Jump to content

Updates on Hunter Harvey


Norfolk orioles

Recommended Posts

26 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

 

Question away.  But I'd hope we can do that in a rational manner.  You act like 10 additional pitches in an inning is the difference between a solid manager and someone who only has the job because he was flat dumb enough to hitch his career to a floundering franchise.

This isn't a black-and-white on-off switch.  Managing isn't a series of logic gates, all OR'd together, and if one gets tripped it's firing time.  It's more like a collection of heat maps, all quasi-subjectively defined.  Last night Hyde ventured a tiny bit into a red area of your personal heat map for pitcher use and WHAM he's an idiot who couldn't be gone fast enough.

Hyde seems like a pretty reasonable, decent guy who was selected by a smart GM to help the team get through rebuilding.  He might be a caretaker manager, he might not be around for the next good O's team, but we don't know that for sure.  And I'm quite confident that the O's had way more applicants for his job than they could interview.  It's one of 30 major league managerial positions making $hundreds of thousands of dollars a year, with no expectations and pressure to win.  Almost every minor league manager and half of every major league coaching staff would have taken the position.

You’re right. Hyde’s a caretaker manager. He needs to take better care of our players/prospects. Like pulling guys from the game when they take a ball off the head, or take a P out without venturing into a “risky” area. 

We’re not even in the “coddle” our prospect state yet because the prospects are still in the minors. So while we’re losing 110 games, don’t make risky decisions. Error on the side of caution and live to fight another day. 

Overall, big picture, what did Harvey learn?  Brocail makes a mound visit and then Harvey throws non competitive pitches to Soto and Rendon.  8/9 next pitches were balls. What did Brocail say when he came out?  Did he really tell him to pitch around those two guys?  

Man, go back read or watch the summary of that inning. All I’m saying is there is questionable logic there with Brocail and Hyde. It ventures into reckless when you factor in that Harvey is on the mound. 

I’ve apologized for calling him an idiot. I realize not everyone is following the games live anymore. Go back and research if you haven’t, then let’s discuss the logic. 

Edited by sportsfan8703
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, sportsfan8703 said:

Sorry for calling him an idiot.

What about Hyde’s decision to leave DJ Stewart in the game as well?

Just to point out the irony... Calling Hyde an idiot is “too tough”, but Hyde risking our players physical health is just “testing them”.   

Hyde also got into a very public dust up with Chris Davis. I guess that’s ok because it’s the whipping boy Chris Davis. 

Let’s just say Hyde isn’t making the best of decisions over the last couple of weeks. 

No, Chris Davis's actions made the dust up "very public".

Hyde is forced by ownership and upper management to have an overpaid, worthless player on his roster every night. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, sportsfan8703 said:

Sorry for calling him an idiot.

What about Hyde’s decision to leave DJ Stewart in the game as well?

Just to point out the irony... Calling Hyde an idiot is “too tough”, but Hyde risking our players physical health is just “testing them”.   

Hyde also got into a very public dust up with Chris Davis. I guess that’s ok because it’s the whipping boy Chris Davis. 

Let’s just say Hyde isn’t making the best of decisions over the last couple of weeks. 

You've gotta be kidding about the Davis thing.  That was 100% on Davis acting like a child, and Hyde has done EVERYTHING to excuse Davis all year long.  If anything, he should be applauded for his handling of Davis.  

And I actually agreed with your point about keeping in Harvey too long, but then linking that somehow to the Davis situation makes no sense.  And calling him an idiot because you disagreed with his using Harvey too long was way over the top, imo.  As another poster pointed out, it was good to see what Harvey was made of.  I still wouldn't have kept him in, but you can see a reason why Hyde would have thought differently.     

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

You’re right. Hyde’s a caretaker manager. He needs to take better care of our players/prospects. Like pulling guys from the game when they take a ball off the head, or take a P out without venturing into a “risky” area. 

We’re not even in the “coddle” our prospect state yet because the prospects are still in the minors. So while we’re losing 110 games, don’t make risky decisions. Error on the side of caution and live to fight another day. 

Overall, big picture, what did Harvey learn?  Brocail makes a mound visit and then Harvey throws non competitive pitches to Soto and Rendon.  8/9 next pitches were balls. What did Brocail say when he came out?  Did he really tell him to pitch around those two guys?  

