Log jam in the outfield - Kim on the hot seat

[Moondoggie]

I wouldn't make any assumptions about Kim just yet. The Orioles have faced a lot of lefties as well as the knuckleballer on two occasions. He's a proven bat with a high OBP against right-handers, even if his defense leaves a lot to be desired (although I prefer him to Trumbo or Mancini out there). The truth is that the Orioles have a lot of very imperfect players in the outfield mix and this whole thing could go several ways.

I think the original plan was to platoon Kim/Rickard in left and Smith/Gentry in right. It still could shake out that way if Mancini's bat cools off. They could send him to Norfolk to learn to play the outfield.

If Mancini's bat keeps him on the team, they could go Kim/Gentry in left and Smith/Trumbo in right (recent lineups suggest that Buck agrees with me that Trumbo is a better option in the outfield than Mancini if for no other reason than experience). Mancini could be the primary DH against southpaws with a few other starts thrown in for good measure (especially if they see Wright again). Rickard could be optioned.

Bourn could be an option that would improve the outfield defense. This is the one scenario which might spell trouble for Kim since both bat left-handed. Bourn would have to replace either Kim or Smith in an outfield platoon and it wouldn't be Smith (as long as he's healthy).

But who knows how things will work out? The Orioles have too many 1B/DH types (including Kim, who best position is said to be first base) and not enough quality outfielders. So whatever they do, they're making a sacrifice in another area.

[SteveA]

One advantage for Kim is that he's a lefty hitter.  Replacing Wieters with Castillo makes us a pretty heavily RH hitting team.

We have faced an unusually high % of lefties this year so far, that will go down.  Kim will get more playing time and if he gets on base at a similar clip to last year his value in the OF rotation will become more apparent.

[Can_of_corn]

4 minutes ago, SteveA said:

One advantage for Kim is that he's a lefty hitter.  Replacing Wieters with Castillo makes us a pretty heavily RH hitting team.

We have faced an unusually high % of lefties this year so far, that will go down.  Kim will get more playing time and if he gets on base at a similar clip to last year his value in the OF rotation will become more apparent.

So apparent that Buck is hardly playing him again.

[SteveA]

5 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

So apparent that Buck is hardly playing him again.

You may be right.  But I'm withholding judgement just a bit.   Grant me one assumption: that Buck doesn't like Kim vs knuckleballers for some reason.  Today is our 17th game and 8th started by a lefty.  We've seen Wright twice also.

In our 7 games started by non-knuckleballer righties, Kim has started 6 of them...86%.

 

So for now I'll give Buck the benefit if the doubt.  If Kim doesn't start at least two of the 3 games vs Tampa's righties, I will come around to your point of view.

[ACDC27]

What a good problem to have we actually have to many good players.

[El Gordo]

Logically the best move is Joey to Norfolk untill needed. Platoon Mancini until someone struggles, Could be Kim Trumbo Gentry, Bourn's defense is overrated and he's not really much of a bat. Not part of the equation IMO. Santander? Cross that bridge when we come to it.

[thezeroes]

Bourne and Gentry have both seen time on the DL over their Careers.  Seth Smith is favoring a Hamstring since ST.  I think these roster decisions will take care of themselves and it is way to early to be looking at trading away an On Base asset.

[El Gordo]

1 hour ago, RZNJ said:

Ok.  What kind of playing time do you want Mancini to get?   Strictly platoon against RHP?    Everyday?

Platoon plus spelling Trumbo/Davis, until someone struggles

[sportsfan8703]

5 hours ago, RZNJ said:

Assuming Smith avoids the DL there are 4 crucial deadlines coming up.

1. Rickard is ready to return

2. Bourn's opt out date

3. Alvarez's opt out date

4. Santander's rehab is over

One of Rickard or Gentry are a given.

My guess. Rickard to Norfolk. Gentry and Mancini stay. Pedro is traded or opts out. 

Last spot comes down to Kim, Bourn's, or Santander.  Odds against Santander because he is the least likely to help this year. I'd would have to feel he's something special to carry him.  Possible.

If Mancini is deemed worthy of regular time then Bourn's is a better compliment than Kim, as defensive replacement/pinch runner.

Good post and research. I don't think any of these dates are critical.

Rickard could go to AAA.

 Pedro is a non factor, no defense and he's not hitting in AAA.

 Bourn types are always available.

While we like Santander, we really cannot afford to keep him without some serious shenanigans.  

[Tx Oriole]

9 hours ago, 1968_bills_fan said:

Last year I could not imagine this problem.  This year we have a surplus of outfielders and will soon need to option, trade or waiver some decent player or players.

