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Yeah Hernandez!!!!!!

GotNitro

By GotNitro
in Orioles Talk

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RShack Hangout Grand Counsel

RShack

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This has been the argument the entire offseason: whether the runs prevented by Hernandez's defense overcome the (negative) runs created by his bat.

Doesn't it seem like some folks act like they never heard it before?

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Frobby Hangout Grand Counsel

Frobby

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Actually it is a hypothesis based on stats and common sense.

Tejada is clearly the better player and clearly gives the team more wins than LH.

You can choose to ignore that if you want..That is your perogative but you are completely wrong and look very foolish saying otherwise.

We have a whole season to sit back and see how LH does and how the team does. I for one intend to watch the season.

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Old#5fan Hangout Grand Counsel

Old#5fan

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Actually it is a hypothesis based on stats and common sense.

Tejada is clearly the better player and clearly gives the team more wins than LH.

You can choose to ignore that if you want..That is your perogative but you are completely wrong and look very foolish saying otherwise.

Tejada is the better hitter. I would be foolish to argue that. However, you or anyone else is foolish if you think Tajada is a better fielder. Tejada has no business trying to play ML shorstop anymore. LH, Fahey, and even Chris Gomez proved last season they played it better. So you are letting your bias towards favoring offense cloud your judgement.

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BaltimoreTerp Hangout Grand Counsel

BaltimoreTerp

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Tejada is the better hitter. I would be foolish to argue that. However, you or anyone else is foolish if you think Tajada is a better fielder. Tejada has no business trying to play ML shorstop anymore. LH, Fahey, and even Chris Gomez proved last season they played it better. So you are letting your bias towards favoring offense cloud your judgement.

The total runs created by Tejada (including offense and defense) are going to be more then runs created by Hernandez.

Not sure why this is so hard.

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Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

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Guthrie started 26 games last year...In those games, the Orioles were 10-16...That is a winning percentage of .384.

DCab started 34 games...In those games, the Orioles were 13-21 for a .382 winning percentage.

Trax started 25 games for the orioles last year and the team went 9-16...That is a winning % of 36%.

So, by OldFan's logic, Trachsel and DCab were as good(or very close to as good) as Guthrie was last year.

Raise your hand if you believe that to be true.

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Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

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Tejada is the better hitter. I would be foolish to argue that. However, you or anyone else is foolish if you think Tajada is a better fielder. Tejada has no business trying to play ML shorstop anymore. LH, Fahey, and even Chris Gomez proved last season they played it better. So you are letting your bias towards favoring offense cloud your judgement.

It would be foolish to think Miggy is a better fielder but its also foolish to think he can't play SS anymore.

Again, whether you want to believe it or not, Miggy falls somewhere between slightly below average to slightly above average defensively and has throughout his career.

His average defense and well above average bat makes him a much much better player than LH is.

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olehippi Veteran All-Star

olehippi

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We're dealing with sample sizes that are too small to use for a reasonable evaluation of Hernandez, so why is anyone trying to argue any point?

All I know is I'm happy that the O's have won 4 or their first 5 games, and Luis has been a large contributor in some of those wins.

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Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

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We're dealing with sample sizes that are too small to use for a reasonable evaluation of Hernandez, so why is anyone trying to argue any point?

All I know is I'm happy that the O's have won 4 or their first 5 games, and Luis has been largely responsible for 2 of those wins.

If you only want to look at what he did right, this would be correct.

Of course, there is the lack of getting on base, no power and no hits that hurt the team as well.

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Old#5fan Hangout Grand Counsel

Old#5fan

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The total runs created by Tejada (including offense and defense) are going to be more then runs created by Hernandez.

Not sure why this is so hard.

We have been through this before. Your stats don't measure this correctly. For example you cannot assume a double play but when LH is out there I assume he will make the play most of the time and Tejada I always am surprised if he turns it.

The botched taylor made DP balls by Tejada where they got only one out are immeasurable in mere stats and I believe did untold damage to the pitchers who had their morale negatively impacted more by his ineptitude on defense than his proficiency on offense. You gather this by watching and observing not by burying your nose in a stats book.

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BaltimoreTerp Hangout Grand Counsel

BaltimoreTerp

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Guthrie started 26 games last year...In those games, the Orioles were 10-16...That is a winning percentage of .384.

DCab started 34 games...In those games, the Orioles were 13-21 for a .382 winning percentage.

Trax started 25 games for the orioles last year and the team went 9-16...That is a winning % of 36%.

So, by OldFan's logic, Trachsel and DCab were as good(or very close to as good) as Guthrie was last year.

Raise your hand if you believe that to be true.

Nice work.

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BaltimoreTerp Hangout Grand Counsel

BaltimoreTerp

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We have been through this before. Your stats don't measure this correctly. For example you cannot assume a double play but when LH is out there I assume he will make the play most of the time and Tejada I always am surprised if he turns it.

Now you aren't making any sense.

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Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

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We have been through this before. Your stats don't measure this correctly. For example you cannot assume a double play but when LH is out there I assume he will make the play most of the time and Tejada I always am surprised if he turns it.

Oh ok...So, you just want to pick things out of the air because it is what you believe?

You don't care about stats, facts or proof? Just what you want to think and that's it?

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Old#5fan Hangout Grand Counsel

Old#5fan

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Now you aren't making any sense.

I will slow it down for you. Botched DP balls are not recorded as errors if you get one out, as you cannot assume a double play. Tejada was the worst (or best at botching them) I have ever seen. Since he usually made the force at the base getting one out after fumbling the ball it did not show up as an error but it was a morale killer and inning extender that often led to losses.

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Old#5fan Hangout Grand Counsel

Old#5fan

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Oh ok...So, you just want to pick things out of the air because it is what you believe?

You don't care about stats, facts or proof? Just what you want to think and that's it?

No, my eyes and observation skills easily tell me Tejada was deficient at turning routine DP balls compared to even average ML shortstops. In other words he was fourth best on the team at making a routine DP last season which is abysmal and is why he is gone. He was so bad he had to be moved or traded. Even the Orioles infield coach last season publicly remarked about Tejada's obvioius problem with the ball from his glove when turning a routine DP. You would have to bury your head in the sand like an ostrich not to have seen it last year.

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