Josh Hamilton market update - 3 years $60-75 million

[ChaosLex]

This unique viewpoint definitely deserved its own thread.

[NewMarketSean]

Does MSK still get angry when Wiley Coyotye runs off the cliff? Sure seems like it.

[Brendan25]

Wow,three major moves. It's pretty common to lock up your own. Even the Rays, Pirates, Rockies, and Royals do it. The motivation to do so, is usually fuel by a desire to save money in the long run. The three you named just happened to be the "face" of the franchise when they were given their extensions. Got to sell some tickets atleast.

Where would you like the money to go if it's not on Hamilton? I still get the feeling that you want to spend just to spend and that just isn't smart.

[Moose Milligan]

This is why I loathe the discussions around here in the offseason. It is so damned redundant.

There have been 23 threads with Hamilton in the title in the last two months. The same points have been made over and over for the last two months. And it has been 100% clear for most of that time that the Orioles were not really interested at all in pursuing him. So why does it take 23 threads to address it? And by the way, that's just the threads with Hamilton in the title. I count 250 threads in the last two months where Hamilton is mentioned, and I'm sure in many of them he was a major topic of conversation.

Meanwhile, there was a poll thread on October 15: "do you want to pursue Josh Hamilton"? Exactly 2/3 of the voters said no. There was another thread yesterday, "do you wish the Orioles had offered Hamilton 5/$125 mm"? 66 percent said no. In other words, nobody has changed their original position in the last two months, despite the ridiculous amount of time spent discussing something that CLEARLY wasn't going to happen.

What a waste of time.

Preach.

No stopping MSK, though.

[Brendan25]

1) Hamilton was way too much

2) Reynolds not coming back, I believe, was more with Buck and DD not being in his corner then it was money. They would have brought him back for cheap, but I'm not sure either like Reynolds as a player.

[LookinUp]

Beltre never comes here.

I'll always disagree with this. He never comes here under the conditions that were present at the time (e.g., down economy, AM discussing small contracts). We could have justified paying him $40-50 million based primarily on defense. He'd have signed for that and been worth vastly more than his contract, IMO.

Cespedes was a gamble.

Less of one than you're portraying. Once again, there were scouting reports on his defense, arm and power. The A's offer basically paid for a conservative estimate of his value. (<2 WAR/year, IIRC). The gamble wasn't a huge one and the payoff had very high potential.

Sano is a gamble.

In the neighborhood of $3 million.

You can only argue against these gambles if you're arguing against all gambles. They're exactly the types of moves the O's should have been making. On Sano and Cespedes, it's clear that other small market teams agreed (A's, Twins).

[Moose Milligan]

1) Hamilton was way too much

2) Reynolds not coming back, I believe, was more with Buck and DD not being in his corner then it was money. They would have brought him back for cheap, but I'm not sure either like Reynolds as a player.

I agree with this, but at the same time it's hard for me to believe. I thought Buck liked him...Reynolds would do anything he was asked to do for the team. Played an admirable first base without ever having playing there before but did what he was asked to do and didn't gripe about it. Seemed like Buck would like a guy like that.

[Brendan25]

I agree with this, but at the same time it's hard for me to believe. I thought Buck liked him...Reynolds would do anything he was asked to do for the team. Played an admirable first base without ever having playing there before but did what he was asked to do and didn't gripe about it. Seemed like Buck would like a guy like that.

I think it had more to do with the fact that Buck wanted Davis at first, and couldn't because of Reynolds. Davis is Bucks guy. Buck knew him from Texas, and I guarantee you that when we traded Koji to Texas, Buck had some talk about players he wanted. I think that Buck has, and still does want Davis at first, and Reynolds just was not a fit with this team if he could not play 3B.

Buck was not going to let that be known during the season.

[DrinkinWithFermi]

This is why I loathe the discussions around here in the offseason. It is so damned redundant.

There have been 23 threads with Hamilton in the title in the last two months. The same points have been made over and over for the last two months. And it has been 100% clear for most of that time that the Orioles were not really interested at all in pursuing him. So why does it take 23 threads to address it? And by the way, that's just the threads with Hamilton in the title. I count 250 threads in the last two months where Hamilton is mentioned, and I'm sure in many of them he was a major topic of conversation. ?

Meanwhile, there was a poll thread on October 15: "do you want to pursue Josh Hamilton"? Exactly 2/3 of the voters said no. There was another thread yesterday, "do you wish the Orioles had offered Hamilton 5/$125 mm"? 66 percent said no. In other words, nobody has changed their original position in the last two months, despite the ridiculous amount of time spent discussing something that CLEARLY wasn't going to happen.

What a waste of time.

I was all for the Orioles signing Hamilton 2 months ago, and I thought we might make some effort to do so if he could be had on a 3 or 4 year deal.

But then I took a closer look at his career, specifically the amount of time he's missed due to injury during his prime years, and I realized what a colossal mistake he could turn out to be for us just as our window was finally opening after so many years of futility.

I was wrong. I changed my mind. And I'm man enough to admit it.

[MemorialStadKid]

Preach.

No stopping MSK, though.

I didn't post any threads.

If the off season threads get redundant it's only because people would like the see the team improve instead of continue on this course of cheap foolishness. How are Hamilton threads any more redundant than the endless speculative threads about impossible trades or cyclical arguments about WAR, UZR or OPS?

Sometimes, we wish against common sense and FO history and hope that they will surprise the fan base with a legitimate FA signing. I'm sure the fans of the Blue Jays, Angels and Red Sox are feeling better about their 2013 chances whereas some of us will argue and fight with folks that want improvement. That makes so much sense.

MSK

[ChaosLex]

I didn't post any threads.

You posted the So... Hamilton gone, no Reynolds, and 1B? thread, which was merged into this thread.

[Nigel Tufnel]

I didn't post any threads.

Of course you did. Your gem of a thread was eventually merged into the Hamilton one, but post #503 above is the thread you started, and what drew Frobby's ire.

[McNulty]

I didn't post any threads.

If the off season threads get redundant it's only because people would like the see the team improve instead of continue on this course of cheap foolishness. How are Hamilton threads any more redundant than the endless speculative threads about impossible trades or cyclical arguments about WAR, UZR or OPS?

Sometimes, we wish against common sense and FO history and hope that they will surprise the fan base with a legitimate FA signing. I'm sure the fans of the Blue Jays, Angels and Red Sox are feeling better about their 2013 chances whereas some of us will argue and fight with folks that want improvement. That makes so much sense.

MSK

You are the worst. That next to last sentence is the biggest troll bait ever. NO ONE is against improvement!!!! NO ONE.

The big disconnect here is you think signing Hamilton at 25+ million a year is a good idea, even with endless funds. The Orioles aren't going to spend enough money to fit a guy like that into the budget, nor is he likely to be worth it. Stop creating a false argument.

[CA-ORIOLE]

How are Hamilton threads any more redundant than the endless speculative threads about impossible trades or cyclical arguments about WAR, UZR or OPS?

One argument incorporates a vast array of data with critical thinking and analysis, the other is a singular point of mind numbing dribble.

[MemorialStadKid]

You posted the So... Hamilton gone, no Reynolds, and 1B? thread, which was merged into this thread.

Sorry, my mistake, I can't edit my posts. I DIDN'T POST ANY POLLS!

MSK