Reds pushing for Bedard hard?

[srh523]

Will "the thrill" anyone?

Here are Will "the Thrills" 1st six season I would love to get that:

Year Ag Tm  Lg  G   AB    R    H   2B 3B  HR  RBI  SB CS  BB  SO   BA   OBP   SLG *OPS+  TB   SH  SF IBB HBP GDP +--------------+---+----+----+----+---+--+---+----+---+--+---+---+-----+-----+-----+----+----+---+---+---+---+---+1986 22 SFG NL 111  408   66  117  27  2  11   41   4  7  34  76  .287  .343  .444  121  181   9   4  10   3   3 RoY-51987 23 SFG NL 150  529   89  163  29  5  35   91   5 17  49  98  .308  .371  .580  152  307   3   2  11   5   2 MVP-51988 24 SFG NL 162  575  102  162  31  6  29  109   9  1 100 129  .282  .386  .508  160  292   0  10  27   4   9 MVP-5,AS1989 25 SFG NL 159  588  104  196  38  9  23  111   8  3  74 103  .333  .407  .546  175  321   0   8  14   5   6 SS,MVP-2,AS1990 26 SFG NL 154  600   91  177  25  5  19   95   8  2  62  97  .295  .357  .448  125  269   0  13   9   3   7 AS1991 27 SFG NL 148  565   84  170  32  7  29  116   4  2  51  91  .301  .359  .536  154  303   0   4  12   2   5

[WebLink21]

I will admit that I am more in favor of the M's deal, but if we were to make this trade I would have no complaints at all. I will admit that I don't know as much as some about prospects, but just going off of opinions and articles/rankings I have read I would put all three of the main guys in this trade at the top of our prospect list. I would love to hear everyone else's opinion, but I would think our top 5 after this deal would be:

1) Weiters (cleanup hitter...can not wait for him to get to the Bigs)

2) Cueto

3) Votto

4) Stubbs

5) Rowell

That is not a bad list at all.

[Lucky Jim]

I will admit that I am more in favor of the M's deal, but if we were to make this trade I would have no complaints at all. I will admit that I don't know as much as some about prospects, but just going off of opinions and articles/rankings I have read I would put all three of the main guys in this trade at the top of our prospect list. I would love to hear everyone else's opinion, but I would think our top 5 after this deal would be:

1) Weiters (cleanup hitter...can not wait for him to get to the Bigs)

2) Cueto

3) Votto

4) Stubbs

5) Rowell

That is not a bad list at all.

Rowell would be well-ahead of Stubbs.

[Sports Guy]

Rowell would be well-ahead of Stubbs.

As would/should Liz and Reimold and maybe guys like Synder and Arrieta as well.

[WebLink21]

Rowell would be well-ahead of Stubbs.

I am glad to hear that. I really want Rowell to work out for us. I just know Stubbs is pretty high up on their list of prospects and I thought that Rowell has slipped a little this year in people's eyes.

[minnesotaoriole]

Rowell is still really young... it's just a learning curve he is going through! He still has a great ceiling!!!

[Lucky Jim]

I am glad to hear that. I really want Rowell to work out for us. I just know Stubbs is pretty high up on their list of prospects and I thought that Rowell has slipped a little this year in people's eyes.

The problem with Stubbs is that he's a college bat but - as Sickels notes - remarkably unrefined. Lots of Ks (which is not a death knell in and of itself).

On the other hand, he's got projectable power and good patience at the plate.

I'm not too worried about the SB% - the combination of the foot injury with the fact that it's his first year as a professional leads me to believe he'll begin using his speed better.

[Frobby]

Rowell is still really young... it's just a learning curve he is going through! He still has a great ceiling!!!

You know how we are all drooling over Adam Jones? He was drafted as a 17-year old out of high school. In his first full year, at low A, he put up .267/.314/.404.

Think about that the next time someone complains about the .273/.335/.426 Billy Rowell put up at Delmarva last year. Same level, same age. But Rowell missed part of the year with an oblique injury, whereas Jones was healthy all year.

[Cyclone792]

If a deal does go down with the Reds and O's for Bedard, this is the type of structure I'd expect to see. Essentially two of our Big Five - in this case Cueto and Votto - plus a package of middle to lower tier prospects.

Drew Stubbs is pretty well documented so there's not much need for me to run him down for you guys. Me personally, I'm not high on Stubbs much at all. I thought it was an awful draft pick the minute it occurred, and nothing Stubbs has done since being drafted has changed my mind. He is an excellent defensive center fielder, but I wonder if he'll ever be able to hit enough to be a starter. I do think he can reach the big leagues and contribute as a plus 4th outfield type thanks to his defense, but it gets dicey beyond that.

Paul Janish is a very good fielding shortstop, but doesn't offer much with the bat. I think there's an outside chance he could maybe hit .250 with 60 walks for a circa .325 on-base percentage and mix in nice defense, but that may be the ceiling you're looking at. Janish has very little power; 20-25 doubles over a full season and one or two homers is probably as much as you'll get from him if he ever picked up any consistent big league playing time. Interestingly, as a Reds fan I hate the fact that we have Juan Castro, and I've joked that I'd rather have Janish on the big league roster than Castro (I know, that's still pretty much zero praise for Janish).

