You Don't Finish Last...

[Frobby]

31 minutes ago, birdwatcher55 said:

Pretty obvious to me. This team folded. It quit. Very unBuck like. Personal  stats became the priority. Selfish approach. Players dogging it. Adam wants another audience with the owner. What more evidence do you need?? This was a manager who lost control of his team.

Not buying it.     It's very easy when a team goes into a hitting slump to say they are having a "selfish approach."    What's selfish about not getting on base?    How does that help the player?   If "personal stats were the priority," they sure did a bad job of it, as more than half the players in the lineup had their worst OPS of any month this year during September.    The team hit fewer homers in September than in any other month, and less than half the number they hit in August.

Baseball's a crazy game.   Last year's team averaged 6.61 runs a game in June, then 3.42 runs/game in July.    This year's team averaged 6.03 runs a game in August, then 2.96 in September. That's the way it goes sometimes, but to me it doesn't mean the team has quit or players are suddenly being selfish.      Often, it means the opposite -- that players are pressing and it's counterproductive.   

As to Jones asking to meet with the owner, I don't see what that has to do with Buck.    Jones did that last year after we made the playoffs.

[weams]

58 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Not buying it.     It's very easy when a team goes into a hitting slump to say they are having a "selfish approach."    What's selfish about not getting on base?    How does that help the player?   If "personal stats were the priority," they sure did a bad job of it, as more than half the players in the lineup had their worst OPS of any month this year during September.    The team hit fewer homers in September than in any other month, and less than half the number they hit in August.

Baseball's a crazy game.   Last year's team averaged 6.61 runs a game in June, then 3.42 runs/game in July.    This year's team averaged 6.03 runs a game in August, then 2.96 in September. That's the way it goes sometimes, but to me it doesn't mean the team has quit or players are suddenly being selfish.      Often, it means the opposite -- that players are pressing and it's counterproductive.   

As to Jones asking to meet with the owner, I don't see what that has to do with Buck.    Jones did that last year after we made the playoffs.

Jones is going into his free agent year. I would assume most of what he has to say is based on that.

[FlipTheBird]

1 hour ago, Frobby said:

Not buying it.     It's very easy when a team goes into a hitting slump to say they are having a "selfish approach."    What's selfish about not getting on base?    How does that help the player?   If "personal stats were the priority," they sure did a bad job of it, as more than half the players in the lineup had their worst OPS of any month this year during September.    The team hit fewer homers in September than in any other month, and less than half the number they hit in August.

Baseball's a crazy game.   Last year's team averaged 6.61 runs a game in June, then 3.42 runs/game in July.    This year's team averaged 6.03 runs a game in August, then 2.96 in September. That's the way it goes sometimes, but to me it doesn't mean the team has quit or players are suddenly being selfish.      Often, it means the opposite -- that players are pressing and it's counterproductive.   

As to Jones asking to meet with the owner, I don't see what that has to do with Buck.    Jones did that last year after we made the playoffs.

I'm with you. Do I think some guys might have mailed it in a bit as soon as the playoff chances started looking remote? Sure. But I don't think anyone was out there "being selfish" or anything of that nature. They were just cooked. A lot of teams go off the cliff as soon as it's apparent the playoffs are out of the question.

[Frobby]

3 minutes ago, FlipTheBird said:

I'm with you. Do I think some guys might have mailed it in a bit as soon as the playoff chances started looking remote? Sure. But I don't think anyone was out there "being selfish" or anything of that nature. They were just cooked. A lot of teams go off the cliff as soon as it's apparent the playoffs are out of the question.

Let's not forget that -- as many posters here were demanding -- we started seeing a good bit of some of the younger players towards the end.   Were they being selfish?    Had they quit?

[joelala]

5 hours ago, Frobby said:

Not buying it.     It's very easy when a team goes into a hitting slump to say they are having a "selfish approach."    What's selfish about not getting on base?    How does that help the player?   If "personal stats were the priority," they sure did a bad job of it, as more than half the players in the lineup had their worst OPS of any month this year during September.    The team hit fewer homers in September than in any other month, and less than half the number they hit in August.

