Something has to be done with Mark Trumbo

[Il BuonO]

Just now, Can_of_corn said:

Nice to see Buck would trot out an injured Trumbo if the games counted.

Veteranosity rears its ugly head again.

[Il BuonO]

6 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

It really is funny how much settling the feeling you get when you don't see Davis and Trumbo in a lineup. It's like my blood pressure goes down. lol

Guess we can put this down under the shortest book ever written, "How to wisely spend $35 million a year on a successful 1B/DH combo" by the Orioles.

Notice I didn't say Duquette. Davis was a Buck move from what I heard. Not sure about Trumbo.

When I see them back to back in the lineup my BP spikes.

[webbrick2010]

9 minutes ago, Il BuonO said:

When I see them back to back in the lineup my BP spikes.

The team simply can not compete with both Trumbo & Davis as regulars in the lineup.

Is the team trying to compete?

I think they are just trying to keep the attendance and MASN viewership from dropping precipitously.

[Frobby]

51 minutes ago, webbrick2010 said:

The team simply can not compete with both Trumbo & Davis as regulars in the lineup.

Is the team trying to compete?

I think they are just trying to keep the attendance and MASN viewership from dropping precipitously.

Funny, they competed in 2016 with both Davis and Trumbo in the lineup.   I guess in your glass half empty world, those two are certain to be as bad in 2018 as they were last year.    I recognize that risk certainly exists, but I don’t take it as a foregone conclusion.    I just hope the O’s show some flexibility if your pessimistic take turns out to be correct, and make some playing time adjustments if warranted.  

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Funny, they competed in 2016 with both Davis and Trumbo in the lineup.   I guess in your glass half empty world, those two are certain to be as bad in 2018 as they were last year.    I recognize that risk certainly exists, but I don’t take it as a foregone conclusion.    I just hope the O’s show some flexibility if your pessimistic take turns out to be correct, and make some playing time adjustments if warranted.  

They are probably going to be closer to their 2017 production than their 2016 production.

[Enjoy Terror]

3 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Funny, they competed in 2016 with both Davis and Trumbo in the lineup.  

They competed in 2012 with Wilson Betemit in the lineup, but we aren't about to get Wilson back here, are we?

I don't see what your point is to talk about two seasons ago.

[Frobby]

11 minutes ago, Enjoy Terror said:

They competed in 2012 with Wilson Betemit in the lineup, but we aren't about to get Wilson back here, are we?

I don't see what your point is to talk about two seasons ago.

It’s very simple.   Having these two guys in the lineup doesn’t mean we aren’t trying to and won’t compete.   And it’s not a foregone conclusion that they’ll both be a drag on the team this year as they were last year.    They might be, but there’s also a decent chance that won’t be the case.

[Enjoy Terror]

9 minutes ago, Frobby said:

It’s very simple.   Having these two guys in the lineup doesn’t mean we aren’t trying to and won’t compete.   And it’s not a foregone conclusion that they’ll both be a drag on the team this year as they were last year.    They might be, but there’s also a decent chance that won’t be the case.

Based on what non-faith based reasoning do you think that there is a "decent chance" they won't drag this team down?

[Tx Oriole]

2 hours ago, interloper said:

Right now, I mostly dislike that he's the one thing keeping the team from having a really cool lineup. I mean the pieces are all there for these mega-platoons to deal maximum damage. Valencia! Alvarez! Maybe Walker! Trumbo is clogging the roster and you know Buck is sitting there knowing he has better options against RHP and can't do anything. It's annoying. 

Of course I loved his 2016 and I didn't hate the signing at the time.

I don't like that he basically killed the pies (though I realize that's somewhat unconfirmed) and I don't like his attitude in interviews. I'm sure he's a fine guy. I'm mainly annoyed that we already have the pieces to have a better lineup in camp and can't do anything about it.

As for the pies they were okay for a while. You could hurt someone's eye doing that. So whom ever killed the pies was the right thing to do. IMO. I too wish he weren't on the team but he is and there is not anything we can do about it. We can complain is about all. I'm too old  to do much of that now days. 

