Orioles promote 1 Coach, hire second

[DrungoHazewood]

On 11/15/2021 at 6:20 PM, Can_of_corn said:

I think it's been the norm since they allowed for teams to have a second a few years ago.

Why not have two if it's allowed?

Why does the league care if you have zero, one, two, or 11 hitting coaches?  Is that the number allowed on the bench?  Could you have more coaches but they can't be on the field during the game?

 Maybe an optimal situation would be for each player on the roster to have their own personal performance coach.  Or we could just go back to the way it was done in 19-and-aught three and there were no coaches (or GMs for that matter), just your manager who sometimes was also a player.

[DrungoHazewood]

16 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

 

I'm confused.  Why is this "the type of stuff fans get frustrated about"?  Who's frustrated by this?  If you asked everyone in the Stadium the name of the home team's hitting coach, what percentage would get it right?  15%?

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Why does the league care if you have zero, one, two, or 11 hitting coaches?  Is that the number allowed on the bench?  Could you have more coaches but they can't be on the field during the game?

 Maybe an optimal situation would be for each player on the roster to have their own personal performance coach.  Or we could just go back to the way it was done in 19-and-aught three and there were no coaches (or GMs for that matter), just your manager who sometimes was also a player.

Ask them.

Don't all the major US sports have limits on how many coahes can be present at the game?

[DrungoHazewood]

1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:

Ask them.

Don't all the major US sports have limits on how many coahes can be present at the game?

I don't know, it's not something I've really paid attention to.  My casual observance of football is that they have 46 coaches for each team.  Inside linebackers coach.  Kick returner coach.  Offensive line coach, defensive line coach, nickel back coach.  Kicking coach.  Punting coach.  The guy who used to hold the wires for the headphones so they wouldn't get tangled up before they went wireless but now stares off into space thinking of Gal Gadot.

[interloper]

4 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

I'm confused.  Why is this "the type of stuff fans get frustrated about"?  Who's frustrated by this?  If you asked everyone in the Stadium the name of the home team's hitting coach, what percentage would get it right?  15%?

He means that it's frustrating that the Orioles get consistently dragged for mimicking successful teams because they're the Orioles. I tend to agree, it feels like we're playing by different rules at times. 

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

I don't know, it's not something I've really paid attention to.  My casual observance of football is that they have 46 coaches for each team.  Inside linebackers coach.  Kick returner coach.  Offensive line coach, defensive line coach, nickel back coach.  Kicking coach.  Punting coach.  The guy who used to hold the wires for the headphones so they wouldn't get tangled up before they went wireless but now stares off into space thinking of Gal Gadot.

From wiki, the Ravens:

 

Head coach – John Harbaugh Assistant to the Head Coach – Dan Parsons Offensive coaches Offensive coordinator – Greg Roman Quarterbacks – James Urban Running backs – Craig Ver Steeg Wide receivers – Tee Martin Tight ends – Bobby Engram Offensive line – Joe D'Alessandris Assistant offensive line – Richard Angulo Pass game specialist – Keith Williams

Defensive coaches Defensive coordinator – Don Martindale Defensive line/run game coordinator – Anthony Weaver Assistant defensive line – Jason Brooks Inside Linebackers – Rob Ryan Assistant linebackers – Jay Peterson Outside linebackers – Drew Wilkins Defensive backs – D'Anton Lynn Passing defense coordinator – Chris Hewitt Special teams coaches Special teams coordinator – Chris Horton Assistant special teams – T. J. Weist Special teams – Randy Brown Strength and conditioning Head strength and conditioning – Steve Saunders Assistant strength and conditioning – Anthony Watson Coaching analyst - performance – Scott Elliott Coaching analyst - performance – Sam Rosengarten Coaching analyst - performance – Ron Shrift

[interloper]

The problem with Dan's article is that, per a twitter argument with a fan, he says he checked with players and coaches to see if his hunch was right, yet he makes no mention of that in the article. Nor does he mention any examples of success or failure so we can see all sides. It's just a thin opinion piece with not much behind it. Until you question him and suddenly it's an opinion piece backed up by sources that he neglected to mention in the article. 

I just don't buy it man. Players seek out non-MLB coaches all the time. If they're respected and AROUND the game, I would think most players are cool with it. Sure, I have no doubt some players take issue, but since when are catering to individual players that much on THIS team knowing its makeup? And were those players complaining about Fuller in Bowie? I extremely doubt it. 

