MacPhail on trade possibilities

[Dipper9]

Good Question and more on topic than Jones' positioning.

I am not sure it takes a whole lot for Pie. We are in a position where we can accept minor leaguers for him. If we can get a A or AA pitcher with some promise I think we do it.

I am not trading Reimold right now. I think his bat has too much upside. I look at Werth's contract and ask if Reimold can be as good or better.

I agree, but I have always been higher on Reimold then Pie, so I figured I had a biased opinion.

[Lateralus]

And finally, the boss ALWAYS gets the credit. The "workers" job is to make the boss look good.

All I can says is that if that's how it goes I'm glad I've never been in an employment situation like that. All I've been in has pretty much been the reverse and I think that makes for a better, all-around work environment.

If that's the case, than for those final 2 months the players, Buck, etc. made Peter Angelos the best boss ever. That the case in reality?

[Frobby]

When Jones got here after the trade someone messed up and told him the best centerfielder the Orioles ever had was Paul Blair and Jones thought to himself. "I can do that. I can be the best CF in Oriole history"

Problem is........he cant. Frankly Mr. Jones your are no Paul Blair!

He could be one of the best CFers in O's history.

Relax and let Buck and the coaches take care of it.

There is way too much hate for Adam Jones...

I think what Buck had to say about Jones on Sunday was pretty telling:

Manager Buck Showalter was asked earlier today what Adam Jones needed to do in order to have a "super breakout season." He didn't appreciate the question.

"I don't mean this in a bad way. Same way with (Matt) Wieters and whatever. If I hit .280 and hit around 20 home runs last year and played a real good center field ... and he needs to have a breakout year? What would that be?" Showalter said.

"He is. It's not what he's going to be. He is. Shop him around. We like him and we ain't shopping him around. He's ours and we're glad to have him. We like him the way he is and the way he might be. I'm not going to put that around his neck. We do that all the time. That's only because he's a prisoner of his skill set. I don't look at it that way. We've just got to make sure that Jonesy is going to be as good as he's capable of being, and I'm real close to having that feeling. He's got some good people around him.

"I hear 'a breakout year.' Break out from what - .280, 20 (home runs) and 24, 25 years old? Ain't a whole lot of those cats floating around as it is, so we'll see what happens. I just left a guy in Sarasota who was soaking wet when I left. He's been in the cage for about an hour. So the want-to is there, and I think he's going to really feed off a lot of the people who are around him, too."

http://www.masnsports.com/school_of_roch/2011/03/showalter-rushes-to-jones-defense.html

Let me ask a serious question: how many CFs has this franchise had who accomplished as much as Jones did through his age 24 season? Not Brady -- .558 OPS at age 24 and wasn't good until age 28. Not Al Bumbry -- his ROY campaign was at age 26 (he had been in the military and got his career started late). Luis Matos, anyone?

Adam Jones is a good ballplayer, and I have no doubt he'll get better under Buck's tutelage. And I have no doubt that if Buck thinks Jones is playing too shallow, you'll see Jones playing deeper.

[Dipper9]

All I can says is that if that's how it goes I'm glad I've never been in an employment situation like that. All I've been in has pretty much been the reverse and I think that makes for a better, all-around work environment.

If that's the case, than for those final 2 months the players, Buck, etc. made Peter Angelos the best boss ever. That the case in reality?

You want reality. Here goes. If a major company has a good year, the Owner gets a HUGE bonus....the top level management get HUGE bonuses....the mid level managers get nice hefty lump sums....the supervisors get good raises....and the worker bees get 2-3% raises.

I ask you, who does the work?

Exactly!

[StottyByNature]

I think what Buck had to say about Jones on Sunday was pretty telling:

http://www.masnsports.com/school_of_roch/2011/03/showalter-rushes-to-jones-defense.html

Let me ask a serious question: how many CFs has this franchise had who accomplished as much as Jones did through his age 24 season? Not Brady -- .558 OPS at age 24 and wasn't good until age 28. Not Al Bumbry -- his ROY campaign was at age 26 (he had been in the military and got his career started late). Luis Matos, anyone?

Adam Jones is a good ballplayer, and I have no doubt he'll get better under Buck's tutelage. And I have no doubt that if Buck thinks Jones is playing too shallow, you'll see Jones playing deeper.

Great find, thank you. That should end this debate.

