Hicks > McKenna

[sportsfan8703]

2 hours ago, SemperFi said:

Offensively I think they are a wash but Hicks does everything on defense McKenna sometimes misses.  He is a professional; he knows the batters, he hits cut off men, maybe plays a little deeper now but takes good routes, decent arm.  He also adds a veteran (playoff too) prescence which ME seems to value.

I don’t think this is true at all. Hicks’ floor is McKenna’s ceiling. I like Mckenna, but he’ll be in Vavra world shortly. Meaning that he’s not better offensively or defensively than our top 4 MLB OF. Mullins, Hays, Hicks, and Cowser.

Haskin makes McKenna expendable as well. 

[Sports Guy]

51 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Hicks is on a one year contract.   He will be a FA at the end of the season if the O's don't extend him.  He will probably want a starting job next season the O’s may not be able to offer that.

 If Hicks continues to play well.  And if Cowser plays well; Hays and Mullins are healthy.  The O's  will have to decide if they trade Hicks at the deadline for a prospect.   

How much better will Hicks be  as a backup a the deadline than McKenna, Stowers, Kjerstad, Cameron, Haskin, Vavra?

You are obsessed with trading vets who have zero value. 
 

Hicks is here to stay and if he is performing, he should be here to stay. A back up OFer with his experience has value to a contender, much more than he will get in trade.

[wildcard]

8 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

You are obsessed with trading vets who have zero value. 
 

Hicks is here to stay and if he is performing, he should be here to stay. A back up OFer with his experience has value to a contender, much more than he will get in trade.

That may be true.  I am just saying that is a decision Elias will have to make.  Last year he traded Mancini and Lopez.   But he was not trying to win.   I don't know what he will do this year.  But I am interested to find out.

[Sports Guy]

Just now, wildcard said:

That may be true.  I am just saying that is a decision Elias will have to make.  Last year he traded Mancini and Lopez.   But he was not trying to win.   I don't know what he will do this year.  But I am interested to find out.

He traded those guys because they had actual value.

The players you keep bringing up have no value.

That is your difference.

Frazier was a god awful signing but he’s here now and he could hold some value to us as a part time guy/pinch hitter as the season goes on and in the playoffs.

That will be worth more to us than the nothing players he brings back.

I would say the same about Hicks.

[wildcard]

4 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

He traded those guys because they had actual value.

The players you keep bringing up have no value.

That is your difference.

Frazier was a god awful signing but he’s here now and he could hold some value to us as a part time guy/pinch hitter as the season goes on and in the playoffs.

That will be worth more to us than the nothing players he brings back.

I would say the same about Hicks.

All depends on how those two players perform over the next 7 weeks.

[Sports Guy]

3 minutes ago, wildcard said:

All depends on how those two players perform over the next 7 weeks.

Not really. There are aspects to their games where they likely will hold value to this team. Probably as a 25th and 26th man but they could make a mark in important situations. 
 

[wildcard]

9 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Not really. There are aspects to their games where they likely will hold value to this team. Probably as a 25th and 26th man but they could make a mark in important situations. 
 

I can't agree on Mancini vs Hicks.  You say Mancini had trade value but Hicks does not.   Both had injury histories that lowered their value.  But Elias got two prospects for Mancini.   If Hicks is performing well at the deadline he will probably have as much trade value as Mancini did.  Now whether Elias will trade him is another question.

[Sports Guy]

Just now, wildcard said:

I can't agree on Mancini vs Hicks.  You say Mancini had trade value but Hicks does not.   Both had injury histories that lowered their value.  But Elias got two prospects for Mancini.   If Hicks is performing well at the deadline he will probably have as much trade value as Mancini did.  Now whether Elias will trade him is another question.

Hicks hasn’t been good for a while, at least offensively. That is what holds him back.

It’s an apples to oranges comp.

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I can't agree on Mancini vs Hicks.  You say Mancini had trade value but Hicks does not.   Both had injury histories that lowered their value.  But Elias got two prospects for Mancini.   If Hicks is performing well at the deadline he will probably have as much trade value as Mancini did.  Now whether Elias will trade him is another question.

Mancini snagged a 2/14M deal after he collapsed for the Astros.

Do you think Hicks could get that on the open market?

[wildcard]

4 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Hicks hasn’t been good for a while, at least offensively. That is what holds him back.

It’s an apples to oranges comp.

Mancini's best year was in 2019.  Then the cancer and he missed 2020.  He came back some in 2021.  But in 2022 he had lost power with 10 homers in 401 PAs  and a 404 slugging before the trade.    So Mancini perform was not great for the three years before he was traded.  

Sound apples to apples to me.

[Aristotelian]

Also not sure if this goes without saying but McKenna can be optioned. We may need his spot on the 40 man for other purposes but it is possible that we could keep both.

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, wildcard said:

Mancini's best year was in 2019.  Then the cancer and he missed 2020.  He came back some in 2021.  But in 2022 he had lost power with 10 homers in 401 PAs  and a 404 slugging before the trade.    So Mancini perform was not great for the three years before he was traded.  

Sound apples to apples to me.

Mancini had a 115 OPS+ despite the wall in left sapping his HR total.

Edited June 9, 2023 by Can_of_corn

[wildcard]

7 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Mancini snagged a 2/14M deal after he collapsed for the Astros.

Do you think Hicks could get that on the open market?

Depends on how he plays the rest of year.   If he hits well and plays the defense I have been watching he might.  Of course he is 33 but he does not have the cancer hanging over him.

[Sports Guy]

2 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Mancini's best year was in 2019.  Then the cancer and he missed 2020.  He came back some in 2021.  But in 2022 he had lost power with 10 homers in 401 PAs  and a 404 slugging before the trade.    So Mancini perform was not great for the three years before he was traded.  

Sound apples to apples to me.

Mancini was better offensively…and that was a bigger deal at that point in the year. It was also a 3 team deal, so that changes some of the equation.  Almost all of Hicks value the last several years has been defense. Teams aren’t trading anything for that.

But we got “too much” for Mancini. That’s not happening again.

[wildcard]

1 minute ago, Sports Guy said:

Mancini was better offensively…and that was a bigger deal at that point in the year. It was also a 3 team deal, so that changes some of the equation.  Almost all of Hicks value the last several years has been defense. Teams aren’t trading anything for that.

But we got “too much” for Mancini. That’s not happening again.

So you are saying the Elias is that good at trading that he fleeced the Astros and Rays.   If he is that good he could get a good deal for Hicks.