Norfolk catchers find something they like in the water

[NelsonCruuuuuz]

6 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

Last time I checked he was last in the league in pitch framing.  He has allowed a ton of Wild pitches and he's at 9% CS.

Do you have the link to the pitch framing stats? I’d love to see that honestly. 

[Can_of_corn]

6 hours ago, NelsonCruuuuuz said:

Do you have the link to the pitch framing stats? I’d love to see that honestly. 

https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/catcher_framing?year=2021&team=&min=q&sort=4,1

[Frobby]

3 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/catcher_framing?year=2021&team=&min=q&sort=4,1

Based on this, Sisco is actually a worse framer than Severino.   Severino has a worse total, -3 runs to -2, but he’s caught more than double the amount of innings Sisco has.   

They’ve both been pretty bad.   Someone asked about CERA - Severino has done much better there, 4.25 to 5.70.   He’s caught Means 7 times to a 1.89 ERA, Sisco has caught him twice to 1.20.   So that does not materially change the fact that Severino has the lower CERA.   Whether it actually means anything in such a small sample is another story.   
 

[DrungoHazewood]

18 hours ago, wildcard said:

How long can this go on?

Chance Sisco    180/255/220/474

Norfolk catchers:

Austin Wynns   344/432/563/995

Brett Cumberland   320.404/540/944

Sisco has an option.

We know beyond any shadow of any doubts that 30-year-old Austin Wynns is a .600 or .650 OPS hitter in the majors.  Cumberland is a little harder to gauge, but that's because he's 26 and has never played in the majors and has very limited time above A ball.  Which says something by itself. 

But hey, if you want to make sweeping judgments based on 35 at bats go for it, I know that's your thing.

[DrungoHazewood]

6 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Based on this, Sisco is actually a worse framer than Severino.   Severino has a worse total, -3 runs to -2, but he’s caught more than double the amount of innings Sisco has.   

They’ve both been pretty bad.   Someone asked about CERA - Severino has done much better there, 4.25 to 5.70.   He’s caught Means 7 times to a 1.89 ERA, Sisco has caught him twice to 1.20.   So that does not materially change the fact that Severino has the lower CERA.   Whether it actually means anything in such a small sample is another story.   
 

CERA is like dWAR.  You can probably tease something meaningful out of it, but it's usually just not worth it because most people stop listening after seeing the first misleading number and forming unfounded conclusions.

[scOtt]

17 hours ago, bpilktree said:

Severino seems to me to be a guy that could be a great leader to a team that was good.  He shows fire at times but gets very lackluster when things are not going the team or his way.  Machado did same type thing were he didn’t give full effort on the bad teams.  

Difference was Manny's lackluster effort was still better than than most average players' BEST effort.

[scOtt]

19 hours ago, wildcard said:

How long can this go on?

 

Sorry, it's my job...

rage

[HowAboutThat]

Logically, it seems the Boss must feel at this time that Severino is better than the alternatives, and Sisco has undiscovered upside that only needs time to reach.  No other explanation is logical, unless he really IS actively trying to sabotage the team, which I can’t accept.
I disagree with both attitudes, and would much prefer to see what the other guys offer.

[webbrick2010]

19 hours ago, vab said:

I think Sisco could be a pretty good hitter with regular playing time. He hit well in the minors but he's one of these guys who like to look over a lot of pitches. Those guys tend not to do well coming off the bench every third or fourth day. You don't hit because you're not playing regularly. You're not playing regularly because you don't hit. Catch-22. 

He can't hit curve balls, even bad hanging ones

[Can_of_corn]

19 minutes ago, webbrick2010 said:

He can't hit curve balls, even bad hanging ones

It's just the weirdest thing.

According to this Sisco is in the positive against curve balls in 2021.

2020

2019

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

37 minutes ago, Philip said:

Logically, it seems the Boss must feel at this time that Severino is better than the alternatives, and Sisco has undiscovered upside that only needs time to reach.  No other explanation is logical, unless he really IS actively trying to sabotage the team, which I can’t accept.
I disagree with both attitudes, and would much prefer to see what the other guys offer.

Maybe this experiment will continue, but I say by the first week of June Elias will make a move at catcher if Sisco and Severino keeps playing this awful. 

[Can_of_corn]

5 minutes ago, OsFanSinceThe80s said:

Maybe this experiment will continue, but I say by the first week of June Elias will make a move at catcher if Sisco and Severino keeps playing this awful. 

I don't think it's an experiment.

He's just filling in innings until he is willing to start Adley's clock.

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

Just now, Can_of_corn said:

I don't think it's an experiment.

He's just filling in innings until he is willing to start Adley's clock.

I didn't necessarily mean experiment, but giving a chance for Sisco or Severino to step up and become the backup catcher after Adley arrives. I'll be surprised if either of them are still on the team by 2023 with their play behind the plate. 

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, OsFanSinceThe80s said:

I didn't necessarily mean experiment, but giving a chance for Sisco or Severino to step up and become the backup catcher after Adley arrives. I'll be surprised if either of them are still on the team by 2023 with their play behind the plate. 

I think if that was the case the workload would be closer to 50/50.

[HowAboutThat]

19 minutes ago, OsFanSinceThe80s said:

Maybe this experiment will continue, but I say by the first week of June Elias will make a move at catcher if Sisco and Severino keeps playing this awful. 

That’s the thing, each catcher has clearly revealed himself. I don’t think Mike is just using them as warm bodies, because there are better warm bodies in the minors. The only logical conclusion, the only real options at all, actually, or that he’s either hoping that one or both of them will suddenly find the magic elixir that turns them from horrible into acceptable, or he is actively trying to sabotage the team, And I just refuse to believe that. It’s not impossible, but it is so unlikely as to be impossible.

But why they continue to play without a change is one of the great mysteries of the 21st century.

I fully expect whatever happens with AR, that neither of them will be back next season, but they shouldn’t be here now. And it is my hope that they will both depart soon.I fully expect whatever happens with AR, that neither of them will be back next season, but they shouldn’t be here now. And it is my hope that they will both depart soon.

Edited May 21, 2021 by Philip