Free agency thread

[Can_of_corn]

5 minutes ago, Just Regular said:

Regular plug that I'm still looking for Example1 of a good MLB pitcher who was still one after thoracic outlet surgery.

Matt Harvey, Chris Archer, famous names.    Stephen Strasburg began from even higher heights, but I'm 55% sure he'll never be any good again either.   I hope I'm wrong.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33472488/

Quote

Conclusion: 74% of professional pitchers who undergo surgical intervention for TOS are able to return to play at the MLB level. With regards to performance, the majority of metrics were unchanged from prior to surgery, indicating return at a similar functional level.

 

[Just Regular]

8 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33472488/

 

Last year I think you replied with this same link when I made this same observation in the Matt Harvey honeymoon days.

No academic rigor here, just a baseball fan looking for some examples out of these 74% who was still any good afterwards.   Seems like there should be plenty of candidates.

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/phil-hughes-and-the-sobering-history-of-thoracic-outlet-injuries/

Bless Jay Jaffe, he has some contemporary successes like Josh Beckett and Alex Cobb.

But plenty a star has fallen to replacement level for a doctor-academic's contention of 74% "similar functional level" to feel correct.    Hopefully the doctors and sport scientists keep getting better all the time.

[Frobby]

8 hours ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

I'm not a big fan of signing Archer.  He's not the same pitcher that Pittsburgh traded 3 prospects for at least 2 of them top prospects.  But there is no excuse for Elias not signing someone else, even a Harvey like signing would make sense.  Seems like starter after starter was called up and failed last year.  It would be nice to have another sure thing, even if it was with an ERA near 6.

I’d rather use the younger pitchers than have a 6 ERA veteran.  

[Sports Guy]

1 minute ago, Frobby said:

I’d rather use the younger pitchers than have a 6 ERA veteran.  

Agreed..which is why we shouldn’t have signed Lyles.

[Can_of_corn]

4 hours ago, Just Regular said:

Last year I think you replied with this same link when I made this same observation in the Matt Harvey honeymoon days.

No academic rigor here, just a baseball fan looking for some examples out of these 74% who was still any good afterwards.   Seems like there should be plenty of candidates.

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/phil-hughes-and-the-sobering-history-of-thoracic-outlet-injuries/

Bless Jay Jaffe, he has some contemporary successes like Josh Beckett and Alex Cobb.

But plenty a star has fallen to replacement level for a doctor-academic's contention of 74% "similar functional level" to feel correct.    Hopefully the doctors and sport scientists keep getting better all the time.

I probably did.

That's an actual piece of scientific data there.  Can't hope for a better source.

Sure beats random recollections.

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, Sports Guy said:

Agreed..which is why we shouldn’t have signed Lyles.

He’ll be good for at least 5.95.   
 

More seriously, there is a risk he’ll be a 6 ERA pitcher in the AL East.   But, he’ll probably be a bit better than that.  And I think three spots for the younger pitchers is about enough, unless we’re going for a bigger upgrade.   

[Just Regular]

1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

I probably did.

That's an actual piece of scientific data there.  Can't hope for a better source.

Sure beats random recollections.

They did use ERA and WHIP, so I guess I am helpless to dispute their conclusions about return to similar functional level.   I will feel good that if Means, Bradish, Hall and Rodriguez are having TOS tonight, Orioles pitching will still more or less be fine in the medium term because surgeon's surgeries are so effective.

The Club can sync everyone up with Druw Jones better that way anyway.

Moose, I think Chris Archer is toast and I don't care that we didn't get him.