Orioles out On Cobb per Roch

[jamalshw]

12 minutes ago, Number5 said:

I don't believe that 3/$42 is possible.  I'm pretty sure that is what the Cubs reportedly offered and Cobb turned it down.  If he has a change of heart and decides to accept that offer, I'm pretty sure it would be with the Cubs, not the Orioles.  The Orioles would have to be considerably above that, IMO.

I would tend to agree. I think it would have to be a four-year deal to get Cobb to come to Baltimore and given how badly it worked out the one time this administration went off book and gave more than three years to a pitcher, I think it'll be a few years before we go beyond three on any arm.

I think it would have to be 4/$60 at a minimum to get it done. I think it ultimately would have to go closer to $70M (or even a bit higher). I'd do it, but no way Angelos approves that.

[tntoriole]

1 hour ago, jamalshw said:

I would tend to agree. I think it would have to be a four-year deal to get Cobb to come to Baltimore and given how badly it worked out the one time this administration went off book and gave more than three years to a pitcher, I think it'll be a few years before we go beyond three on any arm.

I think it would have to be 4/$60 at a minimum to get it done. I think it ultimately would have to go closer to $70M (or even a bit higher). I'd do it, but no way Angelos approves that.

I would offer him 3/48 right now and see if he didn't bite.   6 million is 6 million.   

[Il BuonO]

57 minutes ago, tntoriole said:

I would offer him 3/48 right now and see if he didn't bite.   6 million is 6 million.   

4/$60m

[Can_of_corn]

5 minutes ago, Il BuonO said:

4/$60m

So Jones money? 

[Tx Oriole]

10 hours ago, Grt 2BA FL Gator said:

Exactly. I just read that article and thought, "if we spent 4 years and 50 mil on Ubaldo, how can we not be involved if it looks like 3 years at 42 mil could be possible?". Even if we have to go above that because we aren't a sexy team, there's no reason not to be involved.

I wish we would back the price off on Manny, trade him for at least one quality starter, old or young (instead of the ridiculous ask of 2) and a prospect, and then sign one of the free agent pitchers with the near 16 mil we'd save this year and the money coming off the books next year.

If we stand pat this off season and sign a Vargas or Cashner type and don't make a trade or grab a starter more quality than that, I may take a year off from my fandom. 

My hope is that Duquette is playing this market out, because obviously it's a slow moving market and maybe a steal could be had. But man, we need to make a move for one more quality starter, or in my mind we need to start blowing it up. I can't take the in between anymore. 

 

 

Being a fan is hard putting up with this garbage. 

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, Tx Oriole said:

Being a fan is hard putting up with this garbage. 

This doesn't bother me at all.

Watching the accumulation of bad decisions over the past few years that led to this is what bothered me.

I'm completely resigned to this outcome.

[oriolediehard]

Are any of you surprised?  Throw a bag of marbles to sign him, of course he won't take.  

[Can_of_corn]

5 minutes ago, oriolediehard said:

Are any of you surprised?  Throw a bag of marbles to sign him, of course he won't take.  

You do accept that the O's will have to pay a premium to get a pitcher like Cobb correct?

How much more would the O's have to offer Cobb to get him to pitch here?

You can't pay significantly more than the market value for free agents if you are the Orioles.

They tried it with Davis and Trumbo, it doesn't work.

No starting pitcher with interest form a fair number of teams will end up in Baltimore.  It is not an attractive destination for a number of reasons.

[oriolediehard]

On 1/17/2018 at 9:47 PM, Can_of_corn said:

You do accept that the O's will have to pay a premium to get a pitcher like Cobb correct?

How much more would the O's have to offer Cobb to get him to pitch here?

You can't pay significantly more than the market value for free agents if you are the Orioles.

They tried it with Davis and Trumbo, it doesn't work.

No starting pitcher with interest form a fair number of teams will end up in Baltimore.  It is not an attractive destination for a number of reasons.

So what do the O's do?  How do we win games?  Just lay down and lose because pitchers don't want to come here.  What is your solution to being competative?  Why don't we move the fences back to make it more pitching friendly?  Do we count on Cortes,Castro, Lee.Hess.Wright to compete for 3,4 and 5 starters and hope for a diamond in the rough?

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, oriolediehard said:

So what do the O's do?  How do we win games?  Just lay down and lose because pitchers don't want to come here.  What is your solution to being competative?  Why don't we move the fences back to make it more pitching friendly?  Do we count on Cortes,Castro, Lee.Hess.Wright to compete for 3,4 and 5 starters and hope for a diamond in the rough?

You don't trade away young controlled pitchers.  You don't ignore the international market.  You don't sell draft picks.

 

If you know you can't attract free agent starters the you do everything you can to avoid putting yourself in the position of needing them.

 

As for what I would do today?  Tear it down.

[oriolediehard]

On 1/18/2018 at 10:08 PM, Can_of_corn said:

You don't trade away young controlled pitchers.  You don't ignore the international market.  You don't sell draft picks.

 

If you know you can't attract free agent starters the you do everything you can to avoid putting yourself in the position of needing them.

 

As for what I would do today?  Tear it down.

The problem is if we tear it down the O's don't know how to rebuild.  They don't want to spend to get the knowledgeable scouts and people who know how to rebuild.  For 14 years of losing we drafted very few prospects with our picks.

[El Gordo]

On 1/18/2018 at 10:08 PM, Can_of_corn said:

You don't trade away young controlled pitchers.  You don't ignore the international market.  You don't sell draft picks.

 

If you know you can't attract free agent starters the you do everything you can to avoid putting yourself in the position of needing them.

 

As for what I would do today?  Tear it down.

If PA was your owner you wouldn't be able to do that. And if he said win now but no international signings, No big FA SP signings draconian physicals, etc. what would you do then? Assuming you couldn't afford to resign 

[Frobby]

9 hours ago, oriolediehard said:

The problem is if we tear it down the O's don't know how to rebuild.  They don't want to spend to get the knowledgeable scouts and people who know how to rebuild.  For 14 years of losing we drafted very few prospects with our picks.

There’s been a lot of changes in the scouting staff since 2011.    It seems to me Gary Rajsich and crew have done a pretty good job.

[MikeAD]

10 hours ago, oriolediehard said:

The problem is if we tear it down the O's don't know how to rebuild.  They don't want to spend to get the knowledgeable scouts and people who know how to rebuild.  For 14 years of losing we drafted very few prospects with our picks.

Then you bring in competent talent evaluators and scouts. Tear it down doesn't have to be just the on the field personnel.  I feel we can contend soon with a retool but we need to trade Manny, Brach, find a time machine for Britton and pay someone to take Trumbo.  Do that and you can spend 2 seasons developing the young talent we do have and continuing to move every piece we have that wont be a part of that future team for more young talent.  You're right the Orioles don't know how to rebuild but if they don't learn its going to be a long several years/decade.     

[gtman55]

On 1/18/2018 at 10:02 PM, oriolediehard said:

So what do the O's do?  How do we win games?  Just lay down and lose because pitchers don't want to come here.

Honestly if we offer the same amount of money to a pitcher as other teams, do you really think the pitcher turns us down because the Yard is hitter friendly? Don't you think the real reason we don't sign top flight pitchers is Angelos?