Jump to content

HHP: Do you agree with DD not handing our young pitchers automatic spots in the rotation?

ChaosLex

By ChaosLex
in Orioles Talk

Recommended Posts

ChaosLex Hangout Grand Counsel

ChaosLex

Posted
Posted

Given the inventory we've built this offseason (and the poll I posted, which indicates most of you think we're not done on this front yet), it'd seem some of our young guns won't start the season in Baltimore as they have in years past. Either that or they'll start the season in the bullpen.

Do you support this idea?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
  • Replies 125
  • Created
  • Last Reply
WietersCorner Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

WietersCorner

Posted
Posted
Given the inventory we've built this offseason (and the poll I posted, which indicates most of you think we're not done on this front yet), it'd seem some of our young guns won't start the season in Baltimore as they have in years past. Either that or they'll start the season in the bullpen.

Do you support this idea?

No, I think it is a better idea to just hand rotation spots to underserving and unmotivated young pitchers -sarcasm

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Spy Fox Hangout Veteran Council

Spy Fox

Posted
Posted

As I see it there are seven SPs you could argue for the OD rotation:

Guthrie

Britton

Arrieta

Matusz

Hunter

Wada

Chen

Others like Bergesen, Tillman, and Simon may have a chance of making starts at some point in the season but should either be in the bullpen or the minors on Opening Day unless there is an injury disaster.

Guthrie of course is a lock if not traded. The "extra" SPs we have right now may placate those who are worried about trading Guthrie.

Arrieta and Britton should be given spots. They both showed signs of promise last year and seem to be the two surest bets for future success.

The last two spots should be up for grabs in spring training. I would hope for Matusz and Chen earning those spots. Wada and Hunter in the bullpen. If Matusz looks anything like his '09 or '10 self I am giving him a rotation spot even if his spring training isn't wowing with the stats.

It does look like we have the best group of SP options in recent years but I have learned to be very hesitant in proclaiming that our depth will save the day later in the season.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
24fps Hangout Grand Counsel

24fps

Posted
Posted
It doesn't make much sense to me either, but I don't think some people are happy with this idea. *shrugs*

But...but...we need to "see what we got" with our young players. They should be given at least two full seasons at the ML level regardless of outcome to generate a large enough sample size so we don't risk the horror of possibly misidentifying the true potential of one of them. Right?

No, I'm not serious, but I wish I had a nickel for every time I hear an argument similar to this on the subject of struggling young players.

If the burden is on the young player to demonstrate he deserves a major league job, I think that's generally a healthy thing. There's room to make the occasional exception (Wieters) when common sense tells you it's warranted. It's time for the major league club to get out of the development business except for finishing touches.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

Posted
Posted

I would agree if we had or he was bringing in high ceiling pitching that will matter long term...But that's not really happening with the potential exception of Chen.

Now, if a guy like BMat goes to ST and still looks awful, then of course he should be sent down.

But he should go into ST with a spot in the rotation but its tenuous.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
El Gordo Hangout Grand Counsel

El Gordo

Posted
Posted

I think Guthrie(if he isn't traded)

Britton

Chen

Wada

should be in the rotation. If Arrieta is healthy he should be too. But if any of Matusz, Hunter, Eveland, show well in ST, then they could move Wada to the pen. If Guthrie is traded or Arrieta isn't fully recovered that leaves an extra spot to compete for. I think Matusz has a lot to prove.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
mikegallo Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

mikegallo

Posted
Posted
I would agree if we had or he was bringing in high ceiling pitching that will matter long term...But that's not really happening with the potential exception of Chen.

Now, if a guy like BMat goes to ST and still looks awful, then of course he should be sent down.

But he should go into ST with a spot in the rotation but its tenuous.

Yeah how about everyone goes in with a spot in the rotation and in the spring they will win there job or lose their job....May the best five start the season...And the next two will be starting no later than June.

