Orioles sign Adam Frazier

[Ripken]

37 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

How?  
 

To be clear I am trying to figure out what he is up to but how exactly did he do that? A depth move at $8M makes them worse? 
 

For years around here the bench has been terrible. I watch teams like LAD move guys all over the field. OAK was good at that. We add someone with positional flexibility and now we are worse? Jordan Westburg’s long term career in the majors is not blocked by a one year deal. 

That money (especially on a restricted budget) should have gone to improve the pitching (eg Eovaldi) or get a hitter in an area of need (eg. Brantley).  Instead, he signed a bad player who will now block prospects and likely prohibit additional spending.  If we're talking about a spring training invite, or some other cheap, dumpable contract, it's no big deal.  For $8M he's going to play a lot and likely be bad.  This is like the Odor contract on steroids.  

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

4 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Well I'm sure you signed up for season tickets for the best seat in the house to see the new odor playing everyday at 2B. 

At least when Dan Duquette dumpster dived, he didn't overpay for the player.

The new Odor and it only took a 10x increase in salary to find him. Remind me to never go bargain shopping with Elias. 

[Tony-OH]

1 minute ago, Frobby said:

I’m not as down on this move as a lot of posters, though I don’t love it.  Frazier has had a solid career and was worth 4.1 rWAR just a year ago, 12.3 for his career. He’s a very solid defender who can play in multiple spots.  And perhaps the O’s feel they know why he slumped in 2022 and can help him get back on track.  It’s not like it’s been four years since his last good season.  He’s an upgrade over Odor both offensively and defensively, and more versatile.  

As to the $8 mm, that seems a little pricey, but what do I care?  It’s not going to stop the O’s from doing anything else they want to do.   

For me the big question is, why get him at all when you already have Urias and Vavra, with Westburg and Norby knocking on the door?   And here, I am thinking that a trade involving one or more of them could be in the works.  Then the move would make a lot more sense strategically.  But we’ll see if that happens.  

In the meantime I see it as an unexciting but mild upgrade from what we had last year, just as Gibson is compared to Lyles.  


 

You don't care about the $8 million? You don't care the the team is "mild upgrading" (your words) in places of need.

Even if you want to trade some infield prospects, a 31-year old player with awful EV and barrel numbers at a position of strength is where you want to spend your limited resources? Really?

I know you like to play devils advocate, and I hope that's what you are really trying to do here, but this is the take I expected from RZNJ minus telling everyone they are silly for not agreeing with him.

[Yardball85]

3 minutes ago, Ripken said:

That money (especially on a restricted budget) should have gone to improve the pitching (eg Eovaldi) or get a hitter in an area of need (eg. Brantley).  Instead, he signed a bad player who will now block prospects and likely prohibit additional spending.  If we're talking about a spring training invite, or some other cheap, dumpable contract, it's no big deal.  For $8M he's going to play a lot and likely be bad.  This is like the Odor contract on steroids.  

This. 

[Slight Upward Arc]

6 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Well I'm sure you signed up for season tickets for the best seat in the house to see the new odor playing everyday at 2B. 

At least when Dan Duquette dumpster dived, he didn't overpay for the player.

Lol, if only not for inflation, right behind the dugout actually. I’m pre-pumped for whoever the backup C is going to be. Our next big blockbuster move. 

[RZNJ]

2 hours ago, Finisher said:

Coming off a .612 OPS.

Kyle Gibson and Adam Frazier for 18 mil, what an offseason.

I guess John told him he could spend a little.  18 million and I don't think they are done.   Hey! I'm not crazy about these moves but they seem to be creating deep depth for something.

[eddie83]

Just now, Ripken said:

That money (especially on a restricted budget) should have gone to improve the pitching (eg Eovaldi) or get a hitter in an area of need (eg. Brantley).  Instead, he signed a bad player who will now block prospects and likely prohibit additional spending.  If we're talking about a spring training invite, or some other cheap, dumpable contract, it's no big deal.  For $8M he's going to play a lot and likely be bad.  This is like the Odor contract on steroids.  