Baseball's a crazy game.   Last year's team averaged 6.61 runs a game in June, then 3.42 runs/game in July.    This year's team averaged 6.03 runs a game in August, then 2.96 in September. That's the way it goes sometimes, but to me it doesn't mean the team has quit or players are suddenly being selfish.      Often, it means the opposite -- that players are pressing and it's counterproductive.   

As to Jones asking to meet with the owner, I don't see what that has to do with Buck.    Jones did that last year after we made the playoffs.

No response needed from me.  This will suffice.

[OFFNY]

8 hours ago, birdwatcher55 said:

 

Pretty obvious to me. This team folded. It quit. Very unBuck like. Personal stats became the priority. Selfish approach. Players dogging it. Adam wants another audience with the owner. What more evidence do you need ??? This was a manager who lost control of his team.

 

o

 

You also said that you thought that the team quit on Showalter on June 15th:

 

http://forum.orioleshangout.com/forums/index.php?/topic/29084-tt-how-bad-are-the-orioles/&page=5&tab=comments#comment-2145521

 

If that were the case, I don't think that they would have managed to go on the 11-4 spurt that they did between August 21st and September 5th ...... unless you believe that he lost the clubhouse early in the season, regained it in the middle of the season, and then lost it again late in the season.

 

o

[weams]

45 minutes ago, OFFNY said:

o

 

You also said that you thought that the team quit on Showalter on June 15th:

 

http://forum.orioleshangout.com/forums/index.php?/topic/29084-tt-how-bad-are-the-orioles/&page=5&tab=comments#comment-2145521

 

If that were the case, I don't think that they would have managed to go on the 11-4 spurt that they did between August 21st and September 5th ...... unless you believe that he lost the clubhouse early in the season, regained it in the middle of the season, and then lost it again late in the season.

 

o

 

Maybe the Orioles are not the poster's first love?

[OFFNY]

30 minutes ago, weams said:

 

Maybe the Orioles are not the poster's first love?

 

o

 

I have no idea what his primary fandom is, but I don't want to get off on a tangent.

I'm suggesting that sometimes we assume certain things to necessarily be true because of a gut instinct that we have, and then when we think them through further we get dispelled of said beliefs (or at least question them with the possibly that they may not be accurate, instead of continuing to simply assume that they are true.)

 

o

[Gman!!]

It goes deeper than making up run differential. Girardi selection of starting pitching would not have gone so long with Ulbaldo, Tilman & Miley.. Buck doesn’t know when a pitcher is done. Pulls them way too late.  Also the philosophy of swinging for the fences when just moving a runner over would make the difference in close games..Plate disipline non exsistent, very few walks. Would have set Davis down.. never a clutch hit.. ever notice 99% of his HRs were in games that either O’s were up by or dwn by a bunch. Very seldom any positive impact on the game. His glove yes but should have been a DH for him hehe... 193 Ks  in 127 games with a .215 average COME ON! The 35 games he missed were the best impact O’s could hope for... better selection of hitting & pitching coaches.. no spark in this team. It’s too bad! Not saying the O’s would have been a totally great team this yr with a different manage.. just saying Girardi would have got more out of them.. 30+ yrs of falling short.. got to believe this org only cares about getting close some years by buying rocks & hope for gems.. not quite working out

[sportsfan8703]

On 10/3/2017 at 11:00 AM, 1968_bills_fan said:

The fat lady has sung and sat down.  Time to clean house.  Time to draft well and sell off several too-expensive toys and go with young guys.  We finished in last frigging place. 

We lost 19 of 23. Before then we were win and, and a white sox save earlier in the afternoon, from being tied with Minnesota. 

We had the worst SP in baseball. Pretty obvious this team had a huge let down, or maybe just ran out of gas in September. 

I was impressed with the intensity this team came out of the break with. Even the first comeback against the Cubs in game one. They just couldn't overcome the terrible SP. 

[OFFNY]

On 10/4/2017 at 7:41 AM, birdwatcher55 said:

 

Pretty obvious to me. This team folded. It quit. Very unBuck like. Personal  stats became the priority. Selfish approach. Players dogging it. Adam wants another audience with the owner. What more evidence do you need?? This was a manager who lost control of his team.

