Roch wants us to lower expectations

[oriole]

Considering Roch is a mouthpiece, this speaks volumes. It’s undoubtedly a concerted effort by ownership to reverse whatever words were said about improving the team because once again John is sitting on a golden toilet wondering where he can squeeze some more money into his own bank account. The ultra-wealthy are the absolute worst.

[RZNJ]

Cease is due about 8.8M this year.  We just signed Kimbrel for 13M guaranteed.  This isn’t all about money.  It’s about Elias not giving up what other teams want.  Plus he could trade Santander and come out ahead on payroll.   

[Ripken]

1 minute ago, Moose Milligan said:

Can’t lower expectations if you didn’t have any to begin with. Some of you guys need to get on my page. 

I've been driving that bus, man.  All the FA/Trade talk is fun so everyone can have at it but I don't partake much.  I have zero expectation that a JA run team will ever add, or even retain, expensive talent.  We're not even the Rays and that's that.  As is stands, it's been several years since the Orioles spent real money.  One day, eventually, a miracle will happen and I'll just let that be a great surprise gift.

[DrinkinWithFermi]

[Ripken]

1 minute ago, RZNJ said:

Cease is due about 8.8M this year.  We just signed Kimbrel for 13M guaranteed.  This isn’t all about money.  It’s about Elias not giving up what other teams want.  Plus he could trade Santander and come out ahead on payroll.   

This is true but it's also all related.  I mean, ME likes his toys, and he should, they're good toys.  But he also knows he HAS to rely on years of cheap production from prospects because he'll never be able to spend real money.  Giving up a Cowser isn't just about liking Cowser, it's also about what if that creates some roster hole down the road, he won't be able to buy a good FA OF to fill it.  (Yes, I know the Orioles plan is always to fill from within but there could be a time where that's not an option if a few of these kids don't fulfill their potential).

[George Zuverink]

1 hour ago, Roll Tide said:

Was Elias quoted recently as saying a #3 type recently? I believe i commented that we are going to end up with Wacha

Maybe Mike should remember that if he signed Blake Snell, he would have upgraded the #3 and #4 spots, just not with the guy he signed, 

[RZNJ]

Just now, Ripken said:

This is true but it's also all related.  I mean, ME likes his toys, and he should, they're good toys.  But he also knows he HAS to rely on years of cheap production from prospects because he'll never be able to spend real money.  Giving up a Cowser isn't just about liking Cowser, it's also about what if that creates some roster hole down the road, he won't be able to buy a good FA OF to fill it.  (Yes, I know the Orioles plan is always to fill from within but there could be a time where that's not an option if a few of these kids don't fulfill their potential).

I wasn’t criticizing, just trying to explain.  Elias’ will be judged on how players like Cowser turn out if he’s basically making them untouchable right now.   

[dystopia]

Well, I mean.... Cease is basically a #3 starter (at least would be on our staff). I don't think anyone realistically expected us to get Burnes. 

Sounds like Cease isn't happening though because Elias won't meet the White Sox's asking price.

I can't hate a Wacha type move though. We'd have a rotation of Bradish, G-Rod, Means, Wacha, and Kremer. I'd stack that up against most rotations out there. Plus you have Irvin and Wells for depth and McDermott and Povich also waiting in the wings. 

[Roll Tide]

16 minutes ago, George Zuverink said:

Maybe Mike should remember that if he signed Blake Snell, he would have upgraded the #3 and #4 spots, just not with the guy he signed, 

Sure … but it’s my belief that he recently said adding a #3 as opposed to a #1 to lower expectations.

[HakunaSakata]

I'd have so much more respect for this organization if Elias and Angelos just stuck to issuing statements (and being straight with the fans) as opposed to having an employee masquerading as a reporter write another glorified propaganda piece. 

And I get the fact that contract lengths and amounts might prohibit them from signing a #1 SP, but there's absolutely no reason they can't trade for one if the front office things that's what they need. Elias might not have a surplus of dollars to spend, but he certainly has a surplus of players at certain positions. 

[HakunaSakata]

Also, I see people tossing out Michael Wacha name as a possible consolation prize. He's coming off a second season in which his expected ERA (xERA) was more than a full run higher than his actual ERA. And he has a K/9 that's well below 9. I'm honestly not sure that he's even a better pitcher than Kyle Gibson, but he'll certainly cost more. Seems like a really strange player for an analytics driven front office to target.  

[Keygans]

Translation:   “The costs in the trade market is higher than we thought prospect wise and I am not allowed to spend anymore after Kimbrell”

 

This… sucks .  NO reason whatsoever with our prospects we cannot pull multiple trades to improve this roster and get a TOR starter.  If money really is an issue with JA being cheap, then use Santander and/or Hays in the trades.   Like someone said last week… it looks like Hays has little value comparatively to a recent trade but it is THEIR job to get creative and improve the team .    Our AL East opponents are all improving and we cannot make our only “impact” move be signing a closer to replace Felix.   

[interloper]

1 hour ago, Frobby said:

The thing about Wacha is that he doesn’t eat many innings.  

True, but reading between the lines with some of what Elias said, I don't think it's as big of a concern this year. It's also part of what makes him inexpensive. But point taken nonetheless, they do like a guy who can chew innings.

[George Zuverink]

25 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

Sure … but it’s my belief that he recently said adding a #3 as opposed to a #1 to lower expectations.

I fully expect a Wacha-type signing  to be the most we should expect. I was just goofing on this phrasing from Roch's pre-emptive article, pointing out that if you want to create more clearance for the boat, you can raise the bridge or lower the water.

"...And I think if we’re able to upgrade the third or the fourth spot in the rotation instead, that would just as well present a pretty good upgrade and stability to the rotation.

 

 

Edited December 9, 2023 by George Zuverink

[clapdiddy]

7 minutes ago, George Zuverink said:

I fully expect a Wacha-type signing  to be the most we should expect. I was just goofing on this phrasing from Roch's pre-emptive article, pointing out that if you want to create more clearance for the boat, you can raise the bridge or lower the water.

"...And I think if we’re able to upgrade the third or the fourth spot in the rotation instead, that would just as well present a pretty good upgrade and stability to the rotation.

 

 

What's the difference between Wacha and Gibson?  I'd say pretty minimal.  It looks like they will go as far as Bradish and Grod will take them as "aces".  I think that's fine for the regular season, but I think another top arm is needed for the playoffs.  Not sure that Wacha is that guy.