Ohtani Rental?

[Bemorewins]

9 minutes ago, RVAOsFan said:

I was thinking about this Ohtani thing and what he alone would do for our World Series odds.  Kind of made me think, I wonder with Peters health if John Angelos or his Mother might tell Elias to be a little more aggressive this year than they planned on to try and get Peter a ring.

I feel like that would be a normal approach from a family that owned a professional sports team, but with this dysfunctional family, who knows. 

From everything that I have heard, Peter has some cognitive issues related to advance aging that would probably prevent him from being able to interpret his surroundings in a way that he once could/would.

[RVAOsFan]

10 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Where would you draw the line on an Ohtani deal?

No guys: Adley, Gunnar, Westburg, Cowser, Holliday, Mayo, Kjerstad, GRod

I think anyone else is game as a center piece and no more than 2 top 100ish guys.  If I am making this deal I would rather deal more quantity from our depth than top tier.

Example: Basallo, Norby, Stowers,Mateo and a lottery ticket if required 

[Bemorewins]

From what I saw/interpreted from Kubatko's appearance on MLB network (I know consider the source...lol), he made a couple of points that stood out to me about Ohtani. He made reference to some comments that Elias made to them (Orioles reporters) "behind clothes doors" that made it seem that the Orioles merely did a very light/exploratory phone call just to do more due diligence than anything else. He said something to the effect that "you never say never" but the chances of an Orioles Ohtani acquisition were remote at best. 

He seemed to talk up similar talking points to some posters here (almost as if he has an account here and post). Very apprehensive to trade prospects, etc. (Even made reference to Glen Davis trade which I thought was weird as Elias was a child when Davis was acquired by the O's. So, I'm pretty confident that the Davis trade is in no way shape or form a factor that influences Elias in any way whatsoever.) 

One thing he did say that I found note worthy is that the org appears to be only interested in acquiring a starter who is a "difference maker" not just a middle/back of the rotation type guy. If true this may eliminate some options that people/posters/fans are higher on.

Seemed from Kubatko's interview with Phillips that the O's may be more inclined to go the reliever acquisition route, and limited the acquisition cost. Though he acknowledged that there is an organizational log jam and not all players/prospects will be able to play for the O's. He even made reference to the Andrew Miller trade in terms of an example of an impact reliever acquisition. (Again something that happen almost a decade ago. So I'm not sure that has tremendous relevance either. I could be wrong. Seems like the guy likes old Orioles references though...lol)

Interview here if anyone wants to check it out. I hope this is not a copyright violation or against the posting rules. If so, somebody let me know and I want do it again.

 

[waroriole]

John probably can’t even afford the rest of Ohtani’s salary. 

[Bemorewins]

18 minutes ago, RVAOsFan said:

No guys: Adley, Gunnar, Westburg, Cowser, Holliday, Mayo, Kjerstad, GRod

I think anyone else is game as a center piece and no more than 2 top 100ish guys.  If I am making this deal I would rather deal more quantity from our depth than top tier.

Example: Basallo, Norby, Stowers,Mateo and a lottery ticket if required 

I agree with almost your entire list. Though I think Westburg and Ortiz are almost interchangeable. So if you had to give up one and keep the other, I would be good with that. Also, though I would prefer to keep Mayo definitely, I may be willing to at least entertain the idea, if it would get me over the hump and make it happen.

Lastly, Angels probably don't have much interest in Basallo. There only 2 highly rated prospects are both catchers. And I am pretty sure that they do not want Mateo at all. We don't even want him. If they are trading Ohtani, they are already going to take heat as an org. I can't imagine the ire of their fans if he (a pretty much useless/negative value player) was a part of the trade. You might have to sub Urias or Mountcastle (maybe both?) in for Mateo? And maybe Ortiz or Westburg in for Basallo to make a realistic kind of deal.

[RVAOsFan]

4 minutes ago, Bemorewins said:

I agree with almost your entire list. Though I think Westburg and Ortiz are almost interchangeable. So if you had to give up one and keep the other, I would be good with that. Also, though I would prefer to keep Mayo definitely, I may be willing to at least entertain the idea, if it would get me over the hump and make it happen.

Lastly, Angels probably don't have much interest in Basallo. There only 2 highly rated prospects are both catchers. And I am pretty sure that they do not want Mateo at all. We don't even want him. If they are trading Ohtani, they are already going to take heat as an org. I can't imagine the ire of their fans if he (a pretty much useless/negative value player) was a part of the trade. You might have to sub Urias or Mountcastle (maybe both?) in for Mateo? And maybe Ortiz or Westburg in for Basallo to make a realistic kind of deal.

I agree, we could afford to trade Westburg or Ortiz but honestly I wanted them both on my NO list.  If Gunnar misses time with his back issue Westburg and Ortiz should both be getting playing time. 

