Heyman: Orioles being aggressive

[waroriole]

He was extremely streaky. At the beginning of the year, he hit everything. He had two additional months of very solid production. As for the other three months...he couldn't hit a beach ball when it was tossed at him. I don't honestly know what that says about his plate discipline, focus, etc. Some of it might be attributable to the "temperature" of his relationship with his manager, maybe it's something else. Regardless, I don't think he proved that he's a disciplined hitter to the point of mentioning "plate discipline" as one of his laudable attributes, that's all.

I would say that a BB rate of 12% is certainly laudable. It's probably the biggest and most important difference between Rasmus and Jones.

[Roll Tide]

How are the even statistically? If you look only at Rasmus' rookie season, you could say that. Even still, he was worth 2.3 WAR, which is Jones' highest output. Last year, Rasmus had an .859 OPS and an 3.6 WAR, and he has very good plate discipline.

They both have a 5 war combined for the last 2 years.

Rasmus.....Avg .276 Runs-85..Hits-128...2b-28...HR-23..RBI-66...slg .452

Jones.......Avg .284 Runs-76...Hits-165...2B-25..HR -19..RBI-69...SLG .442

Rasmus Struck out about 40 more times & walked about 30

[Sports Guy]

Well, I think this is different than the statement I was responding to. Do you think the O's would turn down a trade of Rasmus for Jones?

Yes I do. I think they would say, why trade our guy for a player that isn't really much better. That's how I believe the Orioles would view that trade.

[waroriole]

They both have a 5 war combined for the last 2 years.

Don't make things up. Jones has a 3.9 WAR the last two years. Rasmus' is 5.8.

[waroriole]

Yes I do. I think they would say, why trade our guy for a player that isn't really much better. That's how I believe the Orioles would view that trade.

You might be right, but would you make that trade?

[Roll Tide]

Don't make things up. Jones has a 3.9 WAR the last two years. Rasmus' is 5.8.

Uhhmm I'm Not ! You ARE!

Jones 2009 2.5

Jones 2010 2.8

Total in 2 year 5.3

Rasmus in 2009 2.8

in 2010 2.9

Total in 2 years 5.7

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/j/jonesad01.shtml

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/r/rasmuco01.shtml

[MurphDogg]

Don't make things up. Jones has a 3.9 WAR the last two years. Rasmus' is 5.8.

A little harsh there. You should know that different sites calculate WAR differently. Baseball-reference has Jones at 5.3 and Rasmus at 5.7. Fangraphs agrees with your numbers but B-R is just as reputable.

[waroriole]

Uhhmm I'm Not ! You ARE!

Jones 2009 2.5

Jones 2010 2.8

Total in 2 year 5.3

Rasmus in 2009 2.8

in 2010 2.9

Total in 2 years 5.7

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/j/jonesad01.shtml

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/r/rasmuco01.shtml

A little harsh there. You should know that different sites calculate WAR differently. Baseball-reference has Jones at 5.3 and Rasmus at 5.7. Fangraphs agrees with your numbers but B-R is just as reputable.

My mistake. Still, Rasmus looks like he should continue to progress as a hitter, while Jones looks like he might be about done growing, unless he can learn to take a walk.

[Sports Guy]

You might be right, but would you make that trade?

Yes...But I do not think that is a scenario that is likely to have to happen.

However, if the Cards called us up and said, we will trade you Rasmus for Jones straight up but that is the only way we move Rasmus, I would make the deal because I like Rasmus long term more than I like Jones.

[Roll Tide]

A little harsh there. You should know that different sites calculate WAR differently. Baseball-reference has Jones at 5.3 and Rasmus at 5.7. Fangraphs agrees with your numbers but B-R is just as reputable.

Thanks

Either way based on the stats I looked at their numbers for 2010 are pretty close. The only real difference I can see is Rasmus has more walks & K's.

I wonder what Fangraphs looks at?

[MrOrange82]

My mistake. Still, Rasmus looks like he should continue to progress as a hitter, while Jones looks like he might be about done growing, unless he can learn to take a walk.

How does B-R differ? Does it factor defense into the equation? (I thought that fangraphs did, while B-R didn't)

[Roll Tide]

My mistake. Still, Rasmus looks like he should continue to progress as a hitter, while Jones looks like he might be about done growing, unless he can learn to take a walk.

Maybe but there pretty close in age. Jones swings at a lot of junk & doesn't walk enough.

Rasmus walks more ...but also K's more.

[waroriole]

How does B-R differ? Does it factor defense into the equation? (I thought that fangraphs did, while B-R didn't)

I'm not really sure. I think they both look at defense, but since it is so subjective, they must look at it differently. Also, I think fangraphs gives more (or less, again not sure) weight to defense.

[Sports Guy]

How does B-R differ? Does it factor defense into the equation? (I thought that fangraphs did, while B-R didn't)

They both do...but they use a different defensive stat.

I think people also need to remember that the reason Rasmus is on the block(if he is) is due to his perceived attitude issues with LaRussa..That does drop his value some.

[waroriole]

Maybe but there pretty close in age. Jones swings at a lot of junk & doesn't walk enough.

Rasmus walks more ...but also K's more.

I don't care if he K's more, if he also walks alot more. Give me the walk and K rate of Rasmus any day.