Jump to content

Grayson Rodriguez 2023

Just Regular

By Just Regular
in Orioles Talk

 Share

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 944
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Days

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Days

Popular Posts

Frobby
Frobby

So that’s a wrap on Grayson’s regular season.  He went 7-4 and threw 122 major league innings at a 4.35 ERA, plus 41.1 AAA innings at a 1.98 ERA.  So, that’s 163.1 innings, plus whatever he throws in

Frobby
Frobby

That was a statement game from Grayson.  I’m not sure he’s arrived, but he’s on the train.  

foxfield
foxfield

Growing pains are hard. But it sure looks like he has found his way back to being what he is supposed to be. That was quite an impressive outing. 

Posted Images

CallMeBrooksie Major Leaguer

CallMeBrooksie

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, wildcard said:

GRod, Bradish, Means, Wells, Kremer, Irvin and McDermott after Gibson and Flaherty leave. Then there is Hall.   I don't know that the O's need to add starting pitching this off season.   Nor add position players.

Maybe strengthen the pen depending on how some on the farm develop.

Can't assume that our health luck will continue. In fact you can almost bank on it reversing at some point. I think it would be a big mistake to not target another 2/3 starter this off-season.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
oriole Veteran All-Star

oriole

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, wildcard said:

GRod, Bradish, Means, Wells, Kremer, Irvin and McDermott after Gibson and Flaherty leave. Then there is Hall.   I don't know that the O's need to add starting pitching this off season.   Nor add position players.

Maybe strengthen the pen depending on how some on the farm develop.

I think you absolutely need another starter. Irvin and McDermott are backup options, not guys you depend on. You could say the same for Kremer if you’re trying to have a good and consistent rotation. I just hope whoever they sign is better than Gibson. It’s time to move up the ladder a bit in terms of quality.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
wildcard Hangout Grand Counsel

wildcard

Posted
Posted
57 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Who do you think is available?

I’m pretty interested in keeping Flaherty if he pitches well down the stretch and seems like a clubhouse fit. Not too many free agent pitchers come along who’ve just finished their age 27 season.  

I don't think Elias is going to go get another starter if Means comes back strong.   

Several things about Flaherty that don't think Elias will be ok with.   1) It will take a multi year deal to extend him.   Elias probably does not need to do that.   2) Ever since his arm injury in 2019 he has been injury prone.   3) Also since the injury his fastball has declined in Velo.   When his adrenaline is flowing like his first outing with the O's he is fine.  But I think he will not maintain that in a normal start.     At this point I question his effectiveness in the long term like a 3 year extension.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
wildcard Hangout Grand Counsel

wildcard

Posted
Posted (edited)
27 minutes ago, oriole said:

I think you absolutely need another starter. Irvin and McDermott are backup options, not guys you depend on. You could say the same for Kremer if you’re trying to have a good and consistent rotation. I just hope whoever they sign is better than Gibson. It’s time to move up the ladder a bit in terms of quality.

I disagree.   GRod and Bradish will be better next year than this year.  We have to see but I think Means will be a very good #3.   Wells has shown he is a #2 for half a year.  Kremer is consistent.  He looks like he is going to make 30 starts.     Kremer is currently 11-4.   That is not luck.   He had a bad April but since that he has had maybe 3 bad starts.   HIs ERA in the 2nd half is 3.71.

Irvin can be the long man/spot starter.   He has been looking pretty good in the 2nd half.   McDermott can begin 2024 in AAA and be available when needed.   He is doing great at AAA.

At this point, I see no reason to go spend a bunch of money on FA pitching.  And I don't think Elias will either.

I do think Elias will add some pitching to the minors this off season.

Edited by wildcard
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Spy Fox Hangout Veteran Council

Spy Fox

Posted
Posted
17 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I don't think Elias is going to go get another starter if Means comes back strong.   

Several things about Flaherty that don't think Elias will be ok with.   1) It will take a multi year deal to extend him.   Elias probably does not need to do that.   2) Ever since his arm injury in 2019 he has been injury prone.   3) Also since the injury his fastball has declined in Velo.   When his adrenaline is flowing like his first outing with the O's he is fine.  But I think he will not maintain that in a normal start.     At this point I question his effectiveness in the long term like a 3 year extension.

I don't think a multi year FA SP deal is likely, but I continue to think it's likely we see a hitting prospects for MLB SP trade. The big one didn't happen this summer, but this winter when prices are lower, I think it just makes too much sense.

The prospect wave has left us simply with too many talented young hitters to fit on the roster. 

