Rutschman: Let’s Make a Deal

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

That;s surprising.  I always thought that Tampa had developed most of their pitching.  Well the O's will definitely need to supplement their few pitching prospects w/ smart trades and probably cheaper free agents (based on what we have seen so far).

What you are Frobby are saying isn't entirely incompatible.

When he says that six were acquired in trade that includes players who were still in the minors and that were, to some degree, developed by the Rays.

[Just Regular]

I am kind of proud of the 2021 Rays for buying Cruz.   As with any transaction decently ahead of the actual deadline, I feel they paid the seller's price to get their guy.   I am sorry for their clubhouse they didn't get to keep Diego Castillo for this year's run, but I guess every yin has its yang.

I feel the essence of what Tampa does is about run prevention.   Home grown to them is literally every baseball throwing homo sapien in the high minors.    I believe they are better than almost everyone on finding an attribute set in any AAA schmo, and mapping how to use that to beat Aaron Judge any given weekend.     They are of course excellent at hidden defense/baserunning value arb doesn't pay.

I saw Nick Anderson get a Save the other day, but curious to see if they'll nurse him on to their roster next week.

[HowAboutThat]

1 hour ago, Moose Milligan said:

You guys are so obsessed over "models" and I can't be the only one who finds this **** obnoxious.

"No, you guys, he's following the Astros model."

"Well this is what the Rays did and this is what Elias has done so clearly he's following the Rays model, duh"

"Astros model!"

"No, RAYS MODEL!"

"ASTROS MODEL!!!!!1111"

"Rays!!!!!"

"ASTROS DUH come on thats where he got a lot of his experience, it only makes sense that he's going to follow the ASTROS MODEL!!!!!  If the Astros didn't do it when they were building their team, Elias isn't going to do it!!!"

Did it occur to any of you that Elias is just going to do whatever he wants and not be beholden to any one model?  

“Tastes Great!”

”Less filling!”

 

[Moose Milligan]

13 minutes ago, Philip said:

“Tastes Great!”

”Less filling!”

 

Whoa, what an amazing commercial!  I've seen a bunch of Miller Lite commercials over the years but not that one.  What a treat that was.  Would take all afternoon to slow it down and figure out all the names in there.  Boog, Frank, Uecker, Dangerfield, John Madden, Dick Williams, Dick Butkus, Billy Martin...

Can you imagine being on the set for filming that day?  

[HowAboutThat]

9 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

Whoa, what an amazing commercial!  I've seen a bunch of Miller Lite commercials over the years but not that one.  What a treat that was.  Would take all afternoon to slow it down and figure out all the names in there.  Boog, Frank, Uecker, Dangerfield, John Madden, Dick Williams, Dick Butkus, Billy Martin...

Can you imagine being on the set for filming that day?  

I don’t know how old you are, but that was probably the best advertising campaign of the era. Those guys must’ve had so much fun.
Mad Magazine even did a multi page spread called, “the Miller light crew runs the United Nations” and the neutron bomb was introduced as a military solution that would cause more destruction but fewer casualties, which resulted in the scream,” WASTES GREAT!” “LESS KILLING!” Oh that makes me laugh to this day.

Also, I am amazed that a commercial is a solid minute long. Those were all hilarious.

[DrungoHazewood]

1 hour ago, Sports Guy said:

You take things far too literally.

I wish I had a dollar for every post that infers exactly how our A-ball outfielders should be doing their pre-game routine, based on a vague statement from the GM about organizational philosophy.

Elias: "We are following a model not too dissimilar from the Astros"
Internet: "My God, do you know what that does to our 2025 mock draft 4th round?!?  We have to change the entire projection!"

[wildcard]

2 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

 Correct.  This is what WC isn’t understanding.  
 

I don’t believe the Angelos family will spend what they should but I do believe they will spend more than Tampa.  What they do want, which is what Tampa does, is a lot of young cheap talent.  But here’s a little secret…EVERYONE wants that.  The Tampa model, if you want to coin that phrase, is just being smart.

The difference between Tampa and a lot of other teams is that those teams can keep their best players if they want and they can sign more players to bigger money deals.  Tampa has to find the cheap, McHugh type guys, hope they do well And then watch them leave.  That’s how they supplement their roster.

So, of course Elias is going to follow a model like Tampa.  Every team is going to follow any model where you place a premium on development and cheap talent well outperforming their cost.  That’s obvious.  

I understand that the O's can spend more than Tampa and will.  But i expect it will be on players they can't afford to lose or can't get cheaply.    Means will be expensive in his 2nd year of arbitration.   All of Adley and Grayson arbitration years will be expensive.  I have been saying they may pick up a starter for 2/30.   As the team get older this will all add up.   

However it appears most of the position players will be traded before they are too expensive because there will be younger, cheaper players coming behind them.

