Holliday call up?

[HandsomeQuack]

23 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

Since he didn't start on the roster they have already given up the possibility of the bonus ROY pick. So if they call him up and he ends up top two ROY, that only works against the O's and we lose a year of his service time.

Technically if they call him up early enough to get the full year of service, he is still eligible for a PPI pick.

[Roll Tide]

59 minutes ago, pocketRIPKENS said:

Hear me out here. If they weren’t lying about service time being an issue, Holliday should be up for the Boston series w/ all righties. Urias/Kemp better heed this. Urias 0-season and an error. 
 

What are the exact details of a Holliday call up IF they ARE IN FACT manipulating service time although I think he win or get top 2 in ROY making the point moot— Can someone elaborate on details of a call up?

Don’t know that I’ve ever seen a post get 7 down votes. Talk about inciting a riot.

Edited April 2 by Roll Tide

[pocketRIPKENS]

Can a moderator change the topic with a question mark (?) or add or change verbiage so everyone can exhale? The Baltimore sun has a great article of timelines with 5 specific dates but I don’t have a subscription and I refuse to get one. Anyone able to copy and paste?

[EdwinRip]

We can still get the extra pick if he comes up within the next few weeks…..it’s still on the table as of now.

[pocketRIPKENS]

I guess my point is, what are the EXACT dates? If available or known. I want to calendar this out. 

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

7 minutes ago, pocketRIPKENS said:

Can a moderator change the topic with a question mark (?) or add or change verbiage so everyone can exhale? The Baltimore sun has a great article of timelines with 5 specific dates but I don’t have a subscription and I refuse to get one. Anyone able to copy and paste?

Just paste this URL: https://www.baltimoresun.com/2024/04/02/orioles-minor-league-report-jackson-holliday/

on https://www.removepaywall.com/

[Frobby]

34 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

Since he didn't start on the roster they have already given up the possibility of the bonus ROY pick. 

Incorrect.  If he gets called up by April 11, he would earn 172 days of service (one full year) the “regular way” and the O’s would earn a draft pick if he won ROY.  The O’s didn’t give up anything by not having him on the OD roster.  Once April 12 rolls around, they have.  

[justD]

@pocketRIPKENSOr this:

Quote

By JACOB CALVIN MEYER | jameyer@baltsun.com

April 2, 2024 at 5:00 a.m.

Here are five timelines — some specific, others more amorphous — for when Holliday could be promoted to Baltimore.

When he’s deemed ready

Keyword: deemed.

Holliday is ready to be a big leaguer, and the Orioles have already said as much. Manager Brandon Hyde said “it’s hard to say he doesn’t” look like a big leaguer after one of the 20-year-old’s many impressive performances this spring, and Elias spoke highly of the infielder at the end of camp.

But Elias said he is committed to doing what’s best for Holliday’s development, noting the organization’s positive “track record” with top prospects Adley Rutschman and Gunnar Henderson quickly having success in the big leagues.

“I believe our capabilities are sound in this area,” Elias said.

Elias provided two areas they wanted to see improvement out of Holliday before bringing him up to be an everyday player. The Orioles didn’t want Holliday, a left-handed hitter, sitting against lefties in the majors, and his lack of experience and success off quality southpaws was one of the reasons Elias gave for keeping him in the minors. His position change to second base was another.

The Orioles determining that Holliday has checked those two boxes could come anytime this year — from sometime this month or in May or later.

“When we feel that he’s ready to impact the team in a complete and permanent way and not expose him to risk of failure that would involve us shrinking his role or sending him back down, we’re going to figure out a way to accommodate that,” Elias said.

Jackson Holliday had a strong spring training for the Orioles but did not make the team out of camp. (Mark Taylor/The Canadian Press via AP)

After April 13

Elias said service time didn’t play a role in his Holliday decision. He called service-time manipulation a “specter” and that it’s “unfortunate” it’s something that’s discussed.

There is no way to know how much — if at all — service time was a factor, but the economics of baseball are clear. If a team keeps a top prospect in the minors for a little more than two weeks, it can have that player for another year because of the way MLB calculates service time.

That date this season is April 13, meaning if the Orioles bring up Holliday on or after that date, they would likely get him for a seventh season — the 2030 campaign — before he hits free agency. The only way Holliday can combat this is by finishing in the top two of American League Rookie of the Year voting, gaining a full year of service for 2024, as Rutschman did in 2022.

Holliday being called up on or after April 13 doesn’t mean his reassignment was service-time manipulation. But him being promoted before that date would mean it wasn’t.

When there’s an injury

Last year, Grayson Rodriguez was reassigned to the minors after an up-and-down spring training, but he was the next man up in the rotation.

Kyle Bradish took a line drive off his leg in his first start of the season, and the club’s then-top pitching prospect was promoted to make his first start. There is no way to predict an injury, but the same could happen for Holliday.

If an injury befalls an Orioles middle infielder, it could lead to Holliday making his way north. Elias didn’t say one way or the other when asked at the end of camp whether Holliday would be the next man up on the infield.

“I think it’s very dependent on what we’re talking about in terms of vacancies,” he said.

Sometime in June

If the Orioles keep Holliday in the minors into June, it could raise questions about if they’re doing so for cost-saving purposes. This one is a little in the weeds, but it’s an important factor for how much young stars are paid before they reach free agency.

Here’s a quick refresher: Players don’t reach free agency until after playing for six years. MLB calculates a full year of service as 172 days on the active roster (or on MLB’s injured list), but the league calendar has 187 days. Players with more than three years but fewer than six years of service are eligible for arbitration, a pay-raise structure that increases each year.

 

[OriolesMagic83]

On the old board where top posters earned birds for their reputation, the OP might earn a negative bird, maybe in red?

[interloper]

I don't think Elias is going to abide by any dates or ROTY rules or any of that. It's going to go by how Holliday looks defensively playing 2B. I know that's viewed as naive around here, but I really do believe that Elias isn't really a service time guy. He could have done so much more in that regard if he was. 

Edited April 2 by interloper

[Aristotelian]

3 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Incorrect.  If he gets called up by April 11, he would earn 172 days of service (one full year) the “regular way” and the O’s would earn a draft pick if he won ROY.  The O’s didn’t give up anything by not having him on the OD roster.  Once April 12 rolls around, they have.  

Interesting, I have seen so much conflicting info on this, the clarification is appreciated. 

[justD]

For the record, I think the all caps and wording of the title is horrendous. 

I also have some issues with the Baltimore Sun and have gotten this close to unsubscribing so many times.  I continue to have a subscription for Orioles coverage only. 

Much prefer the Baltimore Banner. 

[Roll Tide]

20 minutes ago, pocketRIPKENS said:

Can a moderator change the topic with a question mark (?) or add or change verbiage so everyone can exhale? The Baltimore sun has a great article of timelines with 5 specific dates but I don’t have a subscription and I refuse to get one. Anyone able to copy and paste?

You can …go to your first post. Click on the …  3 dots top right of post,  then edit, 

Edited April 2 by Roll Tide

[Frobby]

17 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

Interesting, I have seen so much conflicting info on this, the clarification is appreciated. 

I may have been off one day, according to what @justDposted.  But you get the point.  

[pocketRIPKENS]

14 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

You can …go to your first post. Click on the …  3 dots top right of post,  then edit, 

I tried. It only gives me a “share” or “report” option. Again, I’m sorry guys. I joined this in 2008, probably haven’t posted in 10 years and probably haven’t been on site in 3-4 years— IDK. I’ll do better next time.