This team hasn't had the 8 Major League starting quality pitchers we need to have a legit Major League staff in 14 years...We might actually be getting close to one next year...Starting to get pumped about this season.

Come On DD give us 2/3 more good impactful moves this offseason and I think your ready for ST.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
scOtt Hangout Grand Counsel

scOtt

Posted
Posted
As I see it there are seven SPs you could argue for the OD rotation:

Guthrie

Britton

Arrieta

Matusz

Hunter

Wada

Chen

Others like Bergesen, Tillman, and Simon may have a chance of making starts at some point in the season but should either be in the bullpen or the minors on Opening Day unless there is an injury disaster.

Guthrie of course is a lock if not traded. The "extra" SPs we have right now may placate those who are worried about trading Guthrie.

Arrieta and Britton should be given spots. They both showed signs of promise last year and seem to be the two surest bets for future success.

The last two spots should be up for grabs in spring training. I would hope for Matusz and Chen earning those spots. Wada and Hunter in the bullpen. If Matusz looks anything like his '09 or '10 self I am giving him a rotation spot even if his spring training isn't wowing with the stats.

It does look like we have the best group of SP options in recent years but I have learned to be very hesitant in proclaiming that our depth will save the day later in the season.

Agree with the bolded! Britton did everything he needed to to get a second year. Pitched well to start, struggled when the league adjusted, and he adjusted back later.

Jake too. I have high hopes for him this year. He improved a lot of his problem areas (improved but not completely fixed...) and this will be the first year in a long time he has pitched without the bone chips.

But I do agree with Lex's thread. It's always a good idea to create REAL competition for roster spots. Even for Jake and Zach. All of them.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Bradysburns All-Star

Bradysburns

Posted
Posted
Given the inventory we've built this offseason (and the poll I posted, which indicates most of you think we're not done on this front yet), it'd seem some of our young guns won't start the season in Baltimore as they have in years past. Either that or they'll start the season in the bullpen.

Do you support this idea?

YES. No one - in a healthy organization - should be "handed" anything on an ML roster. We've been knighting these kids prematurely for more than 10 years now. DD seems to have a much more realistic understanding of the difference between "potential" and winning at the ML level.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
scOtt Hangout Grand Counsel

scOtt

Posted
Posted
YES. No one - in a healthy organization - should be "handed" anything on an ML roster. We've been knighting these kids prematurely for more than 10 years now. DD seems to have a much more realistic understanding of the difference between "potential" and winning at the ML level.

Remember he almost sounded appalled that some of the cavalry hadn't done a full season at AA. ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Brendan25 All-Star

Brendan25

Posted
Posted
I would agree if we had or he was bringing in high ceiling pitching that will matter long term...But that's not really happening with the potential exception of Chen.

Now, if a guy like BMat goes to ST and still looks awful, then of course he should be sent down.

But he should go into ST with a spot in the rotation but its tenuous.

So you don't like the idea of bringing in competition for guys like Matusz to make them have to work that much harder in the offseason knowing that a spot isn't guaranteed?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
ChaosLex Hangout Grand Counsel

ChaosLex

Posted
  • Author
Posted
I would agree if we had or he was bringing in high ceiling pitching that will matter long term...But that's not really happening with the potential exception of Chen.

Now, if a guy like BMat goes to ST and still looks awful, then of course he should be sent down.

But he should go into ST with a spot in the rotation but its tenuous.

I don't know, we kept on waiting for DCab to show his stuff year after year and we all know how that turned out.