The alternative I guess is that some more veteran hitters (the Hays/Mullins/Santander/Urias category) are traded, but either for MLB relievers or for prospects. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
CallMeBrooksie Major Leaguer

CallMeBrooksie

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I disagree.   GRod and Bradish will be better next year than this year.  We have to see but I think Means will be a very good #3.   Wells has shown he is a #2 for half a year.  Kremer is consistent.  He looks like he is going to make 30 starts.     Kremer is currently 11-4.   That is not luck.   He had a bad April but since that he has had maybe 3 bad starts.   HIs ERA in the 2nd half is 3.71.

This might be the most orange-colored-glasses outlook on our starting pitching we could conceive of. I like our guys, and I think each of them individually are capable of performing next year as well or better as you've described, but the possibility of them all taking a step forward next year is basically zero. I've been watching baseball for too long to buy into that. Someone will stumble. And then you have the (very likely) possibility that multiple starters will spend significant time on the IL, sometimes in overlapping stints.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

Posted
Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I disagree.   GRod and Bradish will be better next year than this year.  We have to see but I think Means will be a very good #3.   Wells has shown he is a #2 for half a year.  Kremer is consistent.  He looks like he is going to make 30 starts.     Kremer is currently 11-4.   That is not luck.   He had a bad April but since that he has had maybe 3 bad starts.   HIs ERA in the 2nd half is 3.71.

Irvin can be the long man/spot starter.   He has been looking pretty good in the 2nd half.   McDermott can begin 2024 in AAA and be available when needed.   He is doing great at AAA.

At this point, I see no reason to go spend a bunch of money on FA pitching.  And I don't think Elias will either.

I do think Elias will add some pitching to the minors with off season.

Wells has proven you can’t rely on him over a full season.

We need to see how Bradish and GRod bounce back in 2024 from workloads in 2023.

Kremer has a 4.5 ERA but his xERA is 5.46 and his FIP is 4.96. His statcast data isn’t good.  I wouldn’t rely on him next year.

Means will be entering his first full year since the surgery.

The MiL pitching depth has potential with McDermott, Povich and Hall but it’s far from anything concrete.

The team has a clear and obvious need for someone at or near the top of the rotation. Whether it be a FA on a 2-4 year deal (likely no more than 3 though) or a trade for a young starter from a team like Seattle, the need is definitely there. 
 

Not to mention, you don’t just sit on your hands and expect the same outcome after being good. You have to keep improving the team and right now, the Os aren’t going to spend on the offense and they shouldn’t but they need to add a top flight starter and another high end BP arm. 
 

Those are the 2 obvious and clear needs in the offseason.

You are essentially advocating for them to do what they did after 2012 and 2014…and that is just wrong.

Edited by Sports Guy
Link to comment
Share on other sites
wildcard Hangout Grand Counsel

wildcard

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Spy Fox said:

I don't think a multi year FA SP deal is likely, but I continue to think it's likely we see a hitting prospects for MLB SP trade. The big one didn't happen this summer, but this winter when prices are lower, I think it just makes too much sense.

The prospect wave has left us simply with too many talented young hitters to fit on the roster. 

The alternative I guess is that some more veteran hitters (the Hays/Mullins/Santander/Urias category) are traded, but either for MLB relievers or for prospects. 

I think Elias will use some of the minor league hitting prospects to add minor league pitching.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Aristotelian Hangout Grand Counsel

Aristotelian

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Frobby said:

Who do you think is available?

I’m pretty interested in keeping Flaherty if he pitches well down the stretch and seems like a clubhouse fit. Not too many free agent pitchers come along who’ve just finished their age 27 season.  

Extending Flaherty just because he's the guy we're familiar with would be the Buck/Duquette thing to do. I don't think it's going to be the Elias strategy. I might be interested if he would accept a team friendly deal but why would he do that? Flaherty cost us only Prieto. We have tons more assets like Prieto to get pitching if we need it. Right now I'm feeling pretty good about a top 3 of Grayson/Bradish/Means plus Kremer and Irvin.

If we are going to extend someone, Means might have more incentive as we can hit him with a QO if he does well next year. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
jerios55 Major Leaguer

jerios55

Posted
Posted

Not that we can truly rely on a guy that hasn't pitched, but Seth Johnson will be out of options next season and need to be with the big club, correct?  If so, I wonder if they treat him similar to a rule V type 26th man out of the bullpen if he is looking healthy.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
oriole Veteran All-Star

oriole

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I disagree.   GRod and Bradish will be better next year than this year.  We have to see but I think Means will be a very good #3.   Wells has shown he is a #2 for half a year.  Kremer is consistent.  He looks like he is going to make 30 starts.     Kremer is currently 11-4.   That is not luck.   He had a bad April but since that he has had maybe 3 bad starts.   HIs ERA in the 2nd half is 3.71.