[Tx Oriole]

2 hours ago, interloper said:

Lol. Sighhhhhhhhh

I find that sad in a way.

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

1 hour ago, Enjoy Terror said:

They competed in 2012 with Wilson Betemit in the lineup, but we aren't about to get Wilson back here, are we?

I don't see what your point is to talk about two seasons ago.

The Orioles might be able to compete with Trumbo and Davis performing below expectations.  But this isn't the 2012 AL East.  Red Sox and Yankees should both be strong this year.  The Blue Jays and Rays don't look to be very good, but neither do the Orioles unless the starting rotation improves.  

[esmd]

Smh at this thread.  They're barely through the first half of ST.  I mean, if it was mid-late May, or shoot, even the end of April, and they are both trending towards repeating 2017 production, okay, I could see this thread.  But the season is still 3 weeks from starting....sheesh guys.  You've got to at least give them a fair chance to rebound and get some value out of the investment in them.

[MikeAD]

1 hour ago, Frobby said:

Funny, they competed in 2016 with both Davis and Trumbo in the lineup.   I guess in your glass half empty world, those two are certain to be as bad in 2018 as they were last year.    I recognize that risk certainly exists, but I don’t take it as a foregone conclusion.    I just hope the O’s show some flexibility if your pessimistic take turns out to be correct, and make some playing time adjustments if warranted.  

 

1 hour ago, Frobby said:

It’s very simple.   Having these two guys in the lineup doesn’t mean we aren’t trying to and won’t compete.   And it’s not a foregone conclusion that they’ll both be a drag on the team this year as they were last year.    They might be, but there’s also a decent chance that won’t be the case.

Why not just get any random 9 then??  Especially foolish to be wasting so much on two players when any combination might just win!  

 

 

In all seriousness though it makes little sense to have both in the line up IF THEY BOTH PLAY like last year.  You still have to give them a chance.  For the record I still support the Davis contract.  I dont blame DD for it either. I assume he has lobbied for every player and Davis is the one Angelos wanted to keep.  I understand why it looked so enticing to Angelos to, coming off the season(s) we had and after losing Cruz and seeing Cruz continue his success in Seattle.  Even at his lowest Davis is still providing very good defense.  There just isn't a defense for Trumbo.  The contract made no sense then and makes no sense now.  Theres no argument I can make now or could find then that made me or could make me like it.  If Trumbo stinks Trumbo should sit the bench.  Its ok to pay a player a lot to sit the bench.  The Yankees will be doing that plenty this year.  If the Orioles are better with Trumbo off the field than on, the smart thing to do is to sit him.  He doesn't make MORE money if he plays.  

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, Enjoy Terror said:

Based on what non-faith based reasoning do you think that there is a "decent chance" they won't drag this team down?

Well, for example, PECOTA projects Davis at .806 OPS and Trumbo at .742;  ZiPS projects them at .777 and 771; Steamer at .808 and .779; Marcel at .805 and 761.   None of those numbers are spectacular, but I wouldn’t put them in the “dragging the team down” category either.    In short, I don’t look exclusively at 2017 in assessing the odds of what 2018 might look like.    I recognize there’s a chance they’ll both suck again, but there’s a decent chance they won’t.    

[DrungoHazewood]

1 hour ago, Frobby said:

It’s very simple.   Having these two guys in the lineup doesn’t mean we aren’t trying to and won’t compete.   And it’s not a foregone conclusion that they’ll both be a drag on the team this year as they were last year.    They might be, but there’s also a decent chance that won’t be the case.

The Marcels projection for Trumbo is a .760 something OPS.  He'll presumably have no defensive or baserunning value to speak of.  That'll work out to half a win or maybe a win above replacement on the outside.  Davis' projection is an .805 OPS.  When he had an .827 in 2012 he was a 1.6 win player, but that was a lower run context and he DH'd a fair amount.  So let's go with 1.5 wins for him.  So I'd say the 75% confidence range for those two is 1-3 wins total.  For reference, in 2016 they combined for 4.6.

You can compete with 1B/DH combining for 2.0 wins over replacement.  But not because of them, it would be in spite of that.