2014 Attendance Thread

[Redskins Rick]

Here is the unemployment rate in the Baltimore MSA:

2010: 8.3

2011: 7.6

2012: 7.2

2013: 6.8

2014: 6.0

http://www.dllr.state.md.us/lmi/laus/baltotowson.shtml

Six percent isn't fantastic, but it's not like the economy in Baltimore is terrible.

My problem with the Unemployment rate, it's not a true indication of the situation.

The rate has fallen, not because people have found jobs, but more and more people have simply given up trying to find work. If you are not looking for work, then you are not counted as unemployed.

[Frobby]

My problem with the Unemployment rate, it's not a true indication of the situation.

The rate has fallen, not because people have found jobs, but more and more people have simply given up trying to find work. If you are not looking for work, then you are not counted as unemployed.

Not true, based on the numbers I cited.

2010: 1.439 mm labor force seeking jobs

2011: 1.452

2012: 1.472

2013: 1.476

2014: 1.465*

*The 2014 average is lower partially because the statistics only run through May, and summer is the time when the labor force is largest.

[Redskins Rick]

Not true, based on the numbers I cited.

2010: 1.439 mm labor force seeking jobs

2011: 1.452

2012: 1.472

2013: 1.476

2014: 1.465*

*The 2014 average is lower partially because the statistics only run through May, and summer is the time when the labor force is largest.

I think the economy is starting to show signs of improvement and is making grains, but has a long way to go to get back to what it was.

We are blessed to be in a stronger area that weathered the economy woes better than other areas, but on the other hand, this area is so much more expensive to live in, a catch-22.

[TonySoprano]

Not true, based on the numbers I cited.

2010: 1.439 mm labor force seeking jobs

2011: 1.452

2012: 1.472

2013: 1.476

2014: 1.465*

*The 2014 average is lower partially because the statistics only run through May, and summer is the time when the labor force is largest.

What Rick said about the federal unemployment rate, and how it's derived, is correct. This could degenerate into a political discussion, so I'll stop here. Besides, I don't think a significant decrease in unemployment alone would translate to a spike at the ticket office, and the numbers you posted in the Baltimore MSA bear that out. Also, unemployment is one piece of the economic puzzle which also should include the cost of living.

The focus should be on how the team is in its 3rd consecutive winning season, and we're seeing a 2% growth rate at the turnstiles. Per game attendance increased 12% from 2012 to 2013. As I said before, if the team is still in contention in September, that number should get a boost.

[Frobby]

What Rick said about the federal unemployment rate, and how it's derived, is correct. This could degenerate into a political discussion, so I'll stop here. Besides, I don't think a significant decrease in unemployment alone would translate to a spike at the ticket office, and the numbers you posted in the Baltimore MSA bear that out. Also, unemployment is one piece of the economic puzzle which also should include the cost of living.

The focus should be on how the team is in its 3rd consecutive winning season, and we're seeing a 2% growth rate at the turnstiles. Per game attendance increased 12% from 2012 to 2013. As I said before, if the team is still in contention in September, that number should get a boost.

I don't disagree with anything you said about the relationship between the economy and attendance and the factors besides unemployment that might come into play.

I'm still a bit nonplussed that the combined Baltimore-Washington attendance this year is likely to remain lower than it was in 2005. The only explanation I can come up with is that (1) the Nationals attendance that year included a lot of "novelty" fans who went to games to see the new team in town but didn't stick with it, and (2) at the same time, the Nats have drawn away more Orioles fans over the last 9 years than they did initially in 2005.

[Redskins Rick]

I don't disagree with anything you said about the relationship between the economy and attendance and the factors besides unemployment that might come into play.

I'm still a bit nonplussed that the combined Baltimore-Washington attendance this year is likely to remain lower than it was in 2005. The only explanation I can come up with is that (1) the Nationals attendance that year included a lot of "novelty" fans who went to games to see the new team in town but didn't stick with it, and (2) at the same time, the Nats have drawn away more Orioles fans over the last 9 years than they did initially in 2005.

