For What it's worth.....

[Sports Guy]

I concur, but it doesn't mean Barfield or Marte have much trade value. There wasn't much - if any - market for Phillips when Cincy got him - for a PTBNL.

I agree...Put those 2 with Peralta and you have a deal for me.

I think that is a solid and fair offer for each side...if the Indians really want BRob.

[brvn52]

Assuming for a moment that Cleveland is even in this in the first place...

What if they are taking a similar stance as the Cubs, making many of their most appealing names offlimits, leaving available just the Martes and the Barfields and the Cliff Lees of their organization?

Not too hard to see the Indians wanting to hold onto Peralta (move him to 3B soon), Miller (need a potential ace with Sabathia likely to leave), Lofgren (a young cheap lefty with upside is hard to part with) and so on.

I could see a deal centered around Barfield, Marte, and a couple other Indian pitchers (Aaron Laffey and David Huff?)

One of Barfield/Peralta/Cabrera would have to be included in a deal first of all. With your hypothetical, Peralta and Cabrera are off-limits. So that leaves Barfield.

Marte would be a nice buy-low guy and a guy that hopefully could turn around his career and reach some of the potential he once had.

These 1st 2 guys are not in the same league (value-wise) as Roberts. That coupled with the fact MacPhail loves young pitching, I would imagine the rest of the deal would be centered around pitching. Miller and Lofgren are both off-limits in your hypothetical, so you have to move on down the list to Aaron Laffey, who is their #3 pitching prospect. Him and David Huff (who has arguably the best control in the CLE system) would be solid 3rd and 4th pieces.

So you have Barfield, Marte, Laffey, and Huff for Roberts. Personally I like that deal. Maybe MacPhail sneaks one more player into the deal (We've seen this with Sarfate and Mickolio), but I'd be very happy with those 4 for Roberts.

[JJLinn29]

Something else I would consider, although we don't need more pitching, would be Peralta/Lofgren/Barfield or Marte.

[Number5]

No way we get that much. If Miller is in the deal, we're not gonna get much more than that.

I could see something more along the lines of Lofgren, Barfield, and 2 other prospects (at least one being a pitcher).

Personally I'd rather see Barfield, Peralta, and Marte, though.

Everything I've read indicates that Cleveland has no interest in trading Peralta. Do you have some reason to think otherwise? Looks like they may put him at 3B now, even if they make no trade, and put Blake in the outfield. All indications are that they want Cabrera at SS and Peralta at 3B, and want an upgrade at 2B.

Marte has no options left, plays corner infield (not a position of need for us now), and his numbers are diving. His OPS in winter ball was .573, with zero homers and a .198 batting average. His shine has worn off, IMO. Why would you want him?

Since you seem to think that there is no way that Cleveland would offer Miller, Barfield, and Gutierrez, does that mean that you would be very happy with that deal if it was offered? I don't share your view that such an offer is an impossibility.

[Number5]

Imagine Marte + Barfield + Cliff Lee for Roberts is the Indians' final offer.

Take it or leave it?

I would leave it. Marte has no options left and would only add to our corner infield/DH logjam. Besides, his numbers have been headed south big time. Lee is a question mark and is owed $9.5 million for 2 years. I doubt if that is the rumored offer being considered.

[brvn52]

Everything I've read indicates that Cleveland has no interest in trading Peralta. Do you have some reason to think otherwise? Looks like they may put him at 3B now, even if they make no trade, and put Blake in the outfield. All indications are that they want Cabrera at SS and Peralta at 3B, and want an upgrade at 2B.

Marte has no options left, plays corner infield (not a position of need for us now), and his numbers are diving. His OPS in winter ball was .573, with zero homers and a .198 batting average. His shine has worn off, IMO. Why would you want him?

Since you seem to think that there is no way that Cleveland would offer Miller, Barfield, and Gutierrez, does that mean that you would be very happy with that deal if it was offered? I don't share your view that such an offer is an impossibility.

There were rumors that the Indians were hesitant to deal him for Haren. Haren > Roberts. If they decided to include him, then I don't think we'd get much more. I would be content with that deal. However, I think we can get better value by going to other players that Miller. Miller is a big-time injury risk and Cleveland is valuing him like he isn't.

IMO, we could get a better deal from the them if they don't include Miller (2-3 decent prospects). I like Barfield, but he has very little value right now and I'm not that high on Gutierrez. Plus Gutierrez doesn't have much of a spot on this team with Scott and Payton here. I would rather us get Marte and a pitcher (Huff maybe) than Gutierrez.

For now I'm gonna stick with my deal (assuming no Miller, Lofgren, Peralta, or Cabrera) of Roberts for Barfield, Marte, Laffey, Huff, and 1 other guy.