[Moose Milligan]

28 minutes ago, Philip said:

I don’t know how old you are, but that was probably the best advertising campaign of the era. Those guys must’ve had so much fun.
Mad Magazine even did a multi page spread called, “the Miller light crew runs the United Nations” and the neutron bomb was introduced as a military solution that would cause more destruction but fewer casualties, which resulted in the scream,” WASTES GREAT!” “LESS KILLING!” Oh that makes me laugh to this day.

Also, I am amazed that a commercial is a solid minute long. Those were all hilarious.

I just turned 40.  I remember some Miller Lite commercials but not that one.

[Sports Guy]

14 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I understand that the O's can spend more than Tampa and will.  But i expect it will be on players they can't afford to lose or can't get cheaply.    Means will be expensive in his 2nd year of arbitration.   All of Adley and Grayson arbitration years will be expensive.  I have been saying they may pick up a starter for 2/30.   As the team get older this will all add up.   

However it appears most of the position players will be traded before they are too expensive because there will be younger, cheaper players coming behind them.

That’s where you lose everyone..”it appears”

There is no “it appears”.  We have no idea what they are going to do.  You take a few phrases, take them as literally as you possibly can and then run with that narrative.  

We have no idea if the Angelos family is even owning the team in 3-5 years and yet you are saying this is what will happen.

I think what we should all hope for is that the team makes smart decisions and just leave it at that.  Putting definitive labels on anything makes no sense.

[wildcard]

7 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I think what we should all hope for is that the team makes smart decisions and just leave it at that.  Putting definitive labels on anything makes no sense.

I will remind you of that the next time you are talking about the O's future.

[Sports Guy]

2 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I will remind you of that the next time you are talking about the O's future.

I’m on the edge of my seat waiting.

[HowAboutThat]

8 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

That’s where you lose everyone..”it appears”

There is no “it appears”.  We have no idea what they are going to do.  You take a few phrases, take them as literally as you possibly can and then run with that narrative.  

We have no idea if the Angelos family is even owning the team in 3-5 years and yet you are saying this is what will happen.

I think what we should all hope for is that the team makes smart decisions and just leave it at that.  Putting definitive labels on anything makes no sense.

In your previous comment, you refer to the Tampa “model” as “just being smart.” I agree that Tampa is smart. What are things they do not do? I have not studied Tampa, but one thing I think they do do is get rid of guys at peak value, and peak value is not just how old they are, it’s how much they cost.

One thing I am positive they do not do is sign older guys to long-term contracts. They might very well have done the JJ Hardy or Adam Jones contracts but they would not have done the Mark Trumbo or Chris Davis contracts. So it makes sense that we can extrapolate intelligent moves and assume that they are going to do them.

However, we aren’t Tampa, we are Bmore, and we have to make our own wise moves. Long term deals are risky. It is better to draft well and often, have eyes all over the world, and have a vast and high-quality system from which we can provide trade pieces for other teams widgets.

[Sports Guy]

13 minutes ago, Philip said:

In your previous comment, you refer to the Tampa “model” as “just being smart.” I agree that Tampa is smart. What are things they do not do? I have not studied Tampa, but one thing I think they do do is get rid of guys at peak value, and peak value is not just how old they are, it’s how much they cost.

One thing I am positive they do not do is sign older guys to long-term contracts. They might very well have done the JJ Hardy or Adam Jones contracts but they would not have done the Mark Trumbo or Chris Davis contracts. So it makes sense that we can extrapolate intelligent moves and assume that they are going to do them.

However, we aren’t Tampa, we are Bmore, and we have to make our own wise moves. Long term deals are risky. It is better to draft well and often, have eyes all over the world, and have a vast and high-quality system from which we can provide trade pieces for other teams widgets.

For the most part, you should get rid of guys before they turn 30.  There are exceptions though.

[HowAboutThat]

17 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

For the most part, you should get rid of guys before they turn 30.  There are exceptions though.

I generally agree, and as I’ve frequently said I don’t like long-term extensions, but if you signed somebody who’s 24 to, say, an eight year contract, I could see the logic in that, although I personally still would not do it.

With AR, I think my own suggestion is workable, but again, I wouldn’t do it. The angels have two of the greatest players who have ever played the game and look at them. You need a team, not a star

[Sports Guy]

51 minutes ago, Philip said:

I generally agree, and as I’ve frequently said I don’t like long-term extensions, but if you signed somebody who’s 24 to, say, an eight year contract, I could see the logic in that, although I personally still would not do it.

With AR, I think my own suggestion is workable, but again, I wouldn’t do it. The angels have two of the greatest players who have ever played the game and look at them. You need a team, not a star

The Angels have sucked because, as an organization , they have made terrible moves and drafted and developed poorly.  
 

It’s not because of big contracts or anything like that.

The tide may be changing there though.