Man, go back read or watch the summary of that inning. All I’m saying is there is questionable logic there with Brocail and Hyde. It ventures into reckless when you factor in that Harvey is on the mound. 

He is a converted starter coming off two days off. The 33 pitch inning isn't that risky. If he was pitching around the two batters, that is 8 low stress pitches.

You are just seeking out evidence to support your already established beliefs.

  • Upvote 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

You’re right. Hyde’s a caretaker manager. He needs to take better care of our players/prospects. Like pulling guys from the game when they take a ball off the head, or take a P out without venturing into a “risky” area. 

We’re not even in the “coddle” our prospect state yet because the prospects are still in the minors. So while we’re losing 110 games, don’t make risky decisions. Error on the side of caution and live to fight another day. 

Overall, big picture, what did Harvey learn?  Brocail makes a mound visit and then Harvey throws non competitive pitches to Soto and Rendon.  8/9 next pitches were balls. What did Brocail say when he came out?  Did he really tell him to pitch around those two guys?  

Man, go back read or watch the summary of that inning. All I’m saying is there is questionable logic there with Brocail and Hyde. It ventures into reckless when you factor in that Harvey is on the mound. 

I’ve apologized for calling him an idiot. I realize not everyone is following the games live anymore. Go back and research if you haven’t, then let’s discuss the logic. 

We'll just have to agree to disagree.  I think on a recklessness scale of 0-10 this is a 2 or 3, you think it's a 9.  Okay.

  • Upvote 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

We did win the game, right?  I mean I sort of enjoyed watching the kid battle a bit and if Fry comes in and Cabrera hits a grand slam, let’s say....whooo boy, the Hyde bashers would be having a field day.  There are risks in whatever you do.  The young man got hurt the last time when he was sitting in the dugout. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

We'll just have to agree to disagree.  I think on a recklessness scale of 0-10 this is a 2 or 3, you think it's a 9.  Okay.

While 33 pitches is a lot, I don’t think it’s over the line.    Harvey threw 33 pitches in an inning at least once in the minors this year (July 5), and probably more than once.    For example, he threw 78 pitches in 2.1 innings in a start back in May.    I can’t find a breakdown of pitches for each inning, but he almost would have had to throw 30+ in an inning in that game.    He had a number of other games with very high pitches per inning where he may have thrown 30+ in one of the innings.    

Now, I did not watch this game, so I don’t have an opinion as to whether Harvey should have been pulled sooner.     But I think at worst I’d disagree with Hyde’s decision but not consider it irresponsible.    

PS - looking at pitch f/x, I really don’t see much of a velocity drop as the inning progressed.

speed.php-pitchSel=640451&game=gid_2019_

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

24 minutes ago, Frobby said:

While 33 pitches is a lot, I don’t think it’s over the line.    Harvey threw 33 pitches in an inning at least once in the minors this year (July 5), and probably more than once.    For example, he threw 78 pitches in 2.1 innings in a start back in May.    I can’t find a breakdown of pitches for each inning, but he almost would have had to throw 30+ in an inning in that game.    He had a number of other games with very high pitches per inning where he may have thrown 30+ in one of the innings.    

Now, I did not watch this game, so I don’t have an opinion as to whether Harvey should have been pulled sooner.     But I think at worst I’d disagree with Hyde’s decision but not consider it irresponsible.    

PS - looking at pitch f/x, I really don’t see much of a velocity drop as the inning progressed.

speed.php-pitchSel=640451&game=gid_2019_

Adam Eaton battled Harvey hard and was the second out as a K.  Here is the back and forth about that confrontation:

And then Hyder's assessment of the Rendon and Soto confrontations:

 

  • Upvote 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would assume Harvey has a pitch count approved by Orioles doctors. He has had plenty of rest in between appearances. Let's remember that two of Harvey's major injuries were of the freakish variety unrelated to his pitching motion. If we have to treat him as a delicate flower, that is always going to be in the back of his mind and he is not going to be a good MLB pitcher. If it's OK with the doctors, I am giving Hyde the benefit of the doubt and support letting the kid pitch.

  • Upvote 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, interloper said:

When do you think he gets shut down? 