[bpilktree67]

The Angels are 3 out in the Wild card they are not going to sell now.  They are playing well and other teams are falling back.  They have hoped the Mariners and just one back of the Yanks.  

[Bemorewins]

6 minutes ago, RVAOsFan said:

I agree, we could afford to trade Westburg or Ortiz but honestly I wanted them both on my NO list.  If Gunnar misses time with his back issue Westburg and Ortiz should both be getting playing time. 

If Gunnar misses significant, we are seriously screwed. IMO neither Westburg nor Ortiz have the talent, nor are the equivalents of Gunnar. Ortiz may be able to give us as good or even probably better defense. But there will be a big time drop off in the offensive production IMO. I know both (Westburg and Ortiz) have gaudy AAA numbers. But we have yet to see a direct correlation between what any of our prospects (hitters or pitchers) have done at AAA and what they do at the Major League level. The talent gap in the two levels of competition is massive.

[Billy F-Face3]

Untouchables...

Mullins, Adley, Gunnar, Grayson, Jackson Holliday.

I find Cowser/Kjerstad to be interchangeable, so 1 of them is on the table and the other becomes a player to keep.

Higly valued approacching Untouchable (but can be persuaded for the right price) -Westburg, Santander, & Hays

Everyone else is negotiable depending on the return. 

"Everybody’s got a price!" -Million Dollar Man Ted DiBiase LOL

[DrungoHazewood]

30 minutes ago, Bemorewins said:

Even made reference to Glen Davis trade which I thought was weird as Elias was a child when Davis was acquired by the O's. So, I'm pretty confident that the Davis trade is in no way shape or form a factor that influences Elias in any way whatsoever.

I was a child when they traded Doug DeCinces for Disco Dan Ford and I still wake up sweating in the night, crying out "oh dear God no!"

[Sports Guy]

16 minutes ago, Billy F-Face3 said:

Untouchables...

Mullins, Adley, Gunnar, Grayson, Jackson Holliday.

I find Cowser/Kjerstad to be interchangeable, so 1 of them is on the table and the other becomes a player to keep.

Higly valued approacching Untouchable (but can be persuaded for the right price) -Westburg, Santander, & Hays

Everyone else is negotiable depending on the return. 

"Everybody’s got a price!" -Million Dollar Man Ted DiBiase LOL

Westburg over Mayo is extremely head scratching.

[Orioles Jim]

57 minutes ago, Bemorewins said:

From everything that I have heard, Peter has some cognitive issues related to advance aging that would probably prevent him from being able to interpret his surroundings in a way that he once could/would.

While it’s certainly a sticky topic, I know that Pat Bowlen had Alzheimer’s (and died 3 years later) at the time of the Broncos last SB victory but it was reported that he was aware that his team had won the championship:

 

https://www.milehighreport.com/platform/amp/2016/2/10/10960884/pat-bowlen-aware-the-denver-broncos-won-super-bowl-50

[Billy F-Face3]

The direction this thread has taken tempts me to create a thread about trades or acquisitions of big names that you were against when they happened.

For example, even before I saw the result on the field, I never liked the acquisitions of Sammy Sosa, Vladimir Guerrero, Ubaldo Jimenez, or Albert Belle at those stages of their careers. I felt their best years (or year in Jimenz's case) was behind them and they were over priced. I just didn't agree with how the resources were used and felt they were washed up.

I do not feel that same way about Shohei Ohtani. I think he's going to fulfill the value you always hoped and intended to get when you acquired him. He's in the prime of his career and probably has at least 3 more stellar years. Not to mention, being one of the greatest baseball players to ever set foot on a baseball field anywhere in the world. 

[Billy F-Face3]

7 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Westburg over Mayo is extremely head scratching.

Actually that could be an either / or scenario. But I'll admit to being a Westburg fanboy and I find it alot easier give him a role on the team with the way the roster is constructed than I do Mayo. Unless they start playing Mayo constantly at 1B in the minor leagues, he is a 3rd baseman. And the problem with that is that unless you're playing Holliday at 2nd Base, Gunnar is the franchise 3rd basemen if Holliday is the shortstop. Which leaves 2nd Base open for Westburg.

[Sports Guy]

4 minutes ago, Billy F-Face3 said:

Actually that could be an either / or scenario. But I'll admit to being a Westburg fanboy and I find it alot easier give him a role on the team with the way the roster is constructed than I do Mayo. Unless they start playing Mayo constantly at 1B in the minor leagues, he is a 3rd baseman. And the problem with that is that unless you're playing Holliday at 2nd Base, Gunnar is the franchise 3rd basemen if Holliday is the shortstop. Which leaves 2nd Base open for Westburg.

Mayo has been arguably the most impressive offensive prospect in baseball this year. They can and will find a role for him and first base is the most likely.  He’s not blocked.