I mean, I don't wanna deny the kids their chance to play in the major and show their stuff... I just think they need to show something first.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Go to topic listing

  • Posts

    • Moose Milligan
      Austin Hays 2024

      By Moose Milligan · Posted

      Uh, no.  No he isn't.  There's at least a case to be made that McKenna could be better.  Hays has probably been the worst player on the team since July of last year.   Not having an aneurysm, but way to address anything I wrote in my previous post.  Like, you just ignored it all and come back with "bro, Hays is way better than McKenna" which makes me wonder if you read anything at all. If you think Hays is way better than McKenna, prove it.
    • Gurgi
      Ben Clemens chat on the O’s

      By Gurgi · Posted

      Can you offer a link?  I tried to google it but am not getting this story.
    • Pickles
      Austin Hays 2024

      By Pickles · Posted

      Bro, I asked a question. Hays is way better than McKenna.  Don't have an aneurysm.    
    • Moose Milligan
      Austin Hays 2024

      By Moose Milligan · Posted

      Well, I never said anything about preferring McKenna in my previous post.  I just said I didn't miss watching Austin Hays play and then you just had to ask if that meant I preferred watching McKenna.  What made you assume that I'd think such a thing, I'm not sure. You should know that Hays going down and McKenna coming up doesn't mean that McKenna is all of a sudden taking Hays' at bats full time.  No, it means more playing time in LF for Cowser and McKenna is the last outfielder playing as a defensive replacement and maybe getting a start once a week.  That's it.  That's as far as I thought it through. But since you just had to ask and make me think about it, I think I'd actually watch McKenna full time over Hays right now and I don't have to think twice about it. @Sports Guybeat me to it, but Hays has been so spectacularly bad that McKenna has outperformed him since the All-Star Break last year to present day. Similar stats to what SG showed, I ran them from the ASB last year...of course, McKenna is a part time player so we can't say for certain if he'd be able to replace Hays full time, but he'd have to be really pathetic to be as bad as Hays has been: Hays:  .209/.275/.335 for a 69 wRC+ .   -1.58 in WPA.   McKenna:  .275/.339/.431 for a 116 wRC+. -0.22 in WPA.   Unfortunately fangraphs or bbref doesn't spit out WAR for the amount of time you want to look at, but I can't imagine Hays is in the positive since the ASB last year.  He's certainly in the negative for 2024.  McKenna probably isn't. I get it, McKenna is kind of a doofus and the board's whipping boy for no good reason.  I mean, the dropped ball in Fenway, last year, whatever.  He's a 4th or 5th outfielder, I'm not trying to pretend that he's anything more than that.  But even if McKenna took every day at bats from Hays, I don't know if that'd necessarily be a bad thing.   So actually, thanks for your question.  Yeah, I think I'd prefer to watch McKenna over Hays right now.  At least, I'd like to see if McKenna could be as miserable as Hays has been since mid-July last year...that'd actually be pretty hard to do. I'll leave you with this:  even Mateo has actually been better in every slash category than Hays in the same amount of time since the 2023 ASB:  .231/.283/.388 for a 87 wRC+  
    • Gurgi
      Dean Kramer for Closer

      By Gurgi · Posted

      Wells could be the answer if he is healthy.  He did a solid job out of the pen his first year here.  Had nerves of steel.  He throws strikes.  Sometimes too many and gives up some bombs but a healthy Wells might be better than a wild and perhaps injured himself Kimbrel.
    • EddeeEddee
      Craig Kimbrel 2024

      By EddeeEddee · Posted

      I doubt there is anything much wrong with Kimbrel's head.  He just doesn't have the stuff he used to have and his arsenal doesn't work as well at a lower velocity.  How do you turn him into a 6th or 7th inning pitcher?  He just got older that's all.  Happens to all athletes. That said I'm not an expert on pitching, so anyone out there who knows a lot about it please give us your take.
    • RZNJ
      McKenna

      By RZNJ · Posted

      Didn’t know where else to post this. 1. McKenna goes in as a PR has 2B stolen easily and over slides the bag and is tagged out. 2. On the line drive double over his head, which may have been uncatchable, it looked like he took a bad route. 3.  On the sac fly it seemed like he was waiting to see if the runner from 3rd was going.   He was in fairly shallow RF, close to the line, took 3 extra steps before actually throwing the ball.   

  • Popular Contributors

  • Popular Now

×
×
  • Create New...