All in on our future

[Orioles0615]

9 hours ago, Uli2001 said:

The concern is that this offense may be structurally unsound for facing elite pitching in the playoffs. These young guys seem to have been taught a certain way of playing offense, and you don't know if they can still unlearn that or if that's who they are. All batters are to some extent mistake hitters, but these guys seem to be exclusively mistake hitters.

Facing elite pitching or guys with 5 plus era ? lol

[Sports Guy]

17 hours ago, Pickles said:

You know, you're hardly alone in this, but this is such a stupid, lazy take it deserved to be called out.

 

Its the biggest bs narrative amongst O's fans.  Not only is it not factually correct, it ignores all the positive stats saying their approach is very good.

They don't need to change anything outside of walking more.

Otherwise, they just need to change a few hitters with better hitters.  

This whole over the top, factually wrong complaint should be directed at a few players (ie, roster spots) vs an actual organizational approach to offense.

[Uli2001]

13 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

Let's be clear, if an elite pitcher isn't making mistakes it's extremely hard for anyone to do much of anything against them.

But good teams find a way to push across a run or two against good pitching. You are automatically against any opinions and never in agreement. What a strange way to go through life.

[Uli2001]

12 hours ago, Orioles0615 said:

Facing elite pitching or guys with 5 plus era ? lol

Well, in the second half, guys with 5 plus ERA. You got me there.

[wildcard]

11 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

 This whole over the top, factually wrong complaint should be directed at a few players (ie, roster spots) vs an actual organizational approach to offense.

Is that why Elias let the hitting coaches go?

[Sports Guy]

23 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Is that why Elias let the hitting coaches go?

Just because you let go of coaches, doesn’t mean you are going to change hitting philosophies. Maybe they had issues with the players or some of their messaging wasn’t getting through.

There are a myriad of reasons why coaches leave.

Edited 11 hours ago by Sports Guy

[wildcard]

3 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Just because you let go of coaches, doesn’t mean you are going to change hitting philosophies. Maybe they had issues with the players or some of their messaging wasn’t getting through.

There are a myriad of reasons why coaches leave.

To me it sounds like you are struggling to stay away from a logical conclusion.   Elias stated in his postseason interview that he was concerned about the team's inability to score with runners in scoring position.   Then pitching coaches are let go.   I would think the two things are connected.  

[Sports Guy]

34 minutes ago, wildcard said:

To me it sounds like you are struggling to stay away from a logical conclusion.   Elias stated in his postseason interview that he was concerned about the team's inability to score with runners in scoring position.   Then pitching coaches are let go.   I would think the two things are connected.  

Tweaking may happen but they aren’t changing philosophies.  I understand that you struggle to understand simple logic and you want to push one of your bs narratives but the Orioles were one of the best offenses in the game in 2024. You don’t change philosophies when that’s the case. 
 

What you do is tweak things…they need more walks and they need to do a better job scoring runs from third with less than 2 outs.

They aren’t going to go from the philosophy they have to what Detroit was this year. That would be incredibly stupid.

Move on from Santander and Mounty will be good starts.

[Pickles]

1 hour ago, wildcard said:

To me it sounds like you are struggling to stay away from a logical conclusion.   Elias stated in his postseason interview that he was concerned about the team's inability to score with runners in scoring position.   Then pitching coaches are let go.   I would think the two things are connected.  

What did he say?  Give me his exact words.  I bet they don't support what you said the did.

[Pickles]

13 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

Its the biggest bs narrative amongst O's fans.  Not only is it not factually correct, it ignores all the positive stats saying their approach is very good.

They don't need to change anything outside of walking more.

Otherwise, they just need to change a few hitters with better hitters.  

This whole over the top, factually wrong complaint should be directed at a few players (ie, roster spots) vs an actual organizational approach to offense.

Even the walking isn't the issue some seem to think.  While the team finished 8th overall in BB, they were dead last in the 1st half.  Ironically, they walked more as the season progressed and the results weren't as favorable.

The team had 9 guys receive 300 abs this year; the lowest OPS+ among them was 107.   The offense wasn't the problem

Further, the league average OBP was .312.  The only people below that were Mullins, Mountcastle and Santander.  Westburg was .312 on the nose.

To me, the only guy with a "bad" approach is Mountcastle.  He's extremely frustrating.

But there's nothing in the results, or approach, that calls for widespread changes or even the kind of criticism that has been levied.

