Do you agree with BP's take on Jonathan Schoop?

[Frobby]

This was mentioned in the OP of the BP Top 10 prospects thread, but I thought it deserved a separate discussion:

Schoop offers above-average regular upside that's driven by an intriguing power-defense combo. That being said, there's plenty of risk attached and the more realistic peak value is that of a second-division starter. Schoop posted a .271 TAv in 2015, but it's difficult to envision him sustaining that level of performance (or anywhere near it for that matter) unless he improves his plate discipline considerably. There's more to come with Schoop but he'll likely always be a guy whose value never reaches the heights that his tools imply.

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=28075

I readily acknowledge that Schoop has plate discipline issues, and he'll never be a high OBP guy. At the same time, I thought he came a long way offensively in 2015 compared to 2014. I don't know how you can say his "realistic peak value is that of a second division starter," when he was worth 1.5 rWAR in 137 games as a rookie, and then 1.4 rWAR in 86 games in his second season, and he'll only be 24 years old this year.

[Can_of_corn]

They've been more complimentary of him in the past.

I guess the individual writers have their own takes on players.

[Aristotelian]

The question is whether last year was progression with more progress to come, or an aberration due to regression. The problem is his numbers last year are over a much smaller sample, so I would lean toward expecting some regression to his 2014 numbers. Especially since he never hit consistently at the minor league level either. Hard to imagine him doing better than his minor league .746 OPS at the MLB level over a full season although the eye test says he is certainly capable.

[Can_of_corn]

The question is whether last year was progression with more progress to come, or an aberration due to regression. The problem is his numbers last year are over a much smaller sample, so I would lean toward expecting some regression to his 2014 numbers. Especially since he never hit consistently at the minor league level either. Hard to imagine him doing better than his minor league .746 OPS at the MLB level over a full season although the eye test says he is certainly capable.

I can see it. He was promoted aggressively and was injured his final year.

If he actually does what he says he is trying to do I think he has room to grow.

[AdamK]

How does his defense rate compared to other second basemen?

His glove is quite solid,

his arm is great,

range seems good for now assuming his health is full (I suppose he may get larger with age)...

My point is... If his defense is as good as it seems and his power/contact continues to develop doesn't that make him a weapon?

[DrungoHazewood]

The question is whether last year was progression with more progress to come, or an aberration due to regression. The problem is his numbers last year are over a much smaller sample, so I would lean toward expecting some regression to his 2014 numbers. Especially since he never hit consistently at the minor league level either. Hard to imagine him doing better than his minor league .746 OPS at the MLB level over a full season although the eye test says he is certainly capable.

I'm sure his minor league track record would be far better if he was left in the minors another year or two. Jim Palmer wasn't consistently good in the minors, either.

[Frobby]

Comps are dumb, but what's his ceiling comp as as a hitter? JJ Hardy?

I think he has more power potential than Hardy. I think he could crack 30 homers some years.

[BohKnowsBmore]

The question is whether last year was progression with more progress to come, or an aberration due to regression. The problem is his numbers last year are over a much smaller sample, so I would lean toward expecting some regression to his 2014 numbers. Especially since he never hit consistently at the minor league level either. Hard to imagine him doing better than his minor league .746 OPS at the MLB level over a full season although the eye test says he is certainly capable.

He was always young for his league in the minors. Also, I have a hard time saying that his age 22 season should serve as a regression point. I think age 22 to age 23 should be considered progression. And 80+ games is still half a season. It's not like we're talking about sub-100 PA or something.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[25 Nuggets]

Comps are dumb, but what's his ceiling comp as as a hitter? JJ Hardy?

I did a comparison on this before, with video. His ceiling is Alfonso Soriano.

[weams]

I did a comparison on this before, with video. His ceiling is Alfonso Soriano.

Post the link. Thanks.

[25 Nuggets]

From the "Schoop is a Blessing" thread:

I keep seeing a young Alfonso Soriano.

[video=youtube;wmT0iaMupxY]

[video=youtube;oygBBxmUaHA]

Schoop is 6'1", and Soriano is 6'1"... Schoop's a little thicker. Both like to hover the bat up high and both have a tendency to take the arm off the bat through a fast but sweeping swing. In the Soriano clip however you can see how he sees the ball well, and is able to cover more zones over the plate. That's the level Schoop can get to.

Set the Soriano clip to 1:04 and start the Schoop clip from the beginning, simo. See what I mean.

[tntoriole]

I think Schoop is going to take at least one more major jump offensively and will become A BEAST!!!!

[InsideCoroner]

I tend to agree that he will have difficulties improving as a hitter unless he develops a better eye. I had thought he was slightly better last year in that regard. But after looking at the stats, his BB and K rates were almost identical to those in 2014 when he struggled so badly. He's got tremendous raw power, so maybe that will help offset things. I just think he might be extremely inconsistent at the plate.

[weams]

I tend to agree that he will have difficulties improving as a hitter unless he develops a better eye. I had thought he was slightly better last year in that regard. But after looking at the stats, his BB and K rates were almost identical to those in 2014 when he struggled so badly. He's got tremendous raw power, so maybe that will help offset things. I just think he might be extremely inconsistent at the plate.

Adam Jones is like that. And he is great.

[sportsfan8703]

How does his defense rate compared to other second basemen?

His glove is quite solid,

his arm is great,

range seems good for now assuming his health is full (I suppose he may get larger with age)...

My point is... If his defense is as good as it seems and his power/contact continues to develop doesn't that make him a weapon?

Somehow he went from a 1.8dWAR to a 0.0dWAR. Probably because the year before he was the one playing in RF in the shift because Manny was hurt the end of the year. Actually I guarantee you that's the reason. Manny is just a dWAR vulture :vader:. If Schoop had been gobbling up those balls in RF in the shift, then he could've padded his stats up to be a 3 WAR player overall.

That's some video game stuff right there.