Frobby,

I think its more to do with "disposable" income,

I have friends and family who thankfully, most are working, but some are not at the levels they were, and it cuts into vacation and entertainment dollars.

They get to 1-2 games a year, instead of 13.

[Frobby]

Frobby,

I think its more to do with "disposable" income,

I have friends and family who thankfully, most are working, but some are not at the levels they were, and it cuts into vacation and entertainment dollars.

They get to 1-2 games a year, instead of 13.

Well, maybe, but overall baseball attendance was 74.4 mm in 2005, and 74.0 last year. So, almost completely flat (-0.6%). Meanwhile, BAL/WAS attendance dropped from 5.35 mm to 5.01 mm, which is a 7% drop.

[Redskins Rick]

Well, maybe, but overall baseball attendance was 74.4 mm in 2005, and 74.0 last year. So, almost completely flat (-0.6%). Meanwhile, BAL/WAS attendance dropped from 5.35 mm to 5.01 mm, which is a 7% drop.

Baffling for sure to try and explain it, and I know, we have talked in the past and compared Detroit's figures, which are strong, and yet they are in a more impacted economy area of the U.S.

I know it's easy to play the blame the Nat's card, but I really don't know anybody in my circle that follows the Nats, they are either Orioles/Raven fans or like myself, Orioles/Redskins fan.

I am sure it has impacted Oriole Fans in the Northern Va and in D.C.

[TonySoprano]

I don't disagree with anything you said about the relationship between the economy and attendance and the factors besides unemployment that might come into play.

I'm still a bit nonplussed that the combined Baltimore-Washington attendance this year is likely to remain lower than it was in 2005. The only explanation I can come up with is that (1) the Nationals attendance that year included a lot of "novelty" fans who went to games to see the new team in town but didn't stick with it, and (2) at the same time, the Nats have drawn away more Orioles fans over the last 9 years than they did initially in 2005.

The Nats per game figures are a lot closer to 2005 than the Orioles. Nats 33,728 (2005) - 31,173 (2014). Baltimore 32,404 (2005) - 29,394 (2014) Both teams are 6th in their respective leagues, which is better than they were in 2005.

Unfortunately, this isn't an apples to apples comparison, because it compares the current number for 2014 vs. the final numbers for 2013. However, as it stands, attendance is down for 17 teams this season.

RK	TM	2014	2013	CHG	PCT1	LAD	46,487	39,709	6,778	17.1%2	LAA	38,000	32,522	5,478	16.8%3	STL	43,306	37,735	5,571	14.8%4	NYY	42,603	38,136	4,467	11.7%5	TEX	35,039	31,538	3,501	11.1%6	SFG	41,592	38,045	3,547	9.3%7	DET	34,493	31,562	2,931	9.3%8	BOS	36,271	34,084	2,187	6.4%9	COL	33,568	31,963	1,605	5.0%10	MIL	33,068	31,797	1,271	4.0%11	BAL	30,006	29,015	991	3.4%12	CIN	30,859	30,700	159	0.5%13	WAS	31,173	31,137	36	0.1%14	CHC	32,469	32,617	-148	-0.5%15	MIN	27,759	27,986	-227	-0.8%16	TOR	27,168	27,742	-574	-2.1%17	ATL	29,385	30,162	-777	-2.6%18	PHI	30,459	31,316	-857	-2.7%19	SEA	23,858	24,997	-1,139	-4.6%20	KCR	22,682	24,295	-1,613	-6.6%21	HOU	22,661	24,313	-1,652	-6.8%22	PIT	27,819	29,871	-2,052	-6.9%23	SDP	26,419	28,461	-2,042	-7.2%24	NYM	27,206	29,828	-2,622	-8.8%25	OAK	24,137	26,932	-2,795	-10.4%26	MIA	21,497	24,821	-3,324	-13.4%27	ARI	25,013	29,306	-4,293	-14.6%28	CHW	20,657	24,371	-3,714	-15.2%29	CLE	18,402	23,243	-4,841	-20.8%30	TBR	16,901	22,353	-5,452	-24.4%

[Redskins Rick]

Selig says Baseball attendance is at historic highs, yet like Tony pointed out, attendance was done for 17 teams.