[Sports Guy]

22 minutes ago, Pickles said:

Even the walking isn't the issue some seem to think.  While the team finished 8th overall in BB, they were dead last in the 1st half.  Ironically, they walked more as the season progressed and the results weren't as favorable.

The team had 9 guys receive 300 abs this year; the lowest OPS+ among them was 107.   The offense wasn't the problem

Further, the league average OBP was .312.  The only people below that were Mullins, Mountcastle and Santander.  Westburg was .312 on the nose.

To me, the only guy with a "bad" approach is Mountcastle.  He's extremely frustrating.

But there's nothing in the results, or approach, that calls for widespread changes or even the kind of criticism that has been levied.

They were 19th in BB%.  It was down by .5% from last year.

Of course, the league average OBP was also down.

[Pickles]

2 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

They were 19th in BB%.  It was down by .5% from last year.

Of course, the league average OBP was also down.

They were better this year at getting on base.  Relatively.

Last year they were 7th in the league in OBP, and the team had a .321 OBP in an environment with an average of .320.

This year they were 4th, and .315 in an environment of .312 average.

[wildcard]

8 hours ago, Pickles said:

What did he say?  Give me his exact words.  I bet they don't support what you said the did.

Actually what Elias said supports my comment very well.

Melewski:  One potential critique for the offense is the Orioles are too reliant on the home runs and slugging.  Moving forward do you think that Is a valid critique?  Does there need to be more variety? Whether its on base or other ways to score?

Elias: I definite experienced the frustration of that.  Who didn't.  I've been around baseball and a lot of the very best information out there in baseball my entire life and career. And getting hits, getting RBI with runners in scoring position.  There is a lot of evidence that can be hard to control on a year over year month to month basis. Its a tricky thing,  Hitting.

That said I am going to behave like it is under our control and we are going to examine everything about our offensive approach, teachings, the mix of personnel, the kind of things that you mentioned.  And put ourselves in position to where we feel like we have addressed any shortcoming there.

I don't necessarily believe its all chance.  I do think there are things our organization, and ultimately our players will be able to do to improve our odds on that front.  

It's not a good experience going through that for months.  Where we are struggling to get runs in from second base.  That was not the case last year.  We were great at it.  With a lot of the same guys. 

I have a lot of confidence that can correct next year.   Its going to involve some work by us.

---------

Then his actions were to let the hitting coaches go.

You can listen his answer here:  Scroll to 27.24

 

 

Edited 2 hours ago by wildcard

[Sports Guy]

55 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Actually what Elias said supports my comment very well.

Melewski:  One potential critique for the offense is the Orioles are too reliant on the home runs and slugging.  Moving forward do you think that Is a valid critique?  Does there need to be more variety? Whether its on base or other ways to score?

Elias: I definite experienced the frustration of that.  Who didn't.  I've been around baseball and a lot of the very best information out there in baseball my entire life and career. And getting hits, getting RBI with runners in scoring position.  There is a lot of evidence that can be hard to control on a year over year month to month basis. Its a tricky thing,  Hitting.

That said I am going to behave like it is under our control and we are going to examine everything about our offensive approach, teachings, the mix of personnel, the kind of things that you mentioned.  And put ourselves in position to where we feel like we have addressed any shortcoming there.

I don't necessarily believe its all chance.  I do think there are things our organization, and ultimately our players will be able to do to improve our odds on that front.  

It's not a good experience going through that for months.  Where we are struggling to get runs in from second base.  That was not the case last year.  We were great at it.  With a lot of the same guys. 

I have a lot of confidence that can correct next year.   Its going to involve some work by us.

---------

Then his actions were to let the hitting coaches go.

You can listen his answer here:  Scroll to 27.24

 

 

Right..things need to be tweaked and some personnel has to change.

There isn’t going to be an overhaul of philosophy.  

Thanks for proving that point.

[waroriole]

22 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

Its the biggest bs narrative amongst O's fans.  Not only is it not factually correct, it ignores all the positive stats saying their approach is very good.

They don't need to change anything outside of walking more.

Otherwise, they just need to change a few hitters with better hitters.  

This whole over the top, factually wrong complaint should be directed at a few players (ie, roster spots) vs an actual organizational approach to offense.

You’re right when looking at the season overall. Really, only Cowser and Kjerstad strike out at a higher than average rate. Whatever they did to screw up Adley’s approach adds to the angst of the organizational approach. Plus, seeing them come up short time and time again over the last 2+ months of the season.