Interesting FAs

[interloper]

41 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Allen may be a good deal for the Angels but the O's are not spending that kind of money this off season on a player.

I would have traded Givens, signed Allen, traded Allen honestly. Not sure why that kind of thing is not the tactic we are taking.

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, interloper said:

I would have traded Givens signed Allen, traded Allen honestly. Not sure why that's not the tactic we are taking.

If you were Allen why would you sign on to pitch here knowing that you will probably be traded to a team during the season?  Wouldn't you rather have control of where you pitch?

[interloper]

Just now, Can_of_corn said:

If you were Allen why would you sign on to pitch here knowing that you will probably be traded to a team during the season?  Wouldn't you rather have control of where you pitch?

Fair.

Still think we should trade Givens.

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, interloper said:

Fair.

Still think we should trade Givens.

Depending on return, sure.

I wouldn't salary dump him.

[wildcard]

2 hours ago, interloper said:

Fair.

Still think we should trade Givens.

There is no hurry on trading Givens.   He can't be a free agent until after the 2021 season.   He is only making 2.15m this coming season.   If they get a good offer for him, trade him.  If not hold him for at least this season.

[ScGO's]

4 minutes ago, wildcard said:

There is not hurry on trading Givens.   He can't be a free agent until after the 2021 season.   He is only making 2.15m this coming season.   If they get a good offer for him, trade him.  If not hold him for at least this season.

There could be a small window in ST where his value could shoot up after some of the other FA relievers sign.  If he throws a few good innings in early ST and his stuff looks good ME could determine that Givens has reached peak value and if he finds a return he feels is equal, he should pull the trigger.  His peak value will either be this ST window or June/July of this year if he performs.  There's a chance that his value could be even higher in June/July if he pitches like a stud, but that's the risk you take.  

In the eyes of other teams, the factors are:

1) 3 years of control vs 2+.  (What teams want to be competitive but can't afford a Kimbrel, Britton, etc)

2) Performance - Will he be the 3.00 ERA, return to the  2.00 ERA pitcher, or evolve into the 1.50 ERA pitcher(not trying to put emphasis on ERA, just using a variable to reflect his talent vs performance)

3) Is Bullpen strength the final determining factor a competitive team needs to put themselves in a position to make a run?

Which teams seem to fit those needs?  What is Givens potential market?

In my opinion, Givens is the only player with any trade value heading into the season.  

 

 

 

[wildcard]

3 minutes ago, ScGO's said:

There could be a small window in ST where his value could shoot up after some of the other FA relievers sign.  If he throws a few good innings in early ST and his stuff looks good ME could determine that Givens has reached peak value and if he finds a return he feels is equal, he should pull the trigger.  His peak value will either be this ST window or June/July of this year if he performs.  There's a chance that his value could be even higher in June/July if he pitches like a stud, but that's the risk you take.  

In the eyes of other teams, the factors are:

1) 3 years of control vs 2+.  (What teams want to be competitive but can't afford a Kimbrel, Britton, etc)

2) Performance - Will he be the 3.00 ERA, return to the  2.00 ERA pitcher, or evolve into the 1.50 ERA pitcher(not trying to put emphasis on ERA, just using a variable to reflect his talent vs performance)

3) Is Bullpen strength the final determining factor a competitive team needs to put themselves in a position to make a run?

Which teams seem to fit those needs?  What is Givens potential market?

In my opinion, Givens is the only player with any trade value heading into the season.  

 

 

 

I don't think there is a lot of difference in the trade return whether he has two or three years remaining before FA.   His value over the next year is really about how the acquiring team perceives his ability to help them,   So I  would say his peak value is probably some time this season or next off season.

If Cobb has a 1st half that matches his 2018 2nd half he will be have a very high trade value.  Probably higher than Givens even with Cobb's  contract.

[Can_of_corn]

15 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I don't think there is a lot of difference in the trade return whether he has two or three years remaining before FA.   His value over the next year is really about how the acquiring team perceives his ability to help them,   So I  would say his peak value is probably some time this season or next off season.

If Cobb has a 1st half that matches his 2018 2nd half he will be have a very high trade value.  Probably higher than Givens even with Cobb's  contract.

If he gets traded next year we don't have to worry about them packaging Trumbo's contract.

[Luke-OH]

The Reds sounds like they are considering Shed Long, the 36th pick + for one year of Sonny Gray. Is one year of Sonny Gray at 7.5M really worth more than 3 years of Givens at 2.15M this year? I’d take that deal for Givens in a heartbeat and I’m not particularly high on Long.

[Camden_yardbird]

5 hours ago, wildcard said:

Allen may be a good deal for the Angels but the O's are not spending that kind of money this off season on a player.

Thats short sighted IMO.  I would pay 4-5 million for a n organizations top 10 prospect which is what signing and trading him would be.

[Can_of_corn]

6 minutes ago, Camden_yardbird said:

Thats short sighted IMO.  I would pay 4-5 million for a n organizations top 10 prospect which is what signing and trading him would be.

I think that would be close to a best case scenario.

I don't think it's a good risk.

[Moose Milligan]

3 hours ago, wildcard said:

There is no hurry on trading Givens.   He can't be a free agent until after the 2021 season.   He is only making 2.15m this coming season.   If they get a good offer for him, trade him.  If not hold him for at least this season.

You're right, there's no hurry.  But I think Givens is, like, the one sell high piece we have right now.  He's been a steady performer for three years but I'd want to trade him now while we know he still has high value.  I think he's gonna have quite a workload this season, it'd suck to see him break down and have the trade value plummet.  

[Luke-OH]

4 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

You're right, there's no hurry.  But I think Givens is, like, the one sell high piece we have right now.  He's been a steady performer for three years but I'd want to trade him now while we know he still has high value.  I think he's gonna have quite a workload this season, it'd suck to see him break down and have the trade value plummet.  

This.

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

3 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

You're right, there's no hurry.  But I think Givens is, like, the one sell high piece we have right now.  He's been a steady performer for three years but I'd want to trade him now while we know he still has high value.  I think he's gonna have quite a workload this season, it'd suck to see him break down and have the trade value plummet.  

But don't you want to see if Elias, Brocail and Sig can increase Givens spin rate?

[Moose Milligan]

Just now, OsFanSinceThe80s said:

But don't you want to see if Elias, Brocail and Sig can increase Givens spin rate?

I am *so* enthralled to see if they can make his spin rate better.  

Sarcasm aside, it'd be cool to see if they can improve such things.  Grip, wrist snap, etc.  Curious to see what plays a part in making a pitch spin better.