Catchers

[Aristotelian]

You can't have an all star at every position. I am fine with Caleb's 1.6 WAR in 2017. Throughout his career the pitchers have almost universally done better with him than either Wieters or Castillo. If he can repeat that, he is worth every penny of his $1.25M this year.  

[Luke-OH]

2 hours ago, VICIOUS said:

I was at the Blue Jay game on Thursday in Sarasota, 3rd row directly behind home plate. Sisco  didn't make a single decent throw to second ( either on steal attempts or on throw downs after warm up tosses....not a single throw). Susac made better throws. Sisco is going to be a huge liability on D. ( and i'm not a huge fan of Joseph either). We should add someone else.

 

Yeah I hear ya, Sisco isn’t good at throwing to 2B. He wasn’t particularly wild with his throws that I saw in AAA last year but he has a slow release.

The question becomes, how much does throwing matter for a catcher? If you believe Baseball Prospectus’s data, not much. For example, let’s say Sisco is the worst catcher in the majors at throwing out runners, that would make him worth only 2.5 runs less than Joseph, the difference in hitting ability is at least twice as valuable. The real test for Sisco IMO is whether he’ll be able to frame reasonably well and to a lessor extent block, he looks better than Wieters at framing but that’s not saying much.

https://legacy.baseballprospectus.com/sortable/index.php?cid=1899569

 

[VICIOUS]

I hope you are right

 

 

[Rene88]

On 3/9/2018 at 9:29 PM, Luke-OH said:

Yeah I hear ya, Sisco isn’t good at throwing to 2B. He wasn’t particularly wild with his throws that I saw in AAA last year but he has a slow release.

The question becomes, how much does throwing matter for a catcher? If you believe Baseball Prospectus’s data, not much. For example, let’s say Sisco is the worst catcher in the majors at throwing out runners, that would make him worth only 2.5 runs less than Joseph, the difference in hitting ability is at least twice as valuable. The real test for Sisco IMO is whether he’ll be able to frame reasonably well and to a lessor extent block, he looks better than Wieters at framing but that’s not saying much.

https://legacy.baseballprospectus.com/sortable/index.php?cid=1899569

 

IMO there is no way Sisco makes this team as a backup, nor should he. He belong starting every day in Norfolk working on his D (and satifying Buck). If Joseph gets hurt, he gets his shot. That simple and that is the way it will be.

I would be shocked if it isn't Wynn as the backup but the SF Giants guy looks decent and he has more experience at major league level. It will be one of those two.

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, Rene88 said:

IMO there is no way Sisco makes this team as a backup, nor should he. He belong starting every day in Norfolk working on his D (and satifying Buck). If Joseph gets hurt, he gets his shot. That simple and that is the way it will be.

I would be shocked if it isn't Wynn as the backup but the SF Giants guy looks decent and he has more experience at major league level. It will be one of those two.

What if he's the strong side of a platoon?

I certainly don't want him catching 120+ games this year.

[Rene88]

Just now, Can_of_corn said:

What if he's the strong side of a platoon?

I certainly don't want him catching 120+ games this year.

Hitting he is...Buck isn't going to platoon him...YET. But agreed, I think that is the best scenario. I just don't think it happens right off the bat.

[Legend_Of_Joey]

Sisco has looked great hitting (driving the ball really well too, not just singles and cheap hits), Wynns has been great defensively (going 4-4 on "caught stealing" until Anurey Tavares was successful today. @Tony-OH said the batter got in the way), Susac has held his own after missing almost 2 weeks, and Joseph has been getting hit after hit after hit.

If it was feasible, a 3 catcher slot would work. Joseph and Wynns behind the plate, Sisco DH'ing/PH. Sisco could PH late for Joseph and Wynns could be the defensive replacement.

[Frobby]

Joseph has hit very well this spring.    I do think Sisco will get the other spot.   And he’ll play plenty.

[Legend_Of_Joey]

1 hour ago, Frobby said:

Joseph has hit very well this spring.    I do think Sisco will get the other spot.   And he’ll play plenty.

Sisco has gotten the most playing time so far, along with being the starter in nearly all the "home" games and almost all the "away" games too.

Guess I should start saving up for @Luke-OH beers at Bowie...

[OriolesMagic83]

On 3/9/2018 at 2:20 PM, Legend_Of_Joey said:

Caleb will be fine for who he is. Remember when he had to fill in for Weiters for nearly 2 seasons due to injuries?

Remember how everyone wanted to write him off last season due to his 2016?

No one is expecting him to be the next Rick Dempsey. Joseph will be fine, playing catcher (behind the plate)/mentor (to whoever the rookie back up is)/tour guide (for the pitchers who need to get it near the plate.)

If defense is mainly the focus of the back up and they want Joseph to start the majority, Wynns will get it. Then maybe in June/July, depending how the playoff race is going, you might see Sisco come up and make some starts and take over as the main catcher with Wynns as the backup, especially in July/August if they are very out of it.

I think you have forgotten how bad Dempsey was with the bat.  He had a lifetime .666 OPS with a .233 average.  He didn't have a 24 year career because of his bat.  I'm happy with Joseph as the starter and mentor for Sisco.  I much prefer Joseph to Sisco.

[Frobby]

5 hours ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

I think you have forgotten how bad Dempsey was with the bat.  He had a lifetime .666 OPS with a .233 average.  He didn't have a 24 year career because of his bat.  I'm happy with Joseph as the starter and mentor for Sisco.  I much prefer Joseph to Sisco.

I think the concept of “starter” is going to go out the window, and time will be split almost exactly 50/50 when it’s all said and done.  

[sportsfan8703]

Do we have a C that doesn’t have 1,000+ OPS in ST. Sisco is raking. He’s a darkhorse for the leadoff spot. 

[wildbillhiccup]

11 hours ago, Legend_Of_Joey said:

Sisco has looked great hitting (driving the ball really well too, not just singles and cheap hits), Wynns has been great defensively (going 4-4 on "caught stealing" until Anurey Tavares was successful today. @Tony-OH said the batter got in the way), Susac has held his own after missing almost 2 weeks, and Joseph has been getting hit after hit after hit.

If it was feasible, a 3 catcher slot would work. Joseph and Wynns behind the plate, Sisco DH'ing/PH. Sisco could PH late for Joseph and Wynns could be the defensive replacement.

...or if only we hadn't clogged up our DH spot with Mark "3.14" Trumbo (sigh). Agree with this assessment though. Joseph / Wynns on the ML roster and Sisco to AAA. If the team doesn't see Sisco as a long term option at C I really hope they try him at different positions because the kid can hit. 

[twinedenter]

On 3/9/2018 at 6:51 PM, VICIOUS said:

I was at the Blue Jay game on Thursday in Sarasota, 3rd row directly behind home plate. Sisco  didn't make a single decent throw to second ( either on steal attempts or on throw downs after warm up tosses....not a single throw). Susac made better throws. Sisco is going to be a huge liability on D. ( and i'm not a huge fan of Joseph either). We should add someone else.

 

I was at the game vs Rays and Sisco threw out 2 would-be basestealers and made a nice play on a throw from Jones that was up the line. 

[bird watcher]

15 hours ago, Frobby said:

Joseph has hit very well this spring.    I do think Sisco will get the other spot.   And he’ll play plenty.

Joseph has hit well.  He was an offensive force at times in the minors so I've always hoped he would be in MLB too.  Splitting time with Sisco would be my choice.