He isn’t blocking anyone. It’s a one year deal. I don’t get all this outrage over Westburg. It’s like it’s a given he will produce off the bat. Do you think if he can play he will be blocked forever? 

 

Why do you think this signing made any impact about an Eovaldi? 

[RZNJ]

2 hours ago, TopGunnar said:

Jordan Westburg about to be traded. I hope not 

More likely it's Urias on the go and they pair the veteran with Westburg.   Frazier is also can play some LF and RF.   The better Westburg does, the less 2B Frazier plays and vice versa.    It feels like we are watching Elias put a puzzle together and instead of commenting on each piece we should probably wait until the whole thing is done.   I agree, on the face of it, the question is Why.

[Going Underground]

Here is Elias discussing the somewhat need for a veteran infielder.Starts a little after the 2:45 minute mark 

https://youtu.be/EVZCCzmat0Y

Edited December 15, 2022 by Going Underground

[MarCakes21]

5 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

He isn’t blocking anyone. It’s a one year deal. I don’t get all this outrage over Westburg. It’s like it’s a given he will produce off the bat. Do you think if he can play he will be blocked forever? 

 

Why do you think this signing made any impact about an Eovaldi? 

The point is it's a marginal upgrade over the potential of Westburg.  You bought maybe 0.5 wins over a full season of Westburg (or Ortiz/Vavra/Norby) for $8mil.

And to think you couldn't do something else with that $8mil.

[Just Regular]

24 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

When you are signed for $8 million by the Orioles, the expectation is you are going to be in the lineup pretty much everyday. With second base currently not spoken for, right now we have to expect that Elias sees him as his everyday 2B.

I agree tonight he's as solidly the starter as Odor was most of last year.    Curious to see what phrases are crafted for the MASN media roll out.

[Ripken]

1 minute ago, eddie83 said:

He isn’t blocking anyone. It’s a one year deal. I don’t get all this outrage over Westburg. It’s like it’s a given he will produce off the bat. Do you think if he can play he will be blocked forever? 

 

Why do you think this signing made any impact about an Eovaldi? 

He'll be blocking Westburg (and/or some combination of Urias, Ortiz, Mateo, Norby, Vavra) pretty much every time he takes the field.  Some set of those guys are the future here and certainly look to be better players going forward.

The money impacts any other significant salary we might add because there's a limit on what the Orioles will spend in total and $8M of that budget was just lit on fire.  That's $8M that can no longer be spent on a player who's actually good.

[Frobby]

4 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

You don't care about the $8 million? You don't care the the team is "mild upgrading" (your words) in places of need.

Even if you want to trade some infield prospects, a 31-year old player with awful EV and barrel numbers at a position of strength is where you want to spend your limited resources? Really?

I know you like to play devils advocate, and I hope that's what you are really trying to do here, but this is the take I expected from RZNJ minus telling everyone they are silly for not agreeing with him.

I don’t believe the team’s resources are that limited.  And, it’s a one year deal that has no impact on the team’s resources beyond 2023.   He also won’t be blocking anyone long term, which Elias already said was important to him. 

The EV/barrel numbers are both concerning and interesting.  Basically, his EV numbers have always sucked (including in his good seasons), but he makes a ton of contact and other than last year has been a decent OBP guy.  He’s sort of the anti-Odor offensively, in terms of strengths and weaknesses.  Defensively, the numbers say he’s solidly better.   

So, bottom line, I don’t love the move, I just don’t hate it as much as you and the majority of posters (so far as I can tell).   

 

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

2 minutes ago, Just Regular said:

I agree tonight he's as solidly the starter as Odor was most of last year.    Curious to see what phrases are crafted for the MASN media roll out.

Yeah that's why many of us are pausing at the price tag. Odor was the starting 2B and he was only making $700k last season. At $8M, I don't see how Fraizer isn't making 140 starts next year even is he's horrible again.

I keep thinking maybe there is a trade coming and this move will make more  sense than it does now (which is no sense). 

[Bemorewins]

The most entertaining thing about this off-season is watching the degree that some of you are willing to twist yourself up like pretzels to defend the bizarro moves being made by the team. Keep it coming! This is cathartic comedy