Basallo for Miller y/n?

[Bemorewins]

2 hours ago, Orioles5258 said:

Miller for Rodriguez trade got us 20 innings out of Andrew Miller and no world series win while the Red Sox got 14 WAR out of Rodriguez. 

Miller for Basallo is rolling the dice on what could turn out to be one of the worst trades in franchise history.   

This is not 2014. Not even close!

We have a young great team, that (on paper) is better than that one. And Mason Miller has FIVE more years of club control after this one. He is not a pending FA like Andrew Miller was. He can help us for multiple seasons. 

[Bemorewins]

2 hours ago, Rbiggs2525 said:

Give me back Hunter Harvey for someone like Jud Fabian.

You are willing to potentially put the fate of our World Series hopes in the hands of Hunter Harvey? … I’m genuinely curious as to why when there are much better delivers to be had (one of which is Miller).

[LookinUp]

I agree that Miller would cost a lot in a trade. I also see his arm as a ticking time bomb.

I don't agree that Basallo is anywhere near on the table for him.

Based on that article posted earlier in this thread, guys I could see being interesting would include:

Position Players: Bradfield, Horvath, Beavers, Fabian, Etzel, Willems, Tavera, Sosa, Liranzo, Arias, etc.

Pitchers: a sweetener/headliner could include Bright, DeLeon, Weston, Chace, Sharkey (many here depending on the role in the trade)

The point is that you could still put together a very attractive package for a team targeting 3+ years from now to win without including Basallo or any of our AAA guys.

[DrungoHazewood]

1 hour ago, Bemorewins said:

This is not 2014. Not even close!

We have a young great team, that (on paper) is better than that one. And Mason Miller has FIVE more years of club control after this one. He is not a pending FA like Andrew Miller was. He can help us for multiple seasons. 

Yes, but what five years, as it's more-or-less inevitable that he'll be out roughly 18 months for UCL surgery. And perhaps a 2nd after that.

What is are TJ surgery odds in any given season for someone that touches 102? 25%? 33%?

Basallo has a fair shot at getting 8,000, 10,000 or more MLB plate appearances. Miller might not face 2000 batters before his arm is wrecked.

[Rbiggs2525]

1 hour ago, Bemorewins said:

You are willing to potentially put the fate of our World Series hopes in the hands of Hunter Harvey? … I’m genuinely curious as to why when there are much better delivers to be had (one of which is Miller).

Miller has thrown 24 games in MLB baseball with a track record of injuries. I’d love to have him but cost vs risk has me lean towards someone like Harvey. Not sure if you have looked up what he’s done recently but his metrics are pretty strong. I think Elias still has Craig Kimbrel the closer of World Series and not going to let 2 games deter him.

[Bemorewins]

45 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Yes, but what five years, as it's more-or-less inevitable that he'll be out roughly 18 months for UCL surgery. And perhaps a 2nd after that.

What is are TJ surgery odds in any given season for someone that touches 102? 25%? 33%?

Basallo has a fair shot at getting 8,000, 10,000 or more MLB plate appearances. Miller might not face 2000 batters before his arm is wrecked.

There is risk involved either way. There is a risk that Basallo never becomes the player we all hope or even half that.

[RZNJ]

4 minutes ago, Bemorewins said:

There is risk involved either way. There is a risk that Basallo never becomes the player we all hope or even half that.

Sure, and the consensus seems to be it’s not worth the risk.

[Bemorewins]

43 minutes ago, Rbiggs2525 said:

Miller has thrown 24 games in MLB baseball with a track record of injuries. I’d love to have him but cost vs risk has me lean towards someone like Harvey. Not sure if you have looked up what he’s done recently but his metrics are pretty strong. I think Elias still has Craig Kimbrel the closer of World Series and not going to let 2 games deter him.

Would you rather Miller have thrown 124 games already? 224? The low amount of games is a bonus IMO because there is not as much wear and tear on that arm.

Secondly, it is a TREMENDOUS risk inserting Hunter Harvey as closer. More than Miller IMO because he has NEVER been that before. The talent of the two are not equivalent and not that close IMO. If I am going to bet on someone with a limited track record, give me the one with the superior talent.