Last year our overall outfield defense was poor.  Jones is loved but is an average defender in CF.  He can not do it all and has rightly complained about having to cover more ground than he should have to.  This has been addressed by bringing in more speed with some decent veteran players and they WILL be part of the roster this year.  There is also the need for a speedy lead-off batter who is a threat to steal bases and serve as a pinch runner.  This gives the O's a chance to play small ball and win some games they they couldn't touch last year.    Here is what I see our situation

Starters:   TWO:   Jones in center and Trumbo/Mancini in right.

 On the roster as lead-off:   Gentry, Smith and Rickard.    Besides lead-off, these people can back up center field, add at least ONE more speedy outfielder to help Jones, be used as a pinch-runner or base stealer in close games.  I see a two headed, mashing monster in Trumbo/Mancini at DH and right field most of the time.

So that gives us SIX 25-man roster spots for 4 positions (3 outfield and the DH).

=============================

The we then have the following viable outfielders in the organization also in the organization:

Kim -----  good batting average and OBP but not a lot of power.  A smart, good-eye batter, who works pitch counts.  Sure hands in the outfield BUT not a lot of speed on the basepaths or the outfield.

Santander ---   a rule 5 pick.  (the organization loves these to make up for a poor minor league system and that has a lot of weight in the Warehouse).  Also not a bad player and has some emergency utility.

Bourn--    a speedy veteran, who played well here and is a back up for Gentry/Smith/Rickard if they faulter or have an early season injury, although he may leave the organization if he doesn't move up.

Dickerson-   A speedy veteran, who has been injuried a lot in his career, but showed quality in spring training.  He likely will be a quality available call-up with much the same role and profile as Bourn.

 

Kim looks like the odd man out.  He is a likeable, good on-base guy, but his lack of speed and (debatable perceived problem with left handed pitching) hurts his usefulness with the O's. 

If I were running the show I would be looking at the upcoming crunch at the 25 man roster spots, when we need 5 starting pitchers.  I would look for a trade for Kim- maybe a west coast team with better time connections to Korea (for his fan base and filling stadium seats). He is a free agent next year.  Maybe a trade for a promising minor league pitcher is a target?   He IS a legit major leaguer and a quite decent player, but we might give up something valuable AND get something valuable in return.

 

 

 

I like him and pull for him. But you may be right. A trade may be the answer. 

[eddie83]

18 hours ago, SteveA said:

You may be right.  But I'm withholding judgement just a bit.   Grant me one assumption: that Buck doesn't like Kim vs knuckleballers for some reason.  Today is our 17th game and 8th started by a lefty.  We've seen Wright twice also.

In our 7 games started by non-knuckleballer righties, Kim has started 6 of them...86%.

 

So for now I'll give Buck the benefit if the doubt.  If Kim doesn't start at least two of the 3 games vs Tampa's righties, I will come around to your point of view.

Once again I just don't get this whole idea that Kim is in trouble. One time he didn't start vs a regular RHP and that was in Cincy without a DH. Once Kim didn't play vs LHP in the spring we all knew he wasn't going to once the season started. 

I find it hard to fathom the team willl move on from Kim and leave themselves exposed. If Mancini doesn't hit RHP then what? At that point they would have to be willing to put Trumbo back in RF and DH Alvarez, that would be the only thing they could do. 

[eddie83]

13 hours ago, Tx Oriole said:

I like him and pull for him. But you may be right. A trade may be the answer. 

We should trade Kim so a past his prime Bourne, journeyman Dickerson who was out of pro ball last year and Rule 5 player all get a chance before him?  Makes absolutely zero sense. 

The whole reason Mancini made the team out of the gate is because of the schedule. Anyone who looked at it could tell we were going go face a ton of LHP early. 

Already Rickard is on the DL and Smith has hamstring issues. So let's trade Kim and limit ourselves even more? At some point we will be facing plenty of RHP. 

[Roll Tide]

Kim isn't going anywhere until after the season. Unless the Orioles can replace his bat he should probably be retained. At this point Bourn is filler. Gentry and Smith are just journeymen. 

 

[OFFNY]

On 4/23/2017 at 8:28 AM, 1968_bills_fan said:

 

Chris Dickerson - A speedy veteran who has been injured a lot in his career, but showed quality in spring training. He likely will be a quality available call-up, with much the same role and profile as Bourn.

 

o

 

(MAY 3rd)

 

AAA-Norfolk outfielder Chris Dickerson was placed on disabled list with left oblique injury.

https://twitter.com/masnRoch/status/859775653784285185

 

o

[25 Nuggets]

Ryan Flaherty playing LF tells me it's time to trade Kim for assets, if they don't want to use him.