Not to be whiny, but can we just cut Richie Martin loose already?

[Frobby]

31 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Mark Belanger had sub-500 OPSes in 1979 and 1972 and managed to be over replacement both years.  Under one win, but positive.  Of course Belanger might be the best fielding shortstop relative to his peers of all time.

In '68 Belanger had a .520 and a +3.4 win season.  Caveat there is 1968 was the lowest-scoring year since Babe Ruth.

Belanger had an OPS+ of 59 in 1968, 42 in 1972 and 36 in 1979.    Martin is at 31 this year.   So, relative to his time, he’s even worse than Belanger in those years.   But maybe Belanger in 1979 (+0.7 rWAR) would have still been above replacement at 31 OPS+ instead of 36.    

In any event, Martin ain’t Belanger.  

[DrungoHazewood]

8 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Belanger had an OPS+ of 59 in 1968, 42 in 1972 and 36 in 1979.    Martin is at 31 this year.   So, relative to his time, he’s even worse than Belanger in those years.   But maybe Belanger in 1979 (+0.7 rWAR) would have still been above replacement at 31 OPS+ instead of 36.    

In any event, Martin ain’t Belanger.  

Shortstop has also changed pretty massively since Belanger's era.  In 2019 the median shortstop (min 25 games) has an OPS+ of 104.  In 1968 that number was 79.  In 1979 it was 76.  In '79 Mario Mendoza had a 25, from slashing .198/.216/.249, and there were 13 others under .600 in 100+ PAs.

In Belanger's time a 100 OPS+ was very good for a shortstop.  Today we have guys like Tatis Jr with a 168.  The average hitting shortstop today is on par with the very best of 40 years ago.

[Philip]

I have a question about Grenier.

 When he was drafted, there were complaints that he was drafted way before where he should’ve been, but he was a glove first shortstop. Since then apparently he has not hit, but he has also not been very good with the glove. I haven’t followed him, but I thought that his defense was good, but apparently it is not. So with that in mind, who would be the next shortstop, if we genuinely wanted to get rid  Martin? 

I like him and I want to keep him, But I’m not married to the guy. If someone better is around, sure I wouldn’t mind making a move.

[Legend_Of_Joey]

5 minutes ago, Philip said:

I have a question about Grenier.

 When he was drafted, there were complaints that he was drafted way before where he should’ve been, but he was a glove first shortstop. Since then apparently he has not hit, but he has also not been very good with the glove. I haven’t followed him, but I thought that his defense was good, but apparently it is not. So with that in mind, who would be the next shortstop, if we genuinely wanted to get rid  Martin? 

I like him and I want to keep him, But I’m not married to the guy. If someone better is around, sure I wouldn’t mind making a move.

Adam Hall.

[Moose Milligan]

23 minutes ago, Philip said:

But I’m not married to the guy. 

I know who has your heart, Philip.

[Philip]

13 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

I know who has your heart, Philip.

You’re just jealous because he doesn’t return your calls...

[jtschrei]

1 hour ago, Philip said:

I have a question about Grenier.

 When he was drafted, there were complaints that he was drafted way before where he should’ve been, but he was a glove first shortstop. Since then apparently he has not hit, but he has also not been very good with the glove. I haven’t followed him, but I thought that his defense was good, but apparently it is not. So with that in mind, who would be the next shortstop, if we genuinely wanted to get rid  Martin? 

I like him and I want to keep him, But I’m not married to the guy. If someone better is around, sure I wouldn’t mind making a move.

I watched 2 Cadyn Grenier games in college after we drafted him and I immediately thought... "This guy is nothing special. Why did we spend a 2nd round pick on him." Just one fan's naked eye take. 

I was also a guy who talked about how by my naked eye, Mike Wright had good stuff. So, I'm obviously no incredible scout. 

 

[BohKnowsBmore]

7 hours ago, wildcard said:

Martin is 24 and skipped AAA.   I don't see the O's DFAing him.  He stays and plays and if Elias can come up with  someone better over the winter then he is optioned to Norfolk next season.    

I'd like to see McCoy promoted to AAA.

This would also allow us to possibly finagle that extra year of control that @Can_of_corn is always going on about.

[tntoriole]

He should bunt more. 

[Enjoy Terror]

Belanger had a 5.6 fWAR season, but had a 105 wRC+ that season (1976), the only year he was over 100.

[sportsfan8703]

1 hour ago, RZNJ said:

Yeah, but be won't be ready for 2 years, if then.

Perfect timing.  We don't want to waste any years of an up and coming player on this mess.  

36 minutes ago, BohKnowsBmore said:

This would also allow us to possibly finagle that extra year of control that @Can_of_corn is always going on about.

I don't think we'll have to worry about an extra year of control over Martin.  

[BohKnowsBmore]

17 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

Perfect timing.  We don't want to waste any years of an up and coming player on this mess.  

I don't think we'll have to worry about an extra year of control over Martin.  

That's what I keep telling CoC! 

[Ruzious]

3 pages in and I still haven't heard a reasonable alternative at SS.  

[VaBird1]

1 minute ago, Ruzious said:

3 pages in and I still haven't heard a reasonable alternative at SS.  

There isn’t one in the system.  The AAA guys have really hit poorly.

[Can_of_corn]

29 minutes ago, BohKnowsBmore said:

That's what I keep telling CoC! 

You know some folks are going to believe you right?