Kyle Stowers called up

[Can_of_corn]

13 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

I think calling up Hall was exactly that ….unless it was to show Hall how far away he is from being ready. Forfeiting a game to show a kid he’s not ready is stupid IMO

You could argue that they didn’t forfeit….but we certainly didn’t give our guys the best chance to win.

I think it was calling up a pitcher on the 40 to eat some innings.

[Just Regular]

Vavra's been reactivated and Martin sent out, so tomorrow will begin choices between Stowers and Vavra for the Trey Mancini emeritus seat.

Unless both are Pipped for Gunnar and we don't mess with the most common defensive alignment.

Edited August 22, 2022 by Just Regular

[Aristotelian]

2 minutes ago, Just Regular said:

Vavra's been reactivated and Martin sent out, so tomorrow will begin choices between Stowers and Vavra for the Trey Mancini emeritus seat.

Unless both are Pipped for Gunnar and we don't mess with the most common defensive alignment.

We're facing Cease, a tough RHP. Sneaky move would be to give one of the RHB starters a day of rest and start both of the lefties.

[DrungoHazewood]

36 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

Pham is an .800+ OPS player in the 74 at bats since the trade. He was had for a PTBNL. I guarantee it’s not for a prospect that they will miss.

He's 34 and since the start of the 2020 season Pham has a .709 OPS, and a -4 defender.  He was acquired for a PTBNL because he's not an .800 OPS player.  In 1150 PAs he's been worth two wins, or about one per full season.

If a month ago your crystal ball said Pham was a better acquisition than calling up Stowers, good for you.  It wasn't based on any real evidence.

[DrungoHazewood]

45 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

So if you can’t throw enough strikes at AAA or strike out at too high of a rate …why would it be a good idea to be matched up against a higher level of competition? 
 

It just wouldn’t….if you can’t dominate at the level your at a promotion makes no sense. The Os are left desperate because they didn’t address their needs at the trade deadline.

I could put together a list of approximately 5,000 major league players who ended up with good careers who didn't dominate the minors. No exaggeration whatsoever.

[DrungoHazewood]

48 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

So if you can’t throw enough strikes at AAA or strike out at too high of a rate …why would it be a good idea to be matched up against a higher level of competition? 
 

It just wouldn’t….if you can’t dominate at the level your at a promotion makes no sense. The Os are left desperate because they didn’t address their needs at the trade deadline.

Show me a team that had a 24-year-old .900 OPS player in the minors at a position of need that refused to call him up until he fixed all his flaws.  I'd like to see a team that actually operates in this manner.

Do you remember Russell Branyan?  11-year career in the majors.  If the Indians had waited to call him up until he'd gotten his strikeouts down to some arbitrarily low level he'd still be waiting for that debut at 46.  What you're asking for just doesn't happen, and it doesn't matter because you don't judge players on the basis of their just last four PAs or batters faced.

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, mikezpen said:

Last nite, Stowers' plate discipline made Odor's look like Ted Williams'. I don't think there's any way he's ready for the Show. I wasn't crazy about their bringing him up here in the first place.

It’s just crazy to judge a guy based on a bad game or two. Stowers had an 11.1% walk rate in AAA this year.  Odor has a 6.7% walk rate this year, 5.9% for his career.  Stowers has 500 PA in AAA.  He’s as ready as he’s going to be.   I’m not saying he’ll be a successful major leaguer, but it’s time to start finding out.  

[Hazmat]

40 minutes ago, Frobby said:

It’s just crazy to judge a guy based on a bad game or two. Stowers had an 11.1% walk rate in AAA this year.  Odor has a 6.7% walk rate this year, 5.9% for his career.  Stowers has 500 PA in AAA.  He’s as ready as he’s going to be.   I’m not saying he’ll be a successful major leaguer, but it’s time to start finding out.  

Agreed. I haven't read through every page of this thread but has anyone mentioned that Mullins K'd 3 times last night?  Where can I read about the concern over his effectiveness based on 1 game?

