Orioles: Most inept organization in all of profesional sports?

[Luke-OH]

11 minutes ago, flyhighbirds said:

Why doesn't the gm deserve blame when the team has no plan?    Isn't he the one that is supposed to come up with the plan.   He was open and honest about his intent to want to go to Toronto.         So if you take him at his word, he wants to contend right now even though we all know they aren't a contender.    Yet he has no plan.     He deserves plenty of blame because he doesn't seem to be able to make the logical conclusion that most of us have made.   The team needs to rebuild.       

I agree with the rebuild, but how do you rebuild, you trade Britton, Machado, Brach. He tried to trade Britton at the deadline and it got shot down at the last minute. We don’t know if he accepted any of the Machado offers, but he at least  had some interest in trading him. He hasn’t spent any money yet, I mean that looks like trying to rebuild to me, how much authority he has in his last year with others whispering in PA’s ear is unknown. There is one person in the org that have a stated preference not to rebuild and that is Buck. How much say does he have, that’s anyone’s guess but it’s pretty clear that the Orioles FO doesn’t just run through DD.

[foxfield]

6 hours ago, wildcard said:

Castro is still with the O's.  Its mid December.   There is time yet this off season to improve the team..   Manny has a lot of ncentive to have a big year this year.   300 million reasons.

Wildcard, I like to think I am one of the more optimistic people here. The OP is certainly not.  Improving requires pitching and it’s going to be Miggy and Tilly. They may very well take us all the way to October.  Whoever it is, come March I’ll be at the head of the line with Kool-Aid.

And at this point that is what I hope for,  as I’d rather not spend assets by trading for 1 pitcher when we need 3. And no marketable pitcher is coming for 3 years if half of the team and management is leaving in 1. 

Yes there is time. But as a fan right now I’m feeling a little like Daffy Duck:

 

[wildcard]

21 minutes ago, foxfield said:

And no marketable pitcher is coming for 3 years if half of the team and management is leaving in 1. 

 

 

I think they can convince a free agent that Buck is not going anywhere.  Ownership will tell the FA that.  And Buck will confirm it. JMO

[weams]

 

[weams]

1 minute ago, weams said:

 

This is their plan. Dealing with this. How do you deal with this? Like Philly did?

[wildcard]

The plan is to play Davis.   Just because he had a bad 2017 does not mean he will have a bad 2018.

[foxfield]

1 hour ago, wildcard said:

I think they can convince a free agent that Buck is not going anywhere.  Ownership will tell the FA that.  And Buck will confirm it. JMO

Read that again.  Now again.  You are 100% correct that this is what will happen.  What organization operates like this...you are an agent or a GM...do you even take Dan's call?  

[ScGO's]

35 minutes ago, wildcard said:

The plan is to play Davis.   Just because he had a bad 2017 does not mean he will have a bad 2018.

Yeah that slow bat from this past year should finally be making it's way through the hiting zone by next season. So let's hope it runs into a few.

[tntoriole]

25 minutes ago, foxfield said:

Read that again.  Now again.  You are 100% correct that this is what will happen.  What organization operates like this...you are an agent or a GM...do you even take Dan's call?  

The problem with Angelos and his poor communication and inward, near paranoid leadership style is that there is no “why”  shared with the public...so we just seemingly have the outer manifestations of year to year buying or selling with no discernible plan.    Many organizations in many parts of our society suffer from this lack of vision and they always struggle.   You can see it in denominations that retain followers but lack a visionary pastor or minister  to communicate why are we getting up in the morning.

 

 

[jabba72]

1 hour ago, weams said:

 

No team in baseball wants an aging overpaid 1B with 5 years left. Davis isnt leaving unless the O's take on another teams large contract. They arent getting useful talent in return thats for sure. 

[tntoriole]

5 hours ago, phillyOs119 said:

I agree with the rebuild, but how do you rebuild, you trade Britton, Machado, Brach. He tried to trade Britton at the deadline and it got shot down at the last minute. We don’t know if he accepted any of the Machado offers, but he at least  had some interest in trading him. He hasn’t spent any money yet, I mean that looks like trying to rebuild to me, how much authority he has in his last year with others whispering in PA’s ear is unknown. There is one person in the org that have a stated preference not to rebuild and that is Buck. How much say does he have, that’s anyone’s guess but it’s pretty clear that the Orioles FO doesn’t just run through DD.

The problem has always been Angelos communication style with the public has been nonexistent.   So we as fans do not trust his leadership, never have and never will.  Because we do not hear his values, his beliefs and his passion, so we conclude that he simply runs it to make money for himself and his family.  That may or may not be true, but his inward, behind closed doors, rumors from the Warehouse, lawyerly style of communication is disastrous when leading an entertainment and public business.

Contrast his communication style with that of Steve Bisciotti...or Steve Jobs for a larger example....you knew what they BELIEVED...I have no idea what Peter Angelos believes.   I partake of his business because it used to be run by  others when I first started following, but not because I know anything about him. 

So we speculate...who has his ear, how does he decide this or that, is he involved in this or that, why is he doing this or that....but the reason the Orioles are not doing well as an organization are because Peter Angelos is a poor communicator with his employees and with his customers. 

[Aristotelian]

We have a plan. The plan is to field a competitive team this year without spending a lot of money. Find a couple of #4 starters and hope that they are enough improvement over Miley/Ubaldo to keep us over .500. Blow it up at the all star break if the team is out of it. 

It's not a good plan, but it's a plan.

DD's MO throughout his time with the Orioles is to go for it without going fully all-in. From the outside, it looks like he doesn't have a plan but that is just because he (probably at the instruction of the owner) is a pragmatist who wants to compete but does not have the money to do so.

[Frobby]

8 hours ago, Il BuonO said:

Trumbo was a fall back option in case they didn’t sign Davis.

Remember all the teams bidding for Davis? That’s what eventually drove the price up so high. Oh, wait....

Contrary to what many think, the problem with the Davis negotiations wasn’t that the Orioles “bid against themselves.”    The problem was that their initial offer, made during the Winter Meetings, was way too high.    There’s virtually no difference in the economic value of the initial offer and the final contract, though by deferring a lot of payments far into the future they made the final total seem $7-11 mm higher (depending on which report of the initial offer you use for comparison).   Here’s a good article discussing the economic impact of the deferrals:  https://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/the-value-of-deferred-money-in-the-chris-davis-deal/

[Jagwar]

Sometimes in life it's not about having no plan. It's about the current situation being such a massive FUBAR that all of the potential plans suck

[weams]

Just now, RZNJ said:

You may be right this time but what did you predict the 2017 payroll would be last offseason.  I think you were about 20M light if my memory serves me correctly. 

Maybe more. I was surprised. I think I am finally correct.