Where is Our Clutch Hitting Late in Games?

[Flosman]

No need to be condescending as Frobby already posted similar stats. I guess DT's comments would also trigger your "idiot" alarm which as I already posted is what I was going by. Anyone can look up stats, but DT was specifically praising Mora for his ability to hit with RISP and being clutch. I was just going by what he said, and would prefer him in a clutch situation right now late in the game over Markakis who is hitting 158.

I don't see where that makes me an idiot. It just says I want to win the game. As far as the first third of the game I would prefer Markakis any day over Melvin.

If you want to win you put the best hitter up there. You not gettting that is what qualifies you for my alarm.

[Old#5fan]

If you want to win you put the best hitter up there. You not gettting that is what qualifies you for my alarm.

I don't think right now in close and late situations Nick Markakis is the best hitter up there. So you are not getting my side of this argument.

[ledzepp8]

No need to be condescending as Frobby already posted similar stats. I guess DT's comments would also trigger your "idiot" alarm which as I already posted is what I was going by. Anyone can look up stats, but DT was specifically praising Mora for his ability to hit with RISP and being clutch. I was just going by what he said, and would prefer him in a clutch situation right now late in the game over Markakis who is hitting 158.

I don't see where that makes me an idiot. It just says I want to win the game. As far as the first third of the game I would prefer Markakis any day over Melvin.

I believe I already posted that Mora has only a 657 OPS in close and late situations this season. Surely you didn't just ignore that?:scratchchinhmm:

Oh and by the way, Mora has a career 716 OPS in those situations. Markakis for his career has an OPS of 918.

How can one person be so wrong, so many times?

[DrungoHazewood]

I don't think right now in close and late situations Nick Markakis is the best hitter up there. So you are not getting my side of this argument.

Everyone is getting it. You trust numbers just as long as they agree with the decision you made before you saw any numbers. That's why you only bring up one month's worth of numbers in this argument, which is obviously about 1/10th what you need to form a reasonable opinion.

[ledzepp8]

I don't disagree that overall Nick Markakis is much more of a hitting threat than Melvin Mora. But so far this season, late in the game he has not shown it at all. I mean 3/20 with all singles is terrible any way you slice it. Felix Pie couldn't do much worse than that!

Melvin Mora also, so far this season, only has 3 singles in close and late situations.

[Flosman]

I don't disagree that overall Nick Markakis is much more of a hitting threat than Melvin Mora. But so far this season, late in the game he has not shown it at all. I mean 3/20 with all singles is terrible any way you slice it. Felix Pie couldn't do much worse than that!

I am not sure but did Nick's double in the 7th last night count in his late and close numbers? If so he now is hitting 1.000/1.000/2.000 in his last one late and close AB that is a 3.000 OPS he is without a doubt clutch and is a lock as an allstar. Your last AB has to be the one you look at. I don't care what he did in is last 20. The combination of what he did last season and in this single AB is all I need to know.:rofl::rolleyestf:

PS at the end of tonights game I will tailor a couple of facts that make it appear that I know what I am talking about.

[ledzepp8]

I don't think right now in close and late situations Nick Markakis is the best hitter up there. So you are not getting my side of this argument.

He's the best damn hitter on the team. He's always going to be the guy you want up there. Well at least 99.9% of fans would.

[Old#5fan]

Everyone is getting it. You trust numbers just as long as they agree with the decision you made before you saw any numbers. That's why you only bring up one month's worth of numbers in this argument, which is obviously about 1/10th what you need to form a reasonable opinion.

Actually the numbers in the case of Markakis, Roberts, and Jones do support what I am seeing this season so far. Jones is clutch, and Markakis and Roberts are anti-clutch late in the game. Jones is in fact dangerous at any time in the game whereas Markakis is lethal only early and mid game.

I don't disagree with any of these stats. I think where everyone is missing my perspective is I am referring to this seasons stats mainly while also giving some consideration to Mora and Huff as veteran hitters who even when in a slump in close and late situations like they also seem to be doing now along with Markakis have more seasoning to draw upon and that makes them (right now) a better bet to come through in close and late hitting at this point of this season.

