Trade Bait 2021

[Aristotelian]

Apparently Means is a "target" for the Braves due to all their pitching injuries. I agree he would be a good fit for the Braves or just about any team but I have a hard time seeing what's in it for the O's. Would we even do Means for Pache? 

https://www.sportstalkatl.com/atlanta-braves-trade-candidate-john-means/

In this scenario, that team is the Baltimore Orioles. With a bunch of money coming off the books after 2021, they are in a position to break it up and rebuild quickly. What better way to do that than target a trade partner with a decent amount of prospect capital?

John Means to Atlanta just makes too much sense. 

Means is under team control until 2025, which is ideal for Atlanta financially. He is not a Cy Young threat just yet, but he can be a solid mid-rotation option with front-end potential. To add to his desirability, he may not cost as much as some other marquee names. 

[jabba72]

40 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

Apparently Means is a "target" for the Braves due to all their pitching injuries. I agree he would be a good fit for the Braves or just about any team but I have a hard time seeing what's in it for the O's. Would we even do Means for Pache? 

 

I wouldnt do a 1-1. The O's have a young CF and need pitching in return. Im guessing Atlanta would balk at including any of their top prospects anyway.

[BohKnowsBmore]

1 hour ago, Aristotelian said:

Apparently Means is a "target" for the Braves due to all their pitching injuries. I agree he would be a good fit for the Braves or just about any team but I have a hard time seeing what's in it for the O's. Would we even do Means for Pache? 

https://www.sportstalkatl.com/atlanta-braves-trade-candidate-john-means/

In this scenario, that team is the Baltimore Orioles. With a bunch of money coming off the books after 2021, they are in a position to break it up and rebuild quickly. What better way to do that than target a trade partner with a decent amount of prospect capital?

John Means to Atlanta just makes too much sense. 

Means is under team control until 2025, which is ideal for Atlanta financially. He is not a Cy Young threat just yet, but he can be a solid mid-rotation option with front-end potential. To add to his desirability, he may not cost as much as some other marquee names. 

This is such a weird sentence to read in reference to the O's

[BohKnowsBmore]

18 hours ago, Frobby said:

Before the season (and that is key here) I wrote:

Do: 4 years, $14 mm with two team options at $10 mm.

Dont do: 4 years, $20 mm with two team options at $13 mm and a $2 mm buyout.   

(Note: the 4 years I was referencing included this season and his 3 Arb years.)
 

Obviously, the price has gone way up by now due to the great start Means has had to his season.   Still, I would never assume Means was going to get $6/$12/$18 mm during his Arb years.   Just to give you a sense, Gerrit Cole got $3.75/$6.75/$13.5.  Strasburg got $3.975/$7.4/$10.4.   
 

Thanks for clarifying there. I'm not sure why my calibration for arbitration salaries is so off. Anyway, I still think something like $50/5 would be quite reasonable (although closer to the ceiling than before).

[OriolesMagic83]

On 5/5/2021 at 12:37 PM, BohKnowsBmore said:

This is such a weird sentence to read in reference to the O's

Break up what?  A 100 loss team?  WTF?

[BohKnowsBmore]

2 hours ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

Break up what?  A 100 loss team?  WTF?

And they’ve been very conspicuously in the process of rebuilding for two-and-a-half years already. It’s been broken up. 

[OriolesMagic83]

Looking forward to all the trades proposals for Means.  The O's finally get a young pitcher on the verge of being an ace and all Hangout members want to do is trade him.

[ShoelesJoe]

2 hours ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

The O's finally get a young pitcher on the verge of being an ace and all Hangout members want to do is trade him.

28 years old isn't "young" by baseball standards. By the time the Orioles are competitive again Means will be in his '30s and getting expensive. The deal that sent Bedard to Seattle for Adam Jones and Chris Tillman was one of the primary catalysts for our playoff run from 2012 to 2016, and Means is arguably more valuable right now than Bedard was then. If we could get a good return in stud prospects such a deal could easily ignite our next playoff run. 

