz/Holliday with Westburg as a supersub or Mayo/Henderson/Holliday with Ortiz as the supersub if Westburg is traded.. 

A lot depends on whether the Orioles trade Ortiz or Westburg this offseason. If neither are moved, I think that's your starting infield on opening day. 

 

[RZNJ]

2 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

At the start of the year of end? 

I think they will start the year with Gunnar at 3B, Ortiz at SS, and Westburg at 2B. that would give them plus defenders at every infield position.

Depending on how Holliday does at AAA and the need, I could see them ending the year with Henderson/Ortiz/Holliday with Westburg as a supersub. 

A lot depends on whether the Orioles trade Ortiz or Westburg this offseason. If neither are moved, I think that's your starting infield on opening day. 

 

I meant by September of this year or OD 2024.

[Tony-OH]

23 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

I meant by September of this year or OD 2024.

I kinda went through all the options as I see it. Saying that, I would be surprised if Westburg and Ortiz are both in the organization come next spring. One of that should be traded this offseason because they have value and can be a core part of a trade for a top starting pitcher.