The Orioles biggest problem is....Baltimore

[Legend_Of_Joey]

1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

I'll let someone else handle that question.

I will say that if you google Baltimore riots you get results from 2017, 1968, 1861 and 1812 to choose from.

2015, not 2017.

Trust me on that one. 

[Diehard_O's_Fan]

Watching a white sox game can't be any better or worse than watching a Orioles game. I hear that the White Sox stadium is in a very dangerous part of town.

[Frobby]

11 minutes ago, esmd said:

Nah, I don't buy that at all.  I've been going to OPACY since it opened, and I've never felt unsafe.  Now, admittedly I wasn't there during the riots in 2015, but that was one or two days in 26 years.  Blaming fan apathy and attendance on the city is a cop out.

I think the riots clearly had an effect.   Otherwise, it’s really hard to understand why attendance was down in 2016, a year when we won 89 games and made the playoffs in an exciting race that went down to the final day.   There may have been other factors (like a price increase that year) but clearly some people are nervous about going, whether justified or not.  

[esmd]

Just now, Frobby said:

I think the riots clearly had an effect.   Otherwise, it’s really hard to understand why attendance was down in 2016, a year when we won 89 games and made the playoffs in an exciting race that went down to the final day.   There may have been other factors (like a price increase that year) but clearly some people are nervous about going, whether justified or not.  

Maybe some, but it pales in comparison.  And I think a fair amount of people thought we were pretenders in 2016 with our horrid starting pitching.

[Frobby]

Just now, esmd said:

Maybe some, but it pales in comparison.  And I think a fair amount of people thought we were pretenders in 2016 with our horrid starting pitching.

We were in the race the whole way.   

And nobody should be arguing that riots are the only factor, or even the biggest factor.   But it’s a significant factor.

[WarehouseChatter]

3 hours ago, thejeff07 said:

No matter how good the Orioles will ever be, when nestled in downtown Baltimore attendance will never reach its peak. I’m a huge Orioles fan who has lived 15 minutes from Baltimore my whole life, but does anybody else not like the idea of traveling to the murder capital to watch an Orioles game? I know I know the area around Camden yards isn’t West Baltimore but it’s still not a great place to take your family.

 

This might be more of a rant post, but just wanted to throw that out here. Side note, anyone wish we could just move Camden Yards to Annapolis  hahah

Baseball in general may have seen an attendance peak - it's not just the Orioles.  Winning breeds success, but we will (likely) not see the attendance figures of the early and mid 90's in Camden Yards.  I don't think it's about a fear for safety (for the most part), it's the competition of other sports, skyrocketing ticket/food & beverage costs, etc.  From 2012-2014, our attendance jumped from around 22,000 per game to 30,000 per game.  This is nowhere close to the 45,000 we had in the mid 90's.  We won't get back there.  Colorado will not get back to the 50,000+ they averaged in their early years.  Even the Yankees who won 100+ games for the first time since 2009 were still 3,000 fans short of their "new" Yankee stadium high.  

[ScGO's]

BMore4Life

[Frobby]

1 minute ago, WarehouseChatter said:

Baseball in general may have seen an attendance peak - it's not just the Orioles.  Winning breeds success, but we will (likely) not see the attendance figures of the early and mid 90's in Camden Yards.  I don't think it's about a fear for safety (for the most part), it's the competition of other sports, skyrocketing ticket/food & beverage costs, etc.  From 2012-2014, our attendance jumped from around 22,000 per game to 30,000 per game.  This is nowhere close to the 45,000 we had in the mid 90's.  We won't get back there.  Colorado will not get back to the 50,000+ they averaged in their early years.  Even the Yankees who won 100+ games for the first time since 2009 were still 3,000 fans short of their "new" Yankee stadium high.  

There’s the minor factor of a team 40 miles away that wasn’t there in the ‘90’s.   For that reason, you can’t really compare the Orioles’ attendance drop since the 90’s to other teams.   However, the majority of the Orioles’ attendance drop is attributable to losing.   

[tntoriole]

I have been to games in many if not quite all MLB cities and went to Memorial for years and Camden for years...never ever had a problem...danger exists in all cities, being aware etc... do you really think the Bronx or Chicago have a better public perception of safety?  And it doesn’t affect their attendance.  The OP is absurd...if the team plays well, attendance will improve, if not, it won’t.  Just like EVERY team.  

If people don’t want to see MLB baseball live, then stay home, but to say that cities need to be totally safe zones or parks all need to be in the suburbs or I am staying home, well, that is fine, but it is irrational, imho. 

 

[Ohfan67]

Using this logic, Pittsburg and Tampa Bay must be death traps. Miami must be equivalent to Afghanistan.

[linedrive]

I drive down from Harrisburg, Pa for 10-12 games a year and I've never had any problems... and I was there right before one of the big riots broke out. Wish I could have been there the next day when the O's played in an empty stadium.

[Dr. Unk]

The O's sucking this year is a huge reason, but to discount people not going, because of the crime, is foolish.  We can argue the numbers, but it is certainly a factor.  Ravens attendance is down too.  The anthem, poor product the last few years, better home experience, crime, cost.  They are all factors.  What percentage of each, no one will know.

[atomic]

1 hour ago, Going Underground said:

So you really have facts that judges let people off to get criminal family votes? Is that a big bloc to get voted in? Actually most judges want to convict if  evidence is there.If it gets to trail, mostly are jury trials. People get off because people on the jury dont trust the police.I have seen it.

After the riots I was looking at criminal records of people being murdered.  Lots of convictions for crimes and a lot of convictions with 12 year sentences for example with all but one day suspended.  It is the judges letting convicted felons back on the street.  I looked at about 50 people criminal records.  All the data is readily available online. if you don't believe me do your own research.  They report name and age of murder victims in the Sun.  And MD court case search will give you their crime history.  Not all murder victims are criminal but a majority are. Well at least the ones that I researched were.

You can also look at the records of people who commit heinous crimes in the area and look at their criminal history.

[atomic]

What gets me is every time this comes up you have people saying they go to less games because of crime and other people then reply it isnt a factor.  

Like people don't ever want to listen to anyone else's feelings and instead put their own feelings as fact in regards to everyone.

[Dr. Unk]

2 minutes ago, atomic said:

What gets me is every time this comes up you have people saying they go to less games because of crime and other people then reply it isnt a factor.  

Like people don't ever want to listen to anyone else's feelings and instead put their own feelings as fact in regards to everyone.

Kind of sums up this board....