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, interloper said:

The problem with Dan's article is that, per a twitter argument with a fan, he says he checked with players and coaches to see if his hunch was right, yet he makes no mention of that in the article. Nor does he mention any examples of success or failure so we can see all sides. It's just a thin opinion piece with not much behind it. Until you question him and suddenly it's an opinion piece backed up by sources that he neglected to mention in the article. 

I just don't buy it man. Players seek out non-MLB coaches all the time. If they're respected and AROUND the game, I would think most players are cool with it. Sure, I have no doubt some players take issue, but since when are catering to individual players that much on THIS team knowing its makeup? And were those players complaining about Fuller in Bowie? I extremely doubt it. 

I think that if players are judging coaches without actually meeting them than the players need to check themselves.  No one on this team is too good to check credentials.

[DrungoHazewood]

1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:

From wiki, the Ravens:

 

Head coach – John Harbaugh Assistant to the Head Coach – Dan Parsons Offensive coaches Offensive coordinator – Greg Roman Quarterbacks – James Urban Running backs – Craig Ver Steeg Wide receivers – Tee Martin Tight ends – Bobby Engram Offensive line – Joe D'Alessandris Assistant offensive line – Richard Angulo Pass game specialist – Keith Williams

Defensive coaches Defensive coordinator – Don Martindale Defensive line/run game coordinator – Anthony Weaver Assistant defensive line – Jason Brooks Inside Linebackers – Rob Ryan Assistant linebackers – Jay Peterson Outside linebackers – Drew Wilkins Defensive backs – D'Anton Lynn Passing defense coordinator – Chris Hewitt Special teams coaches Special teams coordinator – Chris Horton Assistant special teams – T. J. Weist Special teams – Randy Brown Strength and conditioning Head strength and conditioning – Steve Saunders Assistant strength and conditioning – Anthony Watson Coaching analyst - performance – Scott Elliott Coaching analyst - performance – Sam Rosengarten Coaching analyst - performance – Ron Shrift

26 coaches. I was completely making up 46, but I was within an order of magnitude.  As it is there's almost a coach for each two players. 

I wonder how much of a problem it becomes to make sure all 26 are on message, and teaching the same things?  If you fire the head coach, you have to go find 25 other coaches, too?  If I were the GM I'd avoid firing the coach just because it would take forever to hold all those interviews. In my job it would take three years to hire 25 people.

[DrungoHazewood]

2 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I think that if players are judging coaches without actually meeting them than the players need to check themselves.  No one on this team is too good to check credentials.

Stevie Wilkerson didn't reach his lofty heights by just listening to anyone.

Also, remember, the Orioles broke new ground in this area by hiring Dave Trembley as the manager.  He never played professional baseball.  That experience had at least an occasional moment where it didn't look like a total dumpster fire.

[interloper]

3 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Stevie Wilkerson didn't reach his lofty heights by just listening to anyone.

Also, remember, the Orioles broke new ground in this area by hiring Dave Trembley as the manager.  He never played professional baseball.  That experience had at least an occasional moment where it didn't look like a total dumpster fire.

And of course Buck famously flamed out in the minors. Dan argues for a "mix" of MLB experience and non. The O's have that. And for the coaches who didn't play in the majors, they still have a lot of experience COACHING MLB TEAMS. It's so asinine. 

[HowAboutThat]

2 hours ago, interloper said:

Yeah man. Connolly's article is the thing that's shortsighted, which is some fun irony. Didn't we want the O's to catch up to the rest of baseball and get into some of these new trends? Maybe it doesn't work, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't try if they believe in what they're doing and in the guys they're hiring. "Oh no what will 30 yr old Trey Mancini think??" What are you even talking about, Dan? 

Connolly is a fool.

[interloper]

8 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I think that if players are judging coaches without actually meeting them than the players need to check themselves.  No one on this team is too good to check credentials.

And to be clear, he didn't specify if it was even Orioles players/coaches he checked with. It's just layers of nothing. 

[Sports Guy]

23 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

I'm confused.  Why is this "the type of stuff fans get frustrated about"?  Who's frustrated by this?  If you asked everyone in the Stadium the name of the home team's hitting coach, what percentage would get it right?  15%?

Connolly wrote an article questioning this.  From that, twitterverse is discussing it and some don’t like it…that’s why Matt said this.

[SilverRocket]

I was reading about the Giants' players also being skeptical at first. That's normal for anything new! The problem went away pretty quickly there.