[Flosman]

He's the best damn hitter on the team. He's always going to be the guy you want up there. Well at least 99.9% of fans would.

Not the smart fans they want the guys that are going to make an out 10-15% more of the time. This is how you win games. A manager who was smart would have pinch hit LH last season for Nick because fangraphs said he was clutch. I mean he hit like 225 in those situations. Nick would never produce like that.:rolleyestf:

[Old#5fan]

Not the smart fans they want the guys that are going to make an out 10-15% more of the time. This is how you win games. A manager who was smart would have pinch hit LH last season for Nick because fangraphs said he was clutch. I mean he hit like 225 in those situations. Nick would never produce like that.:rolleyestf:

I am talking about this season. How many times have I stated that now and you ignore it for some strange reason?

[DrungoHazewood]

Actually the numbers in the case of Markakis, Roberts, and Jones do support what I am seeing this season so far. Jones is clutch, and Markakis and Roberts are anti-clutch late in the game. Jones is in fact dangerous at any time in the game whereas Markakis is lethal only early and mid game.

I don't disagree with any of these stats. I think where everyone is missing my perspective is I am referring to this seasons stats mainly while also giving some consideration to Mora and Huff as veteran hitters who even when in a slump in close and late situations like they also seem to be doing now along with Markakis have more seasoning to draw upon and that makes them (right now) a better bet to come through in close and late hitting at this point of this season.

Oh, we get your perspective. We just don't think it has any basis in fact.

[Old#5fan]

Oh, we get your perspective. We just don't think it has any basis in fact.

I have no problem with that. I just have a problem when people seem to totally mis-construe what I am espousing. It is almost like it is illegal to state Nick Markakis is putting up horrid stats this season so far in Close and Late or Clutch hitting. So much so, that I would much prefer seeing Jones, Mora, or Huff hitting with the game on the line. I have also admitted the opposite is true early to mid game.

So I don't get the problem with this at all. It is just the reality of what is occuring right now! I don't need to be made to feel guilty or stupid for thinking this way. I probably am not even alone in this sentiment, just others are too wary to post it.

It is like there is an unwritten law here that nothing bad or even remotely negative can be written about Nick Markakis, even when everything isn't all good. The same is true with Roberts to a certain extent as well. To me no player should be immune to criticism.

[RShack]

Can traffic cops hand out tickets for "aiding and abetting" reckless drivers?

[ledzepp8]

Can traffic cops hand out tickets for "aiding and abetting" reckless drivers?

I'm just enjoying it too much now. I really just want to see what he'll say next.

[Flosman]

I have no problem with that. I just have a problem when people seem to totally mis-construe what I am espousing. It is almost like it is illegal to state Nick Markakis is putting up horrid stats this season so far in Close and Late or Clutch hitting. So much so, that I would much prefer seeing Jones, Mora, or Huff hitting with the game on the line. I have also admitted the opposite is true early to mid game. So I don't get the problem with this at all. It is just the reality of what is occuring right now!

Seriously the problem is not what you are saying it is. In this very thread you have on multiple occasions slandered the best player on the team I love. Nick is as of today the Best player the O's have and honestly the best player we have had in a long while. You have said that he is dogging it because of his "fat LT deal", his "cute wife", you have said he is a choke artist and I have probably left off a couple of your BS comments. You have found one split that for over a 20 AB period he has bad numbers in and used it to support your crap that I posted above. You, when presented evidence that the 20 ABs where likely a statistical abberration and he is still the best hitter on the club and likely the guy you would want up there if you life depended on it. You keep saying no i would want this guy or that guy and even when proven you are absolutely clueless you act like we do not get it. I will say if DT would rather have Mora up there than Nick in any important situation AM should fire him the second he finds out, even in the middle of the game if necessary, But DT does not think that even though you represented that to be the case.

Nick is the guy you want up there in ANY f'ing situation in any game, period. AJ is making that a close call and might force a change to that answer in a very short time. But the track record is not there yet for AJ but he is making a very strong case. You act has if the 20 ABs should change that. Let me know when he puts up those numbers over 100+abs in that situation.