O's not carrying a long man on the roster

[waroriole]

2 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Baumann just threw 5 innings on Monday and if Gunnar had not messed up two double play balls  playing 2nd he would have only given up one run.

Like I said, Zimmerman is the only one who’s been able to get ML hitters out. 

[wildcard]

16 minutes ago, waroriole said:

Like I said, Zimmerman is the only one who’s been able to get ML hitters out. 

Uh?

[waroriole]

38 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Uh?

Not sure where the disconnect is. I don’t think 3 ER in 5 IP as a career highlight is showing an ability to get out ML hitters. Do you?

[RZNJ]

1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

So when a pitcher improves it's because of the coaches but when he doesn't it's his fault?

That the board consensus?

All he said was that Hall would be starting if he had pitched better, which seems sensible to me.  How do you get from there to your post about coaches and board consensus?

[wildcard]

20 minutes ago, waroriole said:

Not sure where the disconnect is. I don’t think 3 ER in 5 IP as a career highlight is showing an ability to get out ML hitters. Do you?

I think  I watched the game and 2 of the runs were not Baumann fault and to say they are is just ignoring the truth.  I don't expect Baumann to cover balls at 2B.  

Sometimes scoring  rules are not fair.  

Edited September 11, 2022 by wildcard

[waroriole]

4 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I think  I watched the game and 2 of the runs were not Baumann fault and to say they are is just ignoring the truth.  I don't expect Baumann to cover balls at 2B.  

Sometimes scoring  rules are not fair.  

Baumann put runners on the corners with one out in each of those situations. Gunnar might’ve misplayed them, but they’re rightfully earned runs. Also, we’re talking about one game where he wasn’t completely terrible. Get back to me when he’s done something consistently. 

[wildcard]

11 minutes ago, waroriole said:

Baumann put runners on the corners with one out in each of those situations. Gunnar might’ve misplayed them, but they’re rightfully earned runs. Also, we’re talking about one game where he wasn’t completely terrible. Get back to me when he’s done something consistently. 

OK, we will talk later.

A pitcher puts a guy on 1st.   He is pulled and the next pitcher allows a homer.  The runner that was on 1st is still charged to the first pitcher.  I have never thought that was fair.

There are baseball scoring rules and then there is what fair.  They don't always meet.

Edited September 11, 2022 by wildcard

[Frobby]

24 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I think  I watched the game and 2 of the runs were not Baumann fault and to say they are is just ignoring the truth.  I don't expect Baumann to cover balls at 2B.  

Sometimes scoring  rules are not fair.  

Baumann was okay on Monday.  The issue is, can he do it consistently?   In the past, he has not.  One decent start doesn’t change that.  But, I’m fine with him being back and hope he’ll perform well when called upon. 

[Just Regular]

Baumann now for me is more or less where Kremer and Akin were at the end of 2020.

A good month and I'll be curious come April.    Obviously the 2023 bar to be up on the mound for the team will be higher to clear.

The 2023 Orioles will probably repeat the 2022 Orioles feature of having one qualifier for the league ERA title (162 innings).    3.5 weeks to go second place still in the 90's, though Wells-Kremer-Bradish should all hit triple digits in the next couple turns.

[DrungoHazewood]

6 hours ago, wildcard said:

Both Watkins and Baumann have been optioned.   So when  Lyles  did not have it there was no long man to turn to.  Pitchers are optioned for 15 days  unless they they can replace an injured player.   Just sayin'.

In all of 2022 there is one reliever (Jaime Barria) who has thrown 3+ innings of relief at least 10 times.  There are only 10 pitchers with five relief appearances of 3+ innings. 

The Sammy Stewart role is basically extinct. Nobody carries a pitcher whose role is to come in and pitch most of the rest of the game when the starter gets knocked out in the 2nd or 3rd.

Edited September 11, 2022 by DrungoHazewood

[Ohfan67]

2 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

So when a pitcher improves it's because of the coaches but when he doesn't it's his fault?

That the board consensus?

You've never read comments like that from me. And I didn't imply that. And I definitely do not represent a board consensus or anything close to it.

 

I was replying to a poster that wanted the O's to use Hall as a long reliever. I think it's clear that the Orioles had hoped that Hall would be effective this year and help the major league team. The only reason Hall hasn't pitched more ML innings this year is his performance. The only reason Hall is not being used as a starter or opener is his performance. I think he is currently on the roster more because the Orioles think that will help him long term and less because they think Hall is going to help them in the next few weeks. You have been a strong advocate that players can learn and develop in the major leagues. I think that's what the Orioles are trying to do with Hall. Anyway, I give the Orioles kudos for getting a lot out of a bunch of let's say "unheralded" pitchers this year. I hope it's not a fluke and is sustainable. But of course most of the improvement is due to the pitchers ability to learn and change from coaching, video, data, etc. The Orioles may be developing the ability to better identify pitchers that they can work with. But in the end it is the players who improve or not. And Hall needs to improve his command/control to be more successful. That's ultimately on him. 

[Can_of_corn]

6 minutes ago, Ohfan67 said:

You've never read comments like that from me. And I didn't imply that. And I definitely do not represent a board consensus or anything close to it.

 

I was replying to a poster that wanted the O's to use Hall as a long reliever. I think it's clear that the Orioles had hoped that Hall would be effective this year and help the major league team. The only reason Hall hasn't pitched more ML innings this year is his performance. The only reason Hall is not being used as a starter or opener is his performance. I think he is currently on the roster more because the Orioles think that will help him long term and less because they think Hall is going to help them in the next few weeks. You have been a strong advocate that players can learn and develop in the major leagues. I think that's what the Orioles are trying to do with Hall. Anyway, I give the Orioles kudos for getting a lot out of a bunch of let's say "unheralded" pitchers this year. I hope it's not a fluke and is sustainable. But of course most of the improvement is due to the pitchers ability to learn and change from coaching, video, data, etc. The Orioles may be developing the ability to better identify pitchers that they can work with. But in the end it is the players who improve or not. And Hall needs to improve his command/control to be more successful. That's ultimately on him. 

I said board consensus because I didn't want to single you out.

I find it interesting that when a player improves folks here tend to cite the coaching but when a Hall or Mountcastle struggles it is on the player.

[RZNJ]

15 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I said board consensus because I didn't want to single you out.

I find it interesting that when a player improves folks here tend to cite the coaching but when a Hall or Mountcastle struggles it is on the player.

Whether you singled him out or lumped him in with some imagined group, his post has nothing to do with your retort.  That’s the only strange thing besides you trying to attribute some mantra to “the board”.

He didn’t mention coaching. He didn’t blame Hall for not improving.  He simply stated that he would have gotten a better opportunity if he had pitched better.