[Insomniac]

I would leave it. Marte has no options left and would only add to our corner infield/DH logjam. Besides, his numbers have been headed south big time. Lee is a question mark and is owed $9.5 million for 2 years. I doubt if that is the rumored offer being considered.

The fact that Marte has no options left is important. If he is not included in a trade for Roberts, it is likely that he will be traded cheaply this spring because Cleveland has no spot for him and can't send him down to AAA anymore.

Assuming that Dave is correct, and that Cleveland's interest in Roberts is all smoke and mirrors from AM, shouldn't we target a "project" like Marte this spring anyway?

[hoosiers]

I'm sure we could work something out with Clevelend without Peralta and Miller - if we had to. The Cubs are only including Gallagher from their top five prospects (and that excludes Pie and Marmol) so the bar is not that high, IMO.

[davearm]

Despite what you think, Payton has value to a contending team, especially an NL team.

He still hits lefties well and can play all 3 OF psoitions. Considering Pie can't hit lefties, he could be valuable to the Cubs.

Now, i agree we should pay some of his contract but Payton for 2 million or so is a good thing for the Cubs....He just has to be used properly, ie against lefties.

Payton has value to a contending team. It's just greatly below his $5M pricetag.

That's why he's got negative trade value, and is a salary dump, etc.

And before you say it, Payton + $2M cash is still negative.

If Payton was a free agent right now, the Cubs might sign him if he'd take a 1 year, ~$1M deal.

[davearm]

Is there an offer on the table from the Cubs to consider in this as well??

And is Lee healthy now?

Last I heard things with the Cubs were stuck on Gallagher, Cedeno, and Veal, so let's assume that's still available.

No idea what Lee's status is.

[odogs101]

Say we get Gallagher, Murton, Cedeno, and Veal for Roberts and Payton.

Would Murton and Albers be enough to get Ellis and Dan Johnson from the A's?

Ellis is a FA after this year so we could offer him arbitration.

If he accepts we have a 2B for next year and if not we get the draft picks.

[Number5]

There were rumors that the Indians were hesitant to deal him for Haren. Haren > Roberts. If they decided to include him, then I don't think we'd get much more. I would be content with that deal. However, I think we can get better value by going to other players that Miller. Miller is a big-time injury risk and Cleveland is valuing him like he isn't.

IMO, we could get a better deal from the them if they don't include Miller (2-3 decent prospects). I like Barfield, but he has very little value right now and I'm not that high on Gutierrez. Plus Gutierrez doesn't have much of a spot on this team with Scott and Payton here. I would rather us get Marte and a pitcher (Huff maybe) than Gutierrez.

For now I'm gonna stick with my deal (assuming no Miller, Lofgren, Peralta, or Cabrera) of Roberts for Barfield, Marte, Laffey, Huff, and 1 other guy.

I understand Miller has injury risk with him. That is the very reason that I think we may be able to get him. If he were clearly 100% healthy, it couldn't happen.

Rumor has it that we could trade Payton to the White Sox for Uribe, who would be a good temporary answer at shortstop for us. LH has options left and could go to AAA. Gutierrez would be a fine #4 OF and, in fact could play a lot of LF, with Scott at DH. 40-man wise and 25-man wise Miller, Barfield, and Gutierrez for Roberts would make a lot of sense for us, especially if the Uribe - Payton deal can be done.

[davearm]

I would leave it. Marte has no options left and would only add to our corner infield/DH logjam. Besides, his numbers have been headed south big time. Lee is a question mark and is owed $9.5 million for 2 years. I doubt if that is the rumored offer being considered.

You doubt it why? What have you heard Cleveland's offer is?

[Number5]

You doubt it why? What have you heard Cleveland's offer is?

Because it would not have a realistic chance of being accepted. If that were their final offer, I don't believe that Belkast would have referred to the offer as "fair." Just my opinion.

[brvn52]

I understand Miller has injury risk with him. That is the very reason that I think we may be able to get him. If he were clearly 100% healthy, it couldn't happen.

Rumor has it that we could trade Payton to the White Sox for Uribe, who would be a good temporary answer at shortstop for us. LH has options left and could go to AAA. Gutierrez would be a fine #4 OF and, in fact could play a lot of LF, with Scott at DH. 40-man wise and 25-man wise Miller, Barfield, and Gutierrez for Roberts would make a lot of sense for us, especially if the Uribe - Payton deal can be done.

The problem is Cleveland is treating him like he isn't an injury risk which means it's gonna cost more to get him then it should. If we did the Uribe-Payton deal, I would definitely like having Gutierrez a lot more.