[Roll Tide]

1 hour ago, DrungoHazewood said:

He's 34 and since the start of the 2020 season Pham has a .709 OPS, and a -4 defender.  He was acquired for a PTBNL because he's not an .800 OPS player.  In 1150 PAs he's been worth two wins, or about one per full season.

If a month ago your crystal ball said Pham was a better acquisition than calling up Stowers, good for you.  It wasn't based on any real evidence.

Phillips is worse …he has 1 2.4 WAR season in 2021 but beyond that he’s really been bad. I really don’t understand how you get 2.4 WAR for hitting .206/.300/.427. 
 

here is what I can tell you, Pham has had some key hits against us with both teams. 
 

FWIW, Odor who is loved and valued by the Orioles has a -.4 WAR. While I don’t like him and wish they would’ve picked up something better he’s had some key hits to tie or win games. So IMO, it’s a flawed stat. But, I’m sure you will tell me why it’s perfect?? 

[Roll Tide]

1 hour ago, DrungoHazewood said:

I could put together a list of approximately 5,000 major league players who ended up with good careers who didn't dominate the minors. No exaggeration whatsoever.

What’s the relevance to a player being called up because the office screwed up and didn’t help the team at the trading deadline, when the team has lost 100 games each of the past 2 seasons? They could’ve done better and I don’t have anything against either player. 

[Roll Tide]

1 hour ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Show me a team that had a 24-year-old .900 OPS player in the minors at a position of need that refused to call him up until he fixed all his flaws.  I'd like to see a team that actually operates in this manner.

Do you remember Russell Branyan?  11-year career in the majors.  If the Indians had waited to call him up until he'd gotten his strikeouts down to some arbitrarily low level he'd still be waiting for that debut at 46.  What you're asking for just doesn't happen, and it doesn't matter because you don't judge players on the basis of their just last four PAs or batters faced.

I had my opinion before he had those plate appearances and said so here …. but whatever makes you right bro’ 

Edited August 22, 2022 by Roll Tide

[Roll Tide]

23 minutes ago, Hazmat said:

Agreed. I haven't read through every page of this thread but has anyone mentioned that Mullins K'd 3 times last night?  Where can I read about the concern over his effectiveness based on 1 game?

We have a bunch of guys not having quality ABs. Cedric is definitely one lately

[DrungoHazewood]

14 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

Phillips is worse …he has 1 2.4 WAR season in 2021 but beyond that he’s really been bad. I really don’t understand how you get 2.4 WAR for hitting .206/.300/.427. 
 

here is what I can tell you, Pham has had some key hits against us with both teams. 
 

FWIW, Odor who is loved and valued by the Orioles has a -.4 WAR. While I don’t like him and wish they would’ve picked up something better he’s had some key hits to tie or win games. So IMO, it’s a flawed stat. But, I’m sure you will tell me why it’s perfect?? 

If you want to learn about WAR you should go to bb-ref or Fangraphs, where they break down all the components that add up to the final total.  Phillips was a 2.4-win player mainly because he was a +11 fielder in about half-time play (by DRS), which makes him one of the better defenders in baseball.

No, I'm not going to tell you anything is perfect.

[DrungoHazewood]

13 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

What’s the relevance to a player being called up because the office screwed up and didn’t help the team at the trading deadline, when the team has lost 100 games each of the past 2 seasons? They could’ve done better and I don’t have anything against either player. 

You're trying to argue that the Orioles shouldn't call up someone who is playing very well in AAA because he's flawed in some way.  I was just pointing out that almost every promotion involves weighing strengths and weaknesses and making a judgment as to whether or not the player is likely to be better than whomever he would replace.

[Roll Tide]

1 minute ago, DrungoHazewood said:

You're trying to argue that the Orioles shouldn't call up someone who is playing very well in AAA because he's flawed in some way.  I was just pointing out that almost every promotion involves weighing strengths and weaknesses and making a judgment as to whether or not the player is likely to be better than whomever he would replace.

I mainly feel Hall wasn’t ready….Stowers should’ve been up a while ago to get his feet on the ground outside a pennant race.