Astros Should Give Orioles What They Want for Britton

[Tx Oriole]

1 hour ago, bobmc said:

JustD seeks him out when she needs her diamond ring (AKA cubic zirconia) adjusted....

Needs her what adjusted? 

[Tx Oriole]

1 hour ago, NickM21 said:

If the Astros make the trade for Britton do they still make the trade for Verlander? I'm not so sure. I think it's reasonable to think that they are better off with Verlander than Britton.

I would think so. Verlander more important than Zach. 

[ArtVanDelay]

5 hours ago, phillyOs119 said:

Britton 2015-2016 was as elite as they come, one of the top 5 relievers in baseball would be a fair assessment. He would have commanded a large return before his arm issues this past year.

Top 5 for sure but not on the Chapman/Jansen/Miller level. 

[ArtVanDelay]

6 hours ago, tntoriole said:

This is just flat out wrong.  Zach's WAR in 2014, 2015, 2016 cumulative was 9.3 including his best season in 2016 of 4.3     Kenley Jansen is nowhere near this...nowhere.  His WAR during those same three seasons 2014-2016 was 1.2, 1.4 and 2.5 for a total of 5.1.      Zach was not only better than Jansen every single year from 2014-2016, he was so much better that it is not even close...and in the AL East, not the NL West.

 

Discussions about Miller and Chapman are different discussions as Chapman's cumulative WAR from 2014-2016 was 7.1  and Miller's WAR from 2014-2016 was 8.0...but even there, a more than reasonable argument could be made that from 2014-2016 cumulatively there was no more valuable reliever in the majors than Zach Britton.  

bWAR is broken for pitchers.  Brad Brach and Chris Archer had the same bWAR this year. 

[Roll Tide]

8 hours ago, ArtVanDelay said:

Top 5 for sure but not on the Chapman/Jansen/Miller level. 

Britton's return would've eclipsed those if he had been healthy and dominant. The Dodgers and Astros were in and there was also interest by the teams you wouldn't expect us to deal with.

[bobmc]

13 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

Nope, they are going for it!

Miles and miles of Miley!  And Tilly toiling....

[wildbillhiccup]

59 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

Britton's return would've eclipsed those if he had been healthy and dominant. The Dodgers and Astros were in and there was also interest by the teams you wouldn't expect us to deal with.

It really wouldn't have. The strikeout rates of those other pitchers make them more elite than Britton. If you take off the orange covered glasses it's really pretty cut and dry. He's a good pitcher (when healthy), but Chapman, Jansen, and MIller are on a slightly higher level. 

[Redskins Rick]

18 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

95%?

Some people are just unrealistically optimistic.

Sure, but isn't that better, than the alternative?

Is there factual evidence yet, that his career is over?

[Frobby]

12 hours ago, ArtVanDelay said:

bWAR is broken for pitchers.  Brad Brach and Chris Archer had the same bWAR this year. 

So?   Archer didn’t have a particularly good year.   Frankly, he’s kind of overrated.   Big arm, dominant at times, but seems to melt down if you apply enough pressure.   

[ArtVanDelay]

1 hour ago, Frobby said:

So?   Archer didn’t have a particularly good year.   Frankly, he’s kind of overrated.   Big arm, dominant at times, but seems to melt down if you apply enough pressure.   

How did he not have a good year?  3.40 FIP in 200 innings, 249 Ks.   Those are ace numbers.

bWAR has an ace and an above average reliever as equals.

[Roll Tide]

6 hours ago, wildbillhiccup said:

It really wouldn't have. The strikeout rates of those other pitchers make them more elite than Britton. If you take off the orange covered glasses it's really pretty cut and dry. He's a good pitcher (when healthy), but Chapman, Jansen, and MIller are on a slightly higher level. 

We will have to agree to disagree .... where are the Orange colored glasses?

2016 2-1  0.54 era 47/47 saves in 69 innings.

Chapman best era 1.54 (2012) , saves 38 (2012 & 2013)

Since Zach became the closer in 2014 he's lost 5 games. In the same period Chapman has lost 12.

have to admit ...Chapman does have more Ks...but that's about it

 

[Going Underground]

2 hours ago, Frobby said:

So?   Archer didn’t have a particularly good year.   Frankly, he’s kind of overrated.   Big arm, dominant at times, but seems to melt down if you apply enough pressure.   

I hope Gausman  does not have the same trajectory.

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, ArtVanDelay said:

How did he not have a good year?  3.40 FIP in 200 innings, 249 Ks.   Those are ace numbers.

bWAR has an ace and an above average reliever as equals.

Because I don’t care what his FIP is or how many strikeouts he had.   I care more about his actual ERA and, as I said, the fact that he seems to wilt under pressure quite often.   

[ArtVanDelay]

7 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Because I don’t care what his FIP is or how many strikeouts he had.   I care more about his actual ERA and, as I said, the fact that he seems to wilt under pressure quite often.   

So he should be penalized for getting unlucky?  His BABIP was also 30 points higher than his career average.  I guess you’d rather have someone like Ervin Santana. 

[ArtVanDelay]

9 minutes ago, Going Underground said:

I hope Gausman  does not have the same trajectory.

You hope Gausman doesn’t become one of the 10 or 12 best starters in baseball?