I’m hoping he won’t get shut down at all, but he might.   He’s at 79.2 innings right now between the majors and the minors.    This after throwing 63.2 combined in 2015-18.     My guess is that as long as he’s not looking like he’s losing anything, they’ll let him pitch another 8-10 innings, nicely spaced out.   

  • Upvote 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

32 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

I would assume Harvey has a pitch count approved by Orioles doctors. He has had plenty of rest in between appearances. Let's remember that two of Harvey's major injuries were of the freakish variety unrelated to his pitching motion. If we have to treat him as a delicate flower, that is always going to be in the back of his mind and he is not going to be a good MLB pitcher. If it's OK with the doctors, I am giving Hyde the benefit of the doubt and support letting the kid pitch.

Hyde and Harvey on his pitch count and experience per Melewski:

“It’s great to see Hunter Harvey come up here and show elite back-end stuff,” said Hyde. “I didn’t want him to throw too many pitches. That was the problem. But I do want Hunter to experience Major League Baseball at the end of a game. Which is having to go through Rendon and Soto as the tying run and not giving in and able to compose himself. The last pitch he threw, the 33rd, was 99 (mph). So to be able to reach back and get Cabrera there is huge. It’s just going to give him confidence.”

Hyde on Harvey’s walks of Rendon and Soto in the eighth: “He wasn’t going to let Soto beat him. Two guys that are superstar players in the league that are on fire right now, and he wasn’t just giving in and throwing middle-middle fastball. He was actually trying to pitch to the corners. If he doesn’t get him, he moves on to the next guy. And that’s what he did.

Added Harvey: “It’s kind of crazy. You don’t always want to put yourself in that situation. I trusted Sevy (catcher Pedro Severino). He knows these guys pretty good. He played with them. I went with him, and I trusted him, and it worked out. It’s been fun, a lot of fun. It’s a whole different animal from starting. To be able to do it here has been pretty crazy.”

Harvey on whether he had any issues throwing so many pitches: “No, I don’t think so. I started at the beginning of the year, so I was throwing 95 pitches in four, five, six innings, so I feel pretty good, and nothing feels out of the ordinary.”

https://www.masnsports.com/steve-melewski/2019/08/aaron-brooks-with-six-scoreless-as-os-blank-washington-2-0.html

  • Upvote 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, bobmc said:

Adam Eaton battled Harvey hard and was the second out as a K.  Here is the back and forth about that confrontation:

And then Hyder's assessment of the Rendon and Soto confrontations:

 

Pitching around Soto and Rendon meant putting the tying run and winning run on base. 

See what I mean about Hyde’s logic. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.