And finally Milton Loo ... and I must say it is very strange that I've seen Milton Loo tied to two different Bedard trade rumors in the same week. Loo retired last May because he wanted to go back home to Hawaii, and he's reportedly been known to up and disappear even prior to the Reds picking him up. As a Reds fan, that was quite disappointing because Loo's bat is very interesting. The Reds allowed Loo to keep a portion of his signing bonus in exchange for keeping his rights for a few years, and I guess there's always the chance of Loo returning. However, if he has returned, or if he plans on returning, I've not yet heard anything about it.

[hoosiers]

As would/should Liz and Reimold and maybe guys like Synder and Arrieta as well.

I believe Stubbs was rated higher in his league (10th) than any Oriole not named Spoone or Erbe.

To sit at 30,000 feet and claim his prospect status is due to his draft position or that his Ks will ultimately doom his prospect status is a generic argument - though one that may eventually prove true.

I'd prefer not to dismiss him in such a generic manner and look closer at the prospect. Regarding the casual dismissal of Stubbs as behind some of the prospects noted above, we'll have to re-visit this proclamation after the season.

[HoodGuy007]

I will admit that I am more in favor of the M's deal, but if we were to make this trade I would have no complaints at all. I will admit that I don't know as much as some about prospects, but just going off of opinions and articles/rankings I have read I would put all three of the main guys in this trade at the top of our prospect list. I would love to hear everyone else's opinion, but I would think our top 5 after this deal would be:

1) Weiters (cleanup hitter...can not wait for him to get to the Bigs)

2) Cueto

3) Votto

4) Stubbs

5) Rowell

That is not a bad list at all.

I honestly don't think Stubbs would even be in the top ten...

1) Weiters

2) Cueto

3) Votto

4) Rowell

5) Patton

6) Spoone

7) Reimold

8) Liz

9) Olson

10) Arietta/Snyder/(David)Hernandez/Erbe

[HoodGuy007]

I believe Stubbs was rated higher in his league (10th) than any Oriole not named Spoone or Erbe.

To sit at 30,000 feet and claim his prospect status is due to his draft position or that his Ks will ultimately doom his prospect status is a generic argument - though one that may eventually prove true.

I'd prefer not to dismiss him in such a generic manner and look closer at the prospect. Regarding the casual dismissal of Stubbs as behind some of the prospects noted above, we'll have to re-visit this proclamation after the season.

I'd dare say that as a 22 year old, having a .785 OPS in low-A ball is pretty damning in and of itself, especially when another first round talent, our own Billy Rowell put up a .761 four years younger than Stubbs.

I dunno, it's just me, but I don't see it in the statistics, and I watch a lot of minor league baseball and tend to follow it fairly well. His bat already seems unable to get around fast enough... reminds me of Bryan Bass. Just my thoughts.

[ACE]

Here are Will "the Thrills" 1st six season I would love to get that:

Year Ag Tm  Lg  G   AB    R    H   2B 3B  HR  RBI  SB CS  BB  SO   BA   OBP   SLG *OPS+  TB   SH  SF IBB HBP GDP +--------------+---+----+----+----+---+--+---+----+---+--+---+---+-----+-----+-----+----+----+---+---+---+---+---+1986 22 SFG NL 111  408   66  117  27  2  11   41   4  7  34  76  .287  .343  .444  121  181   9   4  10   3   3 RoY-51987 23 SFG NL 150  529   89  163  29  5  35   91   5 17  49  98  .308  .371  .580  152  307   3   2  11   5   2 MVP-51988 24 SFG NL 162  575  102  162  31  6  29  109   9  1 100 129  .282  .386  .508  160  292   0  10  27   4   9 MVP-5,AS1989 25 SFG NL 159  588  104  196  38  9  23  111   8  3  74 103  .333  .407  .546  175  321   0   8  14   5   6 SS,MVP-2,AS1990 26 SFG NL 154  600   91  177  25  5  19   95   8  2  62  97  .295  .357  .448  125  269   0  13   9   3   7 AS1991 27 SFG NL 148  565   84  170  32  7  29  116   4  2  51  91  .301  .359  .536  154  303   0   4  12   2   5

not take this off on a tangent, but 1987...22 stolen base attempts, 17 time caught stealing?

How'd you do that? Heck, I'm not even mad; that's amazing.

[SteveA]

Wow, Peace and Belkast are internationally known!

Only if you consider Kentucky another country!

[Apologies if this joke has already been made. Just got home from work and haven't read the whole 15 page thread yet].

[SteveA]

Just out of curiosity, say this does happen, and we get Votto, what do we do with Rowell and Snyder, both who are looked at as, 1B/DH players, since Rowell has so far failed the test of moving him to 3B??

Ummm....are you actualy concerned that we might have too much position player depth at a position in our farm system? You've gotta be kidding. That would be a nice problem to have, and it's way, way down on my list of things to worry about. It's below death by meteorite and just slightly ahead of a shooting war with Canada.

Not all prospects work out.

If they all do become stars, we can trade one to fill another hole.