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After Trading Machado...

Dark Helmet

By Dark Helmet
in Orioles Talk

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Yardball85 Hangout Veteran Council

Yardball85

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Posted
15 minutes ago, theocean said:

I agree with you. The team has to start signing young players they believe in to extensions early. It is the only way this team will be able to keep their star players long term. 

Think of Goldschmidt, Yelich, Archer, Kluber, Bumgarner, Sale, Rizzo, Altuve - and even Trout. Those contracts are incredibly valuable.

I know it's the offseason and its easy to get excited about trading everyone for prospects - but I don't think anybody wants the O's to be run like the Oakland A's where every player is traded once they hit their second year of arbitration. Ultimately, this team needs to get better at locking up promising players that locks them up for a year or two of free agency.

Excellent post.

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Yardball85 Hangout Veteran Council

Yardball85

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4 minutes ago, backwardsk said:

Schoop only has two more seasons under team control.

Yup.  You could make the argument that while Schoop isn't quite the impact player Machado is, this would be the offseason to either trade or sign him too.  We are already seeing the huge difference in value between a player with one cheap year left versus 2, i.e. if we had traded Manny last year.

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Roll Tide Hangout Grand Counsel

Roll Tide

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40 minutes ago, joelala said:

Yea this is more important than re-signing guys.  Also figuring out our Manager/GM situation.  If Dan is our guy, give him a new contract so he can put a plan in place.

Buck said he wants to manage after 2018 so I’m betting that’s resolved

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ThomasTomasz Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

ThomasTomasz

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57 minutes ago, theocean said:

I agree with you. The team has to start signing young players they believe in to extensions early. It is the only way this team will be able to keep their star players long term. 

Think of Goldschmidt, Yelich, Archer, Kluber, Bumgarner, Sale, Rizzo, Altuve - and even Trout. Those contracts are incredibly valuable.

I know it's the offseason and its easy to get excited about trading everyone for prospects - but I don't think anybody wants the O's to be run like the Oakland A's where every player is traded once they hit their second year of arbitration. Ultimately, this team needs to get better at locking up promising players that locks them up for a year or two of free agency.

Duquette said he hadn't talked extension for 2-3 years with Machado's side.  

Now, I am just guessing here, but I bet Angelos is staunchly against this, because while so many other teams are using this kind of contract to great effect- and buying more of the prime years of guys doing it- we have not.  Notice our stellar record in arbitration year after year?  I think ownership believes in that process, paying a guy year to year, instead of getting them locked up and running the risk that they regress.  

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theocean Major Leaguer

theocean

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1 minute ago, ThomasTomasz said:

Duquette said he hadn't talked extension for 2-3 years with Machado's side.  

Now, I am just guessing here, but I bet Angelos is staunchly against this, because while so many other teams are using this kind of contract to great effect- and buying more of the prime years of guys doing it- we have not.  Notice our stellar record in arbitration year after year?  I think ownership believes in that process, paying a guy year to year, instead of getting them locked up and running the risk that they regress.  

I think your guess might be reality. Certainly seems that way, doesn't it?

In my opinion, a healthy organization should draft well, have a good farm system, lock up young players who appear promising long-term before they get too expensive, have a consistent flow of talent being promoted from the minors to majors, and keep around some veterans to keep the clubhouse together and provide leadership.

The Orioles are unfortunately exactly the opposite of that.

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LA2 Hangout Grand Counsel

LA2

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3 hours ago, esmd said:

Not necessarily.  They can backfill him with a guy like Moustakas or Frazier, and use the trade of Manny to fill our the rotation and try to remain competitive.  Or they can go full rebuild.  Up to them really.

At this point, I'd favor full rebuild, because even if they retool and somehow can be a winning team, I still think they're looking at a best case of 3rd place in the division and a 2nd WC.  And that's if they're lucky and everything goes right.

I like this attitude: admit we blew it with Manny, fahgeddabout it and try to trade him to a NL team or at least another division, backfill at third, and build plus value elsewhere on the field. Also wish the high command realizes the ways in which it has to prioritize the long-term fortunes of the team over an OK W-L record in 2018.

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Frobby Hangout Grand Counsel

Frobby

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22 minutes ago, ThomasTomasz said:

Duquette said he hadn't talked extension for 2-3 years with Machado's side.  

Now, I am just guessing here, but I bet Angelos is staunchly against this, because while so many other teams are using this kind of contract to great effect- and buying more of the prime years of guys doing it- we have not.  Notice our stellar record in arbitration year after year?  I think ownership believes in that process, paying a guy year to year, instead of getting them locked up and running the risk that they regress.  

The one time the O’s locked up a young player before he ever went through arbitration (Nick Markakis), it ended up being a mild overpay.    But I still think it’s a wise strategy with a young, talented player.    

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NATTYBO's Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

NATTYBO's

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We need pitching and my guess is the price tags of FA's are out of our budget.  Our lineup is still decent without Manny.  Trade Manny and Britton and you should be able to get talet to fill our SP holes and you will have 25-30MM in payroll flexibility

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25 Nuggets Hangout Grand Counsel

25 Nuggets

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1 minute ago, Frobby said:

The one time the O’s locked up a young player before he ever went through arbitration (Nick Markakis), it ended up being a mild overpay.    But I still think it’s a wise strategy with a young, talented player.    

It's almost become standard operating prodecure with mid market teams.  Even some large market teams (Angels w/ Trout).

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backwardsk Hangout Grand Counsel

backwardsk

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48 minutes ago, ThomasTomasz said:

Duquette said he hadn't talked extension for 2-3 years with Machado's side.  

Now, I am just guessing here, but I bet Angelos is staunchly against this, because while so many other teams are using this kind of contract to great effect- and buying more of the prime years of guys doing it- we have not.  Notice our stellar record in arbitration year after year?  I think ownership believes in that process, paying a guy year to year, instead of getting them locked up and running the risk that they regress.  

They extended both Markakis and Adam Jones.

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ORIOLE33 Major Leaguer Rising Star

ORIOLE33

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2 hours ago, clapdiddy said:

I would include Schoop as well.   I said in another thread...I don't think his value will be any higher than it is right now.

Oh come on. Could you please explain why we should remain Oriole fans if as soon as a player gets good, we’re trading them away?

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