May 30, 2014|By Eduardo A. Encina | The Baltimore Sun

HOUSTON -- Major League Baseball commissioner Bud Selig said before Friday's Civil Rights Game that he sees Baltimore as a leading candidate to host the 2016 All-Star Game.

?Yes, they're certainly a very, very viable candidate,? Selig said before the Orioles' game against the Houston Astros. ?When you think back, Camden Yards really started this whole ballpark expansion, and I believe that's one of the primary reasons for baseball attendance being at the historic high that it is today.?

http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2014-05-30/sports/bal-mlb-commissioner-bud-selig-calls-baltimore-a-very-very-viable-candidate-for-the-2016-allstar-game-20140530_1_civil-rights-game-camden-yards-baltimore-host

[TonySoprano]

Selig says Baseball attendance is at historic highs, yet like Tony pointed out, attendance was done for 17 teams.

http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2014-05-30/sports/bal-mlb-commissioner-bud-selig-calls-baltimore-a-very-very-viable-candidate-for-the-2016-allstar-game-20140530_1_civil-rights-game-camden-yards-baltimore-host

I think Bud is speaking in generalities comparing attendance to the 90s, as opposed to specifically talking about 2014.

[WietersCorner]

Baffling for sure to try and explain it, and I know, we have talked in the past and compared Detroit's figures, which are strong, and yet they are in a more impacted economy area of the U.S.

I know it's easy to play the blame the Nat's card, but I really don't know anybody in my circle that follows the Nats, they are either Orioles/Raven fans or like myself, Orioles/Redskins fan.

I am sure it has impacted Oriole Fans in the Northern Va and in D.C.

I believe the economy impacted the amount of fans that will travel to Baltimore from NY and BOS etc. to watch their teams in OPACY. People just can't make those mini-vacations anymore with the lack of disposable income. I wouldn't be surprised to find out that the same amount or more Orioles fans go to games, but fans from out of town dropped significantly.

This is all theoritical of course, but something interesting to think about.

[OFFNY]

o

3 GAME-SET vs. Yankees O (JULY 11th, 12th, 13th)

44,031

46,667 *

34,483

______

125,181

* Sellout (101.5% Full)

3-GAME AVERAGE: 41,727

Nice closeout to the first half of the season.

[OFFNY]

o

3 GAME-SET vs. Yankees O (JULY 11th, 12th, 13th)

44,031

46,667 *

34,483

______

125,181

* Sellout (101.5% Full)

3-GAME AVERAGE: 41,727

Nice closeout to the first half of the season.

And, excellent merge by the mods.

[schittenden]

Here is the unemployment rate in the Baltimore MSA:

2010: 8.3

2011: 7.6

2012: 7.2

2013: 6.8

2014: 6.0

http://www.dllr.state.md.us/lmi/laus/baltotowson.shtml

Six percent isn't fantastic, but it's not like the economy in Baltimore is terrible.

If you go back just a bit further, those numbers look pretty bad...

2004: 4.6

2005: 4.4

2006: 4.0

2007: 3.6

2008: 4.5

2009: 7.8

I suspect that the are also suffers from underemployment, like much of the country, where people want full-time work but are working part-time. Even those who are employed full-time may have gone years without a raise, which puts a real pinch on things. Gas prices are much higher too, which makes the cost of going to a game incrementally higher, but also eats up a larger portion of a family's disposable income generally. The number of employed people is also not much higher than it was several years ago, and until two years ago was below the number several years ago.

Also, while the raw number of labor force participants had trickled upward, the labor force participation rate has declined 2 percentage points between 2008 and 2013 from 69.4% to 67.4%.