[owknows]

4 hours ago, ShoelesJoe said:

28 years old isn't "young" by baseball standards. By the time the Orioles are competitive again Means will be in his '30s and getting expensive. The deal that sent Bedard to Seattle for Adam Jones and Chris Tillman was one of the primary catalysts for our playoff run from 2012 to 2016, and Means is arguably more valuable right now than Bedard was then. If we could get a good return in stud prospects such a deal could easily ignite our next playoff run. 

The Orioles are already competitive again.

Play Valaika at 2B and add a legitimate starter to the two you have, and this is a .550 team.

[Frobby]

2 hours ago, owknows said:

The Orioles are already competitive again.

Play Valaika at 2B and add a legitimate starter to the two you have, and this is a .550 team.

Interesting take.   I think that’s overly optimistic, but not impossible.   Gotta see a lot more hitting out of some of our younger guys, Mullins needs to remain legit, and some of our own young pitching needs to come through.   Don’t forget that Harvey and Galvis are FA at the end of the year.    

[OriolesMagic83]

7 hours ago, ShoelesJoe said:

28 years old isn't "young" by baseball standards. By the time the Orioles are competitive again Means will be in his '30s and getting expensive. The deal that sent Bedard to Seattle for Adam Jones and Chris Tillman was one of the primary catalysts for our playoff run from 2012 to 2016, and Means is arguably more valuable right now than Bedard was then. If we could get a good return in stud prospects such a deal could easily ignite our next playoff run. 

Really good pitchers age really well.  Plus Means has added velocity in the last year, so there are no warning signs that he is about to decline. 

[sportsfan8703]

Trading Castro last year pretty much was the definition of trading anyone that had value and was making more than the league minimum. Do we need to do that again?  Other than the upcoming FAs?

We don’t have to trade Means and Valdez at the deadline. I like keeping them as anchors for the rotation and bullpen. They allow other arms to slot into positions behind them. 

[Frobby]

14 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

Trading Castro last year pretty much was the definition of trading anyone that had value and was making more than the league minimum. Do we need to do that again?  Other than the upcoming FAs?

We don’t have to trade Means and Valdez at the deadline. I like keeping them as anchors for the rotation and bullpen. They allow other arms to slot into positions behind them. 

I’m not that excited about trading Means, but you have to keep an open mind about it.    It’s always just a matter of what the return would be.   

However, I’m not against having Means contribute to our next competitive teams.    I do expect the team to compete while he’s still under team control.  
 

[joelala]

8 hours ago, ShoelesJoe said:

28 years old isn't "young" by baseball standards. By the time the Orioles are competitive again Means will be in his '30s and getting expensive. The deal that sent Bedard to Seattle for Adam Jones and Chris Tillman was one of the primary catalysts for our playoff run from 2012 to 2016, and Means is arguably more valuable right now than Bedard was then. If we could get a good return in stud prospects such a deal could easily ignite our next playoff run. 

Unfortunately I agree with this. I think the extremely lack luster return from our 2018 fire sale (it’s looking like there’s a very legitimate chance we didn’t get a single ML starting caliber player) as well as the significant level of uncertainty surrounding Kjerstad’s future, we are pretty behind schedule in our rebuild. Had things gone differently, maybe we wouldn’t be as likely to trade John, but sadly if the package is multiple high ceiling prospects, I think we have to take it.  

[wildcard]

9 minutes ago, joelala said:

Unfortunately I agree with this. I think the extremely lack luster return from our 2018 fire sale (it’s looking like there’s a very legitimate chance we didn’t get a single ML starting caliber player) as well as the significant level of uncertainty surrounding Kjerstad’s future, we are pretty behind schedule in our rebuild. Had things gone differently, maybe we wouldn’t be as likely to trade John, but sadly if the package is multiple high ceiling prospects, I think we have to take it.  

If in 2022 the O's have CF Mullins, LF Hays, RF Santander, 1B/DH Mancini, 1B/DH Mountcastle, C  Rutschman maybe 2B Jones. Then they should spend on one year contracts for better SS and 3B.  Diaz and McKenna as backups. 

With Means,  Grayson, DL Hall, Kremer and Lowther    Plus the current pen I think the O's will be ready to contend.    I think it will be time to spend some money on Means 4/50,  Mancini 2/25 plus 1/8 for each of the SS and 3B.   There 2022 payroll will only be about 77m.