Craig Kimbrel is not an elite closer at this point. First of all, he is limited to 1 inning and in April (the beginning of the season) he has already shown issues with holding up when being relied upon with relative frequency (thus taxing the rest of the pen because he can't be counted on to shoulder a regular work load.

 

[Bemorewins]

3 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

Sure, and the consensus seems to be it’s not worth the risk.

That it does. But the consensus last season was that we were good going into October with the rotation as is. And we see how well that worked out. The consensus can be wrong.

[RZNJ]

Just now, Bemorewins said:

That it does. But the consensus last season was that we were good going into October with the rotation as is. And we see how well that worked out. The consensus can be wrong.

Sure.  And Mason Miller wouldn’t have made one bit of difference last October.  I get it.   Miller is a difference maker.  He’s an elite talent.  I’d love to have him.   The risk of injury and the potential career of Basallo make it a tough sell.

[Bemorewins]

4 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

Sure.  And Mason Miller wouldn’t have made one bit of difference last October.  I get it.   Miller is a difference maker.  He’s an elite talent.  I’d love to have him.   The risk of injury and the potential career of Basallo make it a tough sell.

This is a different team. Corbin Burnes would have made a difference IMO and we have now acquired him. 

I am not dogmatic in believing that it has to be Miller and nothing/nobody else. I am saying that there is a serious argument to be made that Miller or another elite backend bullpen weapon is the piece to take us over the top when the Fall get's here.

With a team this good who has legit WS aspirations with a strong argument to be made that we have the best team in the AL, I would hate for us to pin our WS hopes on a pitcher like Craig Kimbrel at this point in his career. IMO he is not good/reliable enough.

If we have to get into a game (in October) where it turns into a battle of the bullpens, I would prefer not to have bring a knife to a gun fight.

 

[ChosenOne21]

16 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

I just can’t fathom a realistic scenario where I’m trading Mayo or Basallo in any deal.

I think I could be convinced to move Mayo as the headliner for a top of the rotation pitcher with multiple years of club control. You're only getting Basallo if you can pry him from my cold dead hands.

[Rbiggs2525]

23 minutes ago, Bemorewins said:

Would you rather Miller have thrown 124 games already? 224? The low amount of games is a bonus IMO because there is not as much wear and tear on that arm.

Secondly, it is a TREMENDOUS risk inserting Hunter Harvey as closer. More than Miller IMO because he has NEVER been that before. The talent of the two are not equivalent and not that close IMO. If I am going to bet on someone with a limited track record, give me the one with the superior talent.

Craig Kimbrel is not an elite closer at this point. First of all, he is limited to 1 inning and in April (the beginning of the season) he has already shown issues with holding up when being relied upon with relative frequency (thus taxing the rest of the pen because he can't be counted on to shoulder a regular work load.

 

Teams are going to protect Miller due to injury concern. He’s 25 years old with 8 saves in his career. What he’s done this year has been nothing short than remarkable. Let’s not act like he’s a 25 year old Paplebon, K-Rod or Chapman. 

[potota_bread]

2 hours ago, Bemorewins said:

You are willing to potentially put the fate of our World Series hopes in the hands of Hunter Harvey? … I’m genuinely curious as to why when there are much better delivers to be had (one of which is Miller).

You're the one doing this for Miller. You act as if he's the only key piece missing for this dynasty run. The truth is that Harvey would make more sense, and could still put us over the top (with other additions) and not cost Basallo. Miller is not even proven yet. At least we know what we're getting with Hunter.

Edited May 3 by potota_bread

[RZNJ]

12 minutes ago, Bemorewins said:

This is a different team. Corbin Burnes would have made a difference IMO and we have now acquired him. 

I am not dogmatic in believing that it has to be Miller and nothing/nobody else. I am saying that there is a serious argument to be made that Miller or another elite backend bullpen weapon is the piece to take us over the top when the Fall get's here.

With a team this good who has legit WS aspirations with a strong argument to be made that we have the best team in the AL, I would hate for us to pin our WS hopes on a pitcher like Craig Kimbrel at this point in his career. IMO he is not good/reliable enough.

If we have to get into a game (in October) where it turns into a battle of the bullpens, I would prefer not to have bring a knife to a gun fight.

 

I don’t disagree for the most part.