  • Posts

    • Yeah the amenities are pretty outdated at the yard and they seem to do nothing year over year to improve them. The touchscreens have been banged on to death to the point they barely function, so you can't accurately fill out your order at the kiosks, and they don't have a way for the people behind the counter to ring you up at many of the food places. The sound is low to non-existent in certain sections of the club level, like around 218. Seems like there should be speakers that reach there but they might have been damaged by rain, etc. and they are too lazy to fix them. If you go to a game that's even slightly busy, you will wait forever to get into the bathroom, and the sink will be an absolute mess with no soap or paper towels. It's even worse on the club level where they have one sink that's right by the door. Nearby businesses don't care, either. The Hilton parking garage reeks of decay, pot and human waste. They don't turn on the air circulation fans, even if cars are waiting for an hour and a half to exit from P3, filling up the air with carbon monoxide. They only let you enter the stadium with one 20 oz bottle of water. It's so expensive to buy a drink or water in the stadium, but with all the salty food, 20 oz of water isn't enough, especially on a hot day. Vegetarian food options are poor to none, other than things like chips, fries, hot pretzels and the occasional pizza. Vida Taco is better, but at an inconvenient location for many seats. The doors on the club level are not accessible. They're anti-accessible. Big, heavy doors you have to go through to get to/from the escalators, and big, heavy doors to get to your seats, none of them automatic (or even with the option to be automatic with a button press). Makes it hard to carry food out to your seats even if not handicapped. The furniture in the lounges on the club level seem designed to allow as few people as possible to sit down. Not great when we have so many rain delays during the season. Should put more, smaller chairs in and allow more of the club level ticket holders to have a seat while waiting for thunderstorms to pass. They keep a lot of the entrance/exit gates closed except for playoff/sellout games, which means people have to slowly "mooooo" all the way down Eutaw St to get to parking. They are too cheap to staff all the gates, so they make people exit by the warehouse, even though it would be a lot more convenient for many fans to open all the gates. Taking Light Rail would be super convenient, except that if there's at least 20k fans in attendance, it's common to have to wait 90-120 minutes to be able to board a non-full train heading toward Glen Burnie. A few trains might come by, but they are already full, or fill up fast when folks walk up to the Convention Center stop to pre-empt the folks trying to board at Camden Station. None of the garages in the area are set up to require pre-payment on entry (reservation, or give them your card / digital payment at the entrance till). If they were, emptying out the garage would be very quick, as they wouldn't need to ticket anyone on the way out: if you can't get in without paying, you can always just leave without having to stop and scan your phone or put a ticket in the machine. They shut down the Sports Legends Museum at Camden Station in 2015 because the Maryland Stadium Authority was too greedy. That place was a fun distraction if you were in the area when a game wasn't about to start, like if you show up super early on Opening Day or a playoff day. Superbook's restaurant on Eutaw is a huge downgrade from Dempsey's in terms of menu and service quality. Dempsey's used to be well-staffed, you could reserve a table online, and they had all kinds of great selection for every diet. Superbook seems like just another bar serving the same swill that the rest of the park serves, with extremely minimal and low-quality food. For that matter, most of the food at the stadium is very low quality these days. A lot of things we used to love are made to a lower standard now if they are served at all. These are gripes about the stadium and the area that haven't changed my entire adult life. Going to an O's game requires one to tolerate many small inconveniences and several major inconveniences, any number of which could easily be fixed by the relevant authorities if they gave a damn about the people who pay to come see the team play. You would think a mid-market team would be able to afford to invest in the fan experience. You would think the city and partnering organizations like garages, the Stadium Authority and MTA would at least try to do their part to make the experience enjoyable and free of kinks. You would think they would put some thought into handling the "growing pains" of the fanbase due to recent renewed interest after the dark years. Instead, all we get is the same indifference and the same annoyances year in and year out. The whole area is overdue for a revamp. Not sure if $600 mil will get it done, but at least it's a start. Hopefully they can start to patch up some of the many holes in the fan experience. If you're not going to invest in Burnes, at least make it so paying customers have an easier, more enjoyable time getting to/from the stadium and having some food while we're there.
    • Elias has only been in rebuild mode with the O's so there's not much to speculate on there.  Houston, where he spent his formative years, doesn't seem to like to be on the hook for more than a couple of big long-term contracts at any given time.  I can see that as being Elias' choice as well, albeit with a lower overall cost - Houston runs a big payroll.  But it's all guesswork.  I really don't know. If Elias takes the 2025 payroll to $150 million it will creep up to $200 million or so by 2028 just from keeping the core together.  That's where I start to wonder about sustainability due to market size, economic forces, etc., etc., etc... If it were up to me, I would add a couple of free agents this offseason even if the contracts were longer than ideal and be conservative about extensions elsewhere until the prospects establish themselves a little better.  I think there's a competitive opportunity that the team is already into that's worth exploiting. I think ownership is very happy to have Elias on board and they're not inclined to force him to do anything.  I also think Rubenstein's demonstrated business prowess is great enough to assume that he has had plenty enough time to come to a mutual understanding with Elias as to goals.
    • We need a RH O’hearn…in addition to Westburg. At least 3 batters that will push up the pitch count and cause damage in the top 5 of the lineup.
    • Boy,  that Jackson Merrill is a good young player that is playing his best ball down the season stretch and in the playoffs.   He's only 21.  I guess some young guys are able to play up to the pressure.   Who could have guessed that?
    • I’m aware.   You are arguing something im Not.
    • What agreement? The agreement you are talking about happened as a result of the move.  The MASN agreement would not have existed if Angelos had gone to court to block the move.
    • I’m saying the Os had an agreement with MLB and that should have held up.  Been pretty clear about that. 
  • Popular Contributors

×
×
  • Create New...