The rise and fall of Rafael Palmeiro

[MDtransplant757]

Would you trust the BBWAA to vote on Rose? These are the same people who think Jim Rice >>>> Alan Trammell, I'm not giving them a thumbs up/down on moral rights and wrongs.

I wouldn't. How Mike Mussina isn't in is beyond me.

[Can_of_corn]

I wouldn't. How Mike Mussina isn't in is beyond me.

It's pretty simple.

[MDtransplant757]

It's pretty simple.

The people voting suck. His numbers almost mirror Jim Palmer's, and he was a first rounder.

[NashLumber]

I have seen much player testimony and other experts that would strongly disagree with your statement.

That's good to know. What was said? Just the gist. I'm at a piano recital

[Can_of_corn]

That's good to know. What was said? Just the gist. I'm at a piano recital

That the overall impact of Greenies was greater than that of steroids.

That gisty enough for you?

[NashLumber]

That the overall impact of Greenies was greater than that of steroids.

That gisty enough for you?

It helps. Thanks, man.

[Can_of_corn]

The people voting suck. His numbers almost mirror Jim Palmer's, and he was a first rounder.

Well it isn't that simple.

I predicted Mussina would have to wait a few years to get in.

If you look at the the voting patterns and voter tendencies it was a likely outcome.

Now that they culled some of the inactive voters it will change things.

[crawjo]

I think that as well to an extent. I think guys like Pete Rose should be in as well with that logic. The Steroid Era ruined baseball for a lot of people, and so did Pete by betting on baseball and the team he managed.

How much evidence is there that the steroid era "ruined baseball for a lot of people"?

[MDtransplant757]

How much evidence is there that the steroid era "ruined baseball for a lot of people"?

Just the sheer amount of people I've met either over the Internet or in person. Many of them are old timers who grew up when the Brooklyn Dodgers played Joe DiMaggio and the Yankees.

[MDtransplant757]

Well it isn't that simple.

I predicted Mussina would have to wait a few years to get in.

If you look at the the voting patterns and voter tendencies it was a likely outcome.

Now that they culled some of the inactive voters it will change things.

It's chaos theory in a way.

[DrungoHazewood]

How much evidence is there that the steroid era "ruined baseball for a lot of people"?

A lot could be anything. I'm guessing steroids ruined baseball for some number of people who cumulatively could be described as a lot. But I also think the end of the deadball era ruined baseball for a lot of people. As did the end of the amateur era. And integration. And the DH. And each strike. And when Ruth passed the President in salary. Can't make everyone happy.

[Can_of_corn]

Just the sheer amount of people I've met either over the Internet or in person. Many of them are old timers who grew up when the Brooklyn Dodgers played Joe DiMaggio and the Yankees.

You know there is an admitted steroid precursor user in the hall right?

You know Ruth got sick once from experimenting with animal testosterone right?

You know that steroid use was "widespread" in '60's the majors right?

Considering that steroids were being used in the '60's what do you think the odds are of everyone being elected in the past 40 years being steroid free?

[MDtransplant757]

You know there is an admitted steroid precursor user in the hall right?

You know Ruth got sick once from experimenting with animal testosterone right?

You know that steroid use was "widespread" in '60's the majors right?

Considering that steroids were being used in the '60's what do you think the odds are of everyone being elected in the past 40 years being steroid free?

You actually told me about Ruth, and while greenies were the precursor to steroids as we know them, I don't see the big deal, and to be honest, i don't know the chemical makeup, side effects or anything about greenies. No one got massive like Mark McGwire back in those days either

[Can_of_corn]

You actually told me about Ruth, and while greenies were the precursor to steroids as we know them, I don't see the big deal, and to be honest, i don't know the chemical makeup, side effects or anything about greenies. No one got massive like Mark McGwire back in those days either

For the life of me I don't understand this line of thinking (and I have seen it a lot).

It is as if folks didn't mind steroids as long as they didn't help too much. As if the guys shooting needles in their backsides in the bathroom stall in the '70's were only cheating a little.

Those guys would have used the stuff McGwire was using if it was available.

[El Gordo]

But they were never chemically as enhanced. I am not concerned about guilt. At all. Just enhancement. Beyond human means.

What do you mean by chemically enhanced? Amphetamines enhance focus and concentration as does Adderall. It kept them alert and able to take the field during the dog days or after a late night binge. It had an impact on their performance. And it's physically harmful.