 

 

 

18 hours ago, OFFNY said:

o

 

You also said that you thought that the team quit on Showalter on June 15th:

 

http://forum.orioleshangout.com/forums/index.php?/topic/29084-tt-how-bad-are-the-orioles/&page=5&tab=comments#comment-2145521

 

If that were the case, I don't think that they would have managed to go on the 11-4 spurt that they did between August 21st and September 5th ...... unless you believe that he lost the clubhouse early in the season, regained it in the middle of the season, and then lost it again late in the season.

 

o

 

 

3 hours ago, birdwatcher55 said:

 

I don't think I was alone in my opinion that this team dogged it from time to time this season. So if you want to play, this demented 20-20 hindsight game your famous for on this board, check out the month of September. How did that go down for you? Stick with stats. You're good at that. Otherwise go troll somewhere else.

 

o

 

I quoted and commented your exact words and claims. Nothing about what I stated was twisted, disported, or manipulated.

You said that Showalter lost the clubhouse in June, and you stated it again more recently. Joelala asked you if you had evidence of your most recent claim, Frobby gave specific reasons why he didn't buy it, and I gave a specific reason why I believed that said claims were questionable.

 

None of the above is trolling or "demented." If you don't like being questioned about and/or asked to explain sweeping claims that you make, then don't make them. If you do, then you have no reason to pull the trolling card if somebody questions and/or refutes those claims.

 

o

[OFFNY]

13 hours ago, OFFNY said:

o

 

I quoted and commented your exact words and claims. Nothing about what I stated was twisted, disported, or manipulated.

You said that Showalter lost the clubhouse in June, and you stated it again more recently. Joelala asked you if you had evidence of your most recent claim, Frobby gave specific reasons why he didn't buy it, and I gave a specific reason why I believed that said claims were questionable.

 

None of the above is trolling or "demented." If you don't like being questioned about and/or asked to explain sweeping claims that you make, then don't make them. If you do, then you have no reason to pull the trolling card if somebody questions and/or refutes those claims.

 

o

 

 

6 hours ago, birdwatcher55 said:

 

Go work for MSNBC. You will fit in well with those other trolls.

 

o

 

You not liking others undermining and/or questioning your claims does not equate trolling ....... it's you not liking being undermined and/or questioned about claims that you make.

 

o

[Reboulet'sStache]

Dan needs to go.  Posters on this board have been pointing out this day coming for years now.  He Chinese tortured this organization to death for minimal to no gains. Much of this is Peter.  But even within a bad structure, you can have somebody that makes the most of it.  And Dan isn't that somebody. 

[OFFNY]

 

3 hours ago, birdwatcher55 said:

 

LOL...from someone like you, who wrote the book on trolling, I'm pissing my pants laughing. 

 

 

 

3 hours ago, birdwatcher55 said:

 

Your the only person I see who is trolling. You have this sick, twisted need to try and make people look foolish on this board to stoke your own ego and make everyone believe your the authority on All Things Orioles. Your snobbish attitude is boring and your propensity for sticking your nose in arguments to fuel your own reputation is pathetic. I made a series of comments and beliefs that I hold true and explained to the other posters in question. You interjecting yourself in the conversation offered zero credibility and only highlighted your ignorance.

 

o

 

I didn't see an argument of which you claim that I "stuck my nose" into. I saw Joelala question your claim, Frobby stating why he didn't buy it, and myself giving a specific reason as to why I found it to be questionable.

 

There's nothing trolling, "demented", or snobbish about anything that I said. As I just stated, I didn't twist or distort anything that you said. They were your words, and I didn't take anything that you said out of context. You being displeased about it does not equate trolling.

 

o

[OFFNY]

3 hours ago, OFFNY said:

o

 

I didn't see an argument of which you claim that I "stuck my nose" into. I saw Joelala question your claim, Frobby stating why he didn't buy it, and myself giving a specific reason as to why I found it to be questionable.

 

There's nothing trolling, "demented", or snobbish about anything that I said. As I just stated, I didn't twist or distort anything that you said. They were your words, and I didn't take anything that you said out of context. You being displeased about it does not equate trolling.

 

o

 

 

14 minutes ago, birdwatcher55 said:

 

Adjust your bifocals.

 

o

 

No refutation of anything that I stated, all of which was as clear as day. 

End of story.

 

o