[ChrisAF79]

Allow me to clarify that I'm a huge Jones fan. I've met him in person several times as well, and he's a great person on top of everything else. I just want him to get better and maximize his potential, and I get annoyed when it appears that his arrogance (or whatever you want to call it) gets in the way of things.

I'm not trying to bash Jones in the least. I simply want him to live up to his immense potential. That's all. He is not immune to criticism.

[scOtt]

Good Question and more on topic than Jones' positioning.

I am not sure it takes a whole lot for Pie. We are in a position where we can accept minor leaguers for him. If we can get a A or AA pitcher with some promise I think we do it.

I am not trading Reimold right now. I think his bat has too much upside. I look at Werth's contract and ask if Reimold can be as good or better.

Yes, this whole Jones debate is tedious. I'd be interested to hear SG's take on Pie's value too. I think what I bolded is about right. And losing Pie for a decent young pitcher won't hurt the big club at all.

Agree with you also that I'd stick with Reimold on his merits and potential. AND because he's not going to bring anything in trade. He needs to play wherever in OUR organization this year and then he could be from a valuable trade piece up to untouchable.

[Lateralus]

You want reality. Here goes. If a major company has a good year, the Owner gets a HUGE bonus....the top level management get HUGE bonuses....the mid level managers get nice hefty lump sums....the supervisors get good raises....and the worker bees get 2-3% raises.

I ask you, who does the work?

Exactly!

I can see how this is going so I'll fall on the sword.

You're right. You win. You're right. I'm wrong.

The quotes Frobby pulled up and his following analysis are moot and don't mean anything.

You're correct. Kudos good sir. Well played.

[Woody Held]

I think what Buck had to say about Jones on Sunday was pretty telling:

http://www.masnsports.com/school_of_roch/2011/03/showalter-rushes-to-jones-defense.html

Let me ask a serious question: how many CFs has this franchise had who accomplished as much as Jones did through his age 24 season? Not Brady -- .558 OPS at age 24 and wasn't good until age 28. Not Al Bumbry -- his ROY campaign was at age 26 (he had been in the military and got his career started late). Luis Matos, anyone?

Adam Jones is a good ballplayer, and I have no doubt he'll get better under Buck's tutelage. And I have no doubt that if Buck thinks Jones is playing too shallow, you'll see Jones playing deeper.

This says it all. Right on the spot Frobby

[Gurgi]

Great find, thank you. That should end this debate.

The only thing that will end this debate is how he plays. Which is the way it should be.

By the July All-star break we should have a good read on Jones. And his defense.

[StottyByNature]

Allow me to clarify that I'm a huge Jones fan. I've met him in person several times as well, and he's a great person on top of everything else. I just want him to get better and maximize his potential, and I get annoyed when it appears that his arrogance (or whatever you want to call it) gets in the way of things.

I'm not trying to bash Jones in the least. I simply want him to live up to his immense potential. That's all. He is not immune to criticism.

This is probably a classic case in baseball. When a player has such high expectations, he can never live up to them in the fans' eyes. Oftentimes what is missed is the fact that they have a really good (albeit not great) player. I choose to appreciate Jones for who he is, and trust that he works hard to maximize his potential. Fan expectations are not nearly as important as personal drive, so I think we should leave him to it.

[leapinghorsered]

I disagree. MacPhail has built a team this year that he thinks can play competitive ball. If he thinks he can get a good deal for Pie, he will trade him to make the team better. There is no way he trades Scott just to be able to keep Reimold and Pie.

I don't understand this. Scott is a decent not great player who goes through horrible slumps. He pads his numbers against bad pitching and hits a ton of meaningless home runs in blow out gams. I'd put Reimold in left over him right now.

[StottyByNature]

The only thing that will end this debate is how he plays. Which is the way it should be.

By the July All-star break we should have a good read on Jones. And his defense.

No, the debate was asking if Jones has too much ego to listen to his coaches, as you so eloquently stated earlier. These quotes show that, indeed, he does not. His coaches are just fine with how he plays.

[Lateralus]

Nice to see Frobby's post bring this thread to a screeching, and deserved, halt.

[Can_of_corn]

I don't understand this. Scott is a decent not great player who goes through horrible slumps. He pads his numbers against bad pitching and hits a ton of meaningless home runs in blow out gams. I'd put Reimold in left over him right now.

Everyone pads their numbers against bad pitching, that is why its bad. If folks didn't do well against it they would call it good pitching. Very few batter do better against Rivera then Albers.