Fangraphs: O’s have zero of the top 131 prospects in baseball.

[joelala]

Is it even possible to execute a succesful rebuild without participating at all in the international market? Serious question.

I'm thinking about it, and the Astros seem to have very few players (Marwin Gonzalez and Yuli Gurriel) who they acquired internationally.  So i guess they are an example of sorts. 

[joelala]

17 minutes ago, joelala said:

Is it even possible to execute a succesful rebuild without participating at all in the international market? Serious question.

I'm thinking about it, and the Astros seem to have very few players (Marwin Gonzalez and Yuli Gurriel) who they acquired internationally.  So i guess they are an example of sorts. 

And Altuve.  Just a slight omission there

[LookitsPuck]

Dan Duquette, ladies and gents. 

[Bradysburns]

On 6/12/2018 at 6:36 PM, hoosiers said:

We are about the weakest participants internationally in all of mlb and have forfeited picks to sign Jimenez and Gallardo and traded picks to shed BMat and Ryan - that's the equivalent of four top 50 picks not in our system.  Some teams, like the Braves, have about 10 guys better than pretty much anyone in our system.

The lack of Latin scouting and signing really irks me. There's NO point to Peter's "protest" of the Caribbean system with its hucksters, etc. 

And you're probably right about the Braves. But let's flip it around. Some teams have zero prospects with elite potential, like KC. Their fourth-ranked guy, Foster Griffin... I don't know much about Griffin, but is he really so much better than Harvey, Hayes, Mountcastle, Mullins, et al, that it's definitive? I think not. 

4) Foster Griffin, LHP, Grade B-/C+: Age 22, first round pick in 2014, disappointing for two years but made big progress in ’17, posting 3.35 ERA with 141/54 K/BB in 161 innings between High-A and Double-A; low-90s fastball; Texas League observers impressed with the quality of his curveball and change-up; showed better command and confidence on the mound; possible number four starter and perhaps a three if he can develop a bit more consistency. ETA late 2018.

[Luke-OH]

Some rationale from one of the two Fangraphs prospect guys.

DJ

3:30

When FG determines it's top 100 (or 131) does it use a different methodology than other sites, like BA, Pipeline, etc.? I ask just because as an O's fan I see guys like Austin Hays and Ryan Mountcastle well inside their top-100s but neither can even break your top-131. Hays in particular seems like he is being penalized for shoulder and ankle injuries that have bothered him since ST.

 

Eric A Longenhagen

3:33

I just think we weigh the approach issues those two have more heavily than other outlets. We view each of those guys as corner bats with over-aggressive approaches and would rather have corner guys with patience/power, which is why you see guys like Zack Collins toward the back of the 100 and not Mountcastle. I think it's fine that this difference exists, it clearly does in the big leagues (just look up and down Baltimore's roster, it's full of guys like this who hit for power and don't walk)

 

[hoosiers]

12 hours ago, Bradysburns said:

The lack of Latin scouting and signing really irks me. There's NO point to Peter's "protest" of the Caribbean system with its hucksters, etc. 

And you're probably right about the Braves. But let's flip it around. Some teams have zero prospects with elite potential, like KC. Their fourth-ranked guy, Foster Griffin... I don't know much about Griffin, but is he really so much better than Harvey, Hayes, Mountcastle, Mullins, et al, that it's definitive? I think not. 

4) Foster Griffin, LHP, Grade B-/C+: Age 22, first round pick in 2014, disappointing for two years but made big progress in ’17, posting 3.35 ERA with 141/54 K/BB in 161 innings between High-A and Double-A; low-90s fastball; Texas League observers impressed with the quality of his curveball and change-up; showed better command and confidence on the mound; possible number four starter and perhaps a three if he can develop a bit more consistency. ETA late 2018.

The Os entered this season with a pre-season ranking of minors talent of 17.  So, there are quite a few organizations with very little substance in the minors including, as you note, KC - which BA ranked 29th.  Boston just graduated JBJ, Betts, Devers, Benintendi and others to the majors the past few years and actually have a fairly empty system as do the DBacks, Mets, Cubs, Mariners and several others …. so many clubs at the top of the minor league talent are loaded - in particular, the Braves, Yankees, Padres, White Sox, Rays, Brewers, and Phillies.  Some of these top systems have tremendous high-end talent and depth where others might have more of one (White Sox with high end talent) or depth. 

I do find it difficult to believe that someone believes the Os don't have any of the top 131, because I don't think the system is empty at all.  It is more lacking in high-end talent esp given Cisco graduating to the majors and Hays struggles and Mountcastle's injury.  Hopefully, we do pick up a couple of top prospects on all lists when we deal Machado and, hopefully, Britton.

[Bradysburns]

On 6/15/2018 at 12:02 AM, hoosiers said:

The Os entered this season with a pre-season ranking of minors talent of 17.  So, there are quite a few organizations with very little substance in the minors including, as you note, KC - which BA ranked 29th.  Boston just graduated JBJ, Betts, Devers, Benintendi and others to the majors the past few years and actually have a fairly empty system as do the DBacks, Mets, Cubs, Mariners and several others …. so many clubs at the top of the minor league talent are loaded - in particular, the Braves, Yankees, Padres, White Sox, Rays, Brewers, and Phillies.  Some of these top systems have tremendous high-end talent and depth where others might have more of one (White Sox with high end talent) or depth. 

I do find it difficult to believe that someone believes the Os don't have any of the top 131, because I don't think the system is empty at all.  It is more lacking in high-end talent esp given Cisco graduating to the majors and Hays struggles and Mountcastle's injury.  Hopefully, we do pick up a couple of top prospects on all lists when we deal Machado and, hopefully, Britton.

Apologies for the delayed reply... But everything you say makes sense. I really hope they trade Manny and Britton. If they don't come away with a sizable haul, it's on them. Because Manny and Britton (if he rounds into form... big if) are two potentially season-altering talents for almost any contending team. The O's have the gunpowder. Let's see how big of a boom they can make. 

I'd hope at least two players who can start contributing to the big league club immediately... if only for plus defense, etc. But if they wind up with two immediate contributors (even bench players, bullpen arms, etc.) plus one reasonably high-level prospect, I'd be okay with that, depending on certain variables. 

[sportsfan8703]

On 6/13/2018 at 10:44 PM, joelala said:

Is it even possible to execute a succesful rebuild without participating at all in the international market? Serious question.

I'm thinking about it, and the Astros seem to have very few players (Marwin Gonzalez and Yuli Gurriel) who they acquired internationally.  So i guess they are an example of sorts. 

I don’t think so. You’re not participating in half of the talent grab. The 2019 & 2020 drafts better have some high end prospects. 

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, sportsfan8703 said:

I don’t think so. You’re not participating in half of the talent grab. The 2019 & 2020 drafts better have some high end prospects. 

The optimistic sorts out there can hope this downturn and inevitable rebuild leads to a change in policy when it comes to the international market.

[pastorfan]

On 6/12/2018 at 12:43 AM, ORIOLE33 said:

This should change by next year.

Why?

[joelala]

7 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

The optimistic sorts out there can hope this downturn and inevitable rebuild leads to a change in policy when it comes to the international market.

That would be amazing.

[ORIOLE33]

7 hours ago, pastorfan said:

Why?

I don’t know, number one pick?