Irvin can be the long man/spot starter.   He has been looking pretty good in the 2nd half.   McDermott can begin 2024 in AAA and be available when needed.   He is doing great at AAA.

At this point, I see no reason to go spend a bunch of money on FA pitching.  And I don't think Elias will either.

I do think Elias will add some pitching to the minors this off season.

Ah, an optimist I see. I feel the opposite, but not necessarily a pessimist. I think Rodriguez will be better, but it’s gonna real hard for Bradish to be better than he is this year. Means is a complete question mark. Kremer should be the 6th man to fill in when needed. I’d give Wells the inside track to getting a rotation spot next year for sure. That leaves one spot open, in my mind. There’s room on the payroll and a big hole. Maybe Flaherty or someone like Montgomery? Nothing crazy

Link to comment
Share on other sites
wildcard Hangout Grand Counsel

wildcard

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, CallMeBrooksie said:

This might be the most orange-colored-glasses outlook on our starting pitching we could conceive of. I like our guys, and I think each of them individually are capable of performing next year as well or better as you've described, but the possibility of them all taking a step forward next year is basically zero. I've been watching baseball for too long to buy into that. Someone will stumble. And then you have the (very likely) possibility that multiple starters will spend significant time on the IL, sometimes in overlapping stints.

I mentioned 7 starters for 5 rotation spots.   I agree there will be injuries and poor performance.  Elias may add some minor league pitching.   But I don't see him spending a bunch of money of FA pitching.  Maybe another Irvin type trade for added pitching depth.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
 Share
Go to topic listing

  • Posts

    • Sydnor
      Anthony Santander 2024

      By Sydnor · Posted

      It is absolutely possible. In 2022, the Mets gave a QO to Bassitt, Nikki, and DeGrom. The Red Sox gave a QO to Boegarts and Eovaldi. The Yankees gave a QO to Judge and Rizzo. The Dodgers gave a QO to Turner and Anderson. I know that it seems to be a foregone conclusion that Santander will not be on the team after this season, and while I generally agree that it is more probable than not that he will not be re-signed, I do think there is a non-zero chance that he will be retained. I think he is the most likely of Mullins, Hays, and himself to be retained, even if it is a small chance. The team has told us how they feel about his bat because he plays essentially everyday, and I have heard Kostka say that they value his clubhouse presence.
    • Philip
      Anthony Santander 2024

      By Philip · Posted

      Santander won’t get a QO, and if he did, he would accept. His defense is declining and we have too many capable youngsters who should replace him effectively. But to your question, I don’t know if there’s a limit, but I doubt it.
    • OriolesMagic83
      The 2024 Trade Deadline

      By OriolesMagic83 · Posted

      O's will probably have to wait till July for a trade because there are so many more buyers than sellers.  I think teams like the Blue Jays, Rays Tigers and Mets are likely to be sellers but they are still in the race although not very good teams as constituted. 
    • Philip
      The 2024 Trade Deadline

      By Philip · Posted

      No Scott. He’s way too undependable. We need someone who WON’T enter a game and walk folks like he’s promoting a healthy lifestyle. He’s been a lot bette4 this season, but he’s too undependable, and we already have too many of those. No Flaherty either. That’s like taking your GF back after she cheated on you.
    • 24fps
      The 2024 Trade Deadline

      By 24fps · Posted

      The team's continued success has really put Elias on the spot IMO and I don't see a Flaherty type as an option anymore.  My money is on a sensible trade that comes at a price high enough that most of us here, including myself, won't like, but a premium comes with having bad luck and that's where the O's are at the moment.
    • 24fps
      The 2024 Trade Deadline

      By 24fps · Posted

      I would be very surprised if every last one of the GM's Elias talks to about quality starting pitching doesn't start by asking about Westburg and the rest.  Again, I think it's a mistake to believe that the O's have a ton of leverage here.  They certainly have some, and Elias is smart and disciplined, but I don't see any bargains.  I especially don't see the luxury of acting like youth and multiple years of control is any kind of rigid starting point for the O's.
    • Hallas
      Kyle Bradish 2024

      By Hallas · Posted

      I say this as someone who defended Cowser like 2 posts ago, but like his fWAR number is entirely dependent on how much you're buying his defense.  I can totally buy the argument that maybe OAA is overrating him a bit, so he's not really on pace to be a 5.5 win player.  The OAA number is pretty eye-popping.

  • Popular Contributors

×
×
  • Create New...