MLB Offseason Moves/Rumor Thread

[Moose Milligan]

1 minute ago, Tony-OH said:

Ok Che Guevara. You and the revolutionaries can stop beating the same drum over and over and not derail this thread about what players are going where for what why it's better for the "workers" to make money than the owners. 

All owners are Billionaires nowadays. No one feels sorry for them, but the last I checked, while the owners are still billionaires, many players are now tens and hundreds of millionaires. Meanwhile, regular folks have to now pay crazy amounts of money to go see baseball games or pay exorbitant cable fees to have channels they don't want or need because MLB won't allow them an in market streaming option.

This is exactly why I dislike the monetary part of the off season because fans seem to focus on owners vs players while knowing they will keep dishing out more and more money for tickets and concessions. The MLB system is designed to milk the fans in order to keep billionaires billionaires and make the Harrison Bader's of the world worth $10 million. 

Now if you want something to really be perturbed about, the Orioles had the 10th highest average ticket price sold in 2023 while having the second lowest payroll. Meanwhile John Angelos is telling the press he'll need to raise prices to keep the Orioles young stars.

So yeah, I'm not crying for any of them and as long as fans are willing to pay the prices of tickets and concessions, then I guess the system works. Personally, I limit my time at the park because it's not worth paying hundreds of dollars for tickets, food, and parking when I can watch it on my big screen TV at home.

 

There's a lot I agree with here, especially limiting time at the park in order to watch at home.  That might be different if I lived closer to the stadium but I suspect it wouldn't be a huge impact.  AC, crystal clear big screen TV, cheaper food, etc.

I also liked where you called him Che, that was pretty funny  

This isn't direct at you, but it's always struck me as a bit odd that we consider professional sports to be entertainment, yet it's the one form of entertainment where the fans don't hold back about critiquing the owners and players on how much money they have.  I don't know of anyone who says that Tom Cruise makes too much money for a Mission Impossible film, nor do I know anyone that thinks the head of Warner Brothers makes too much money.  All I hear about is how many albums Taylor Swift has sold and how much she's made on her tour, but no one seems upset about it.  No one says that her album producer or the record label she's under make too much.  I don't hear anyone saying Vince McMahon has too much money or that WWE wrestlers are overpaid.

Maybe that's because a lot of us played baseball, I dunno.  

[owknows]

1 minute ago, RZNJ said:

We have infielders and outfielders for trade.   We have 3 outfielders.  Then we have Cowser, Kjerstad, and Beavers.  Then we drafted Bradfield and Horvath + last year.   There’s no reason we can’t make a deal unless the other team is trying to hold us up.

If you're lucky 3 of the aforementioned players are everyday MLB outfielders.

The only other outfielders you have are Mullins and Hays. And I don't think you're signing them long term.

So yea, there probably is a reason not to trade the cream of your outfield prospect crop.

[wildcard]

24 minutes ago, interloper said:

Santander is looking at this deal like 

"I'm a $20 million player??"

If he has a good year he will be as a FA.

[interloper]

4 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

I never saw the stuff from Irvin that would give me confidence in him moving forward despite the better results in the 2nd half.  Maybe he’d surprise me.  Does he have one plus pitch?

Let's take a look from one of his better late-season starts.

https://www.mlb.com/video/cole-irvin-fans-4?partnerId=web_multimedia-search_video-share

He still doesn't strike out a lot of guys, but he's got a nice little 93-95 fastball and some decent offspeed stuff. It's about command for him and then his stuff plays up a little. 

I don't know if he has a plus pitch necessarily, but neither did Gibson really. 

I dunno, I think I would take Irvin over Lorenzen any day. 

Edited January 8 by interloper

[wildcard]

20 minutes ago, interloper said:

I think I'd rather just go with Cole Irvin. He's pitched more innings in a year (twice!) than Lorenzen ever has. 

IMO Lorenzen is a better pitcher.  And he is a starter/reliever so he can be the right handed help in the pen while Wells is starting and then be the starter in the 2nd half.

If they rest Wells mid season he is a playoff starter in Oct.   He is really good when rested.

[wildcard]

23 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

This would be horrific.  Much better off giving the ball to Hall and signing a guy like Stephenson for the pen.

So far Hall throws too many pitches  per inning to get through 5 innings consistently.   He is better in the pen.  It might happen over time but its a bad strategy to begin the 2024 season.

[Sports Guy]

Just now, wildcard said:

So far Hall throws too many pitches  per inning to get through 5 innings consistently.   He is better in the pen.  It might happen over time but its a bad strategy to begin the 2024 season.

No, it’s a perfect strategy if you are going to give him a chance because you can cover him early and have options to replace him if he fails.

Most 5th starters fail to get through 5 innings, so that’s not even a concern.

This team needs upside..they need to “get by”. We have the guys to get by. We need more than that.

Lorenzen is an awful idea.

[Sports Guy]

5 minutes ago, wildcard said:

IMO Lorenzen is a better pitcher.  And he is a starter/reliever so he can be the right handed help in the pen while Wells is starting and then be the starter in the 2nd half.

If they rest Wells mid season he is a playoff starter in Oct.   He is really good when rested.

lol…I’d wager you knew nothing about Lorenzen before July of last year.

[sportsfan8703]

The Dodgers have shown that they’ll do a prospect-prospect deal this offseason. They have to make a 40 man roster move and they have 5 SP in AAA that are 25-27. We could flip them a young bat that doesn’t need to be on the 40 man. 

[Hank Scorpio]

17 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

There's a lot I agree with here, especially limiting time at the park in order to watch at home.  That might be different if I lived closer to the stadium but I suspect it wouldn't be a huge impact.  AC, crystal clear big screen TV, cheaper food, etc.

I also liked where you called him Che, that was pretty funny  

This isn't direct at you, but it's always struck me as a bit odd that we consider professional sports to be entertainment, yet it's the one form of entertainment where the fans don't hold back about critiquing the owners and players on how much money they have.  I don't know of anyone who says that Tom Cruise makes too much money for a Mission Impossible film, nor do I know anyone that thinks the head of Warner Brothers makes too much money.  All I hear about is how many albums Taylor Swift has sold and how much she's made on her tour, but no one seems upset about it.  No one says that her album producer or the record label she's under make too much.  I don't hear anyone saying Vince McMahon has too much money or that WWE wrestlers are overpaid.

Maybe that's because a lot of us played baseball, I dunno.  

You make a good point.

Which is noteworthy, Slappy.

[wildcard]

26 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

OPaCY doesn’t play much different than Oakland’s park anymore.

And Irvin struggled because his command was an issue…it had nothing to do with anything else but that.

He is a command/control guy.  When those are off, he will struggle.

Irvin himself said that he came into the 2023 with the wrong prespective.  Was humbled.  The AAA time helped him change some things.    

I would still take All-Star Lorenzen and the way the pitched for the Tigers over Irvin.  O's defense and pen will help Lorenzen be better.

Edited January 8 by wildcard

[Moose Milligan]

3 minutes ago, Hank Scorpio said:

You make a good point.

Which is noteworthy, Slappy.

 

[RZNJ]

25 minutes ago, interloper said:

Let's take a look from one of his better late-season starts.

https://www.mlb.com/video/cole-irvin-fans-4?partnerId=web_multimedia-search_video-share

He still doesn't strike out a lot of guys, but he's got a nice little 93-95 fastball and some decent offspeed stuff. It's about command for him and then his stuff plays up a little. 

I don't know if he has a plus pitch necessarily, but neither did Gibson really. 

I dunno, I think I would take Irvin over Lorenzen any day. 

Irvin's average fastball was something like 92 mph.  He must have had his wheaties that day.  There were starts where Gibson had a plus curve, change, or sinker.  I just never saw that in any of Irvins outings even when he was effective.

[RZNJ]

30 minutes ago, owknows said:

If you're lucky 3 of the aforementioned players are everyday MLB outfielders.

The only other outfielders you have are Mullins and Hays. And I don't think you're signing them long term.

So yea, there probably is a reason not to trade the cream of your outfield prospect crop.

Agreed, we are better short term with infield depth but with 3 LH likely corner outfielders in Cowser, Kjerstad, and Beavers,  no reason we can't include one in a trade.

[sportsfan8703]

12 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

Irvin's average fastball was something like 92 mph.  He must have had his wheaties that day.  There were starts where Gibson had a plus curve, change, or sinker.  I just never saw that in any of Irvins outings even when he was effective.

Irvin showed more velocity when he had more rest. Same with the pen. In short